People in China adopting custom-made white babies?

[Minoosh]

I posted this is another thread but it was somewhat OT. The thread referred to Chinese scientists' mixed success with genetic experiments involving embryos. I want to know if anyone has heard of this practice:

I have a friend whose Chinese GF's job is finding American egg donors and American sperm donors, supervising in vitro fertilization and arranging for a surrogate to gestate the embryos who are then sent to China for adoption.

He hadn't thought much about why a Chinese would want this but mentioned some wanted blond-haired blue-eyed children. I thought maybe as a novelty or status symbol.

Given the expense, they must have money and to me this seemed a lot like building an infant from spare parts to sell abroad. It has no parents, no one with biological or emotional investment in the kid. When I try to envision all this I see the woman getting passports (?) for newborns for export. Though sending the surrogate to China on "vacation" might make more sense.

If that's the case, is anyone adopting babies at all, or could the Chinese be harvesting not only embryos but fetuses - even viable fetuses - for genetic manipulation? It occurred to me maybe they wanted different-race babies to have a wider gene pool to manipulate. Is it sick that my mind goes therem or could rich Chinese really be pining for a blond-haired, blue-eyed child to love? Has anyone else heard of it? I haven't been able to find reports of this elsewhere. It sounds ethically dodgy but I doubt that's much of a barrier.

 

[TragicMonkey]

Sounds like a 21st century version of the ancient 'blood libel' story to me. I'd take it with an oceansworth of salt.

 

[Minoosh]

Sounds like a 21st century version of the ancient 'blood libel' story to me. I'd take it with an oceansworth of salt.

I'm the one coming up with the nefarious theories. My friend just said she got all the baby-making parts and processes fired up, then those children were adopted by Chinese. Even under that scenario, she's making babies with spare parts and shipping them to China for adoption. Which doesn't sound great.

Such a kid would be an oddity in China, and everything I've heard suggests Chinese think they are a superior race, and IMO the kids would have a tough time of it. So the adoption part sounds weird. And it would be expensive, and donors can be chosen for specific traits. Which maybe isn't immoral in itself.

My thoughts came up in the context of China's research manipulating genes in human embryos. Then it went worse places. Like using the kids in nature vs. nurture experiments. I know it sounds out there. But this is China, which has different values than the West.

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

Chinese want custom, one-off handwork from our brightest minds. Americans want mass-produced bulk products created by peasants. This is just another example.

 

[marplots]

On the plus side, at least we are still selling some products to the Chinese.

 

[Minoosh]

On the plus side, at least we are still selling some products to the Chinese.

Thanks - I hadn't considered that potential upside. The whole setup still sounds ... unethical? Wrong? Bad?

When I looked for puppies on the Internet I knew what I wanted. I ordered her. I didn't implant a lady dachshund with multiple zygotes and selectively abort to optimize the litter. She already existed. And is not a U.S. citizen.

Extrapolating this metaphor, she had an owner. The breeder sold her. Now I own her. Who owns these kids? They are born without relatives and possibly no one caring about them at all. Also, all this would have to be OK with the Chinese Communist Party. U.S. citizens immigrating to China have to go through a process. And how does a non-relative who paid for a child to be created obtain a U.S. passport to travel on?

If I were running this business I'd sent the surrogate mom to China as a tourist. Nobody even has to know she is pregnant. Due to IVF procedures she likely is carrying more than one embryo. I don't think there's any law against her taking a vacation in China, then having an abortion so scientists can experiment on the embryos. This would be preferable to some other outcomes I have envisioned. Maybe they're going to wealthy pedophiles with fetishes about white children. Or maybe viable fetuses are being used in genetics research. (White=different gene pool than Han Chinese).

I know this sounds far-fetched, but deliberately creating and adopting a child who is likely to be exposed to extreme racism also sounds far-fetched to me. Maybe someone is pining for a child and simply knows that they want a white child, like I wanted a dachshund knockoff. It still sounds something like human trafficking. Thoughts, anyone?

 

[cullennz]

I'm the one coming up with the nefarious theories. My friend just said she got all the baby-making parts and processes fired up, then those children were adopted by Chinese. Even under that scenario, she's making babies with spare parts and shipping them to China for adoption. Which doesn't sound great.

Such a kid would be an oddity in China, and everything I've heard suggests Chinese think they are a superior race, and IMO the kids would have a tough time of it. So the adoption part sounds weird. And it would be expensive, and donors can be chosen for specific traits. Which maybe isn't immoral in itself.

My thoughts came up in the context of China's research manipulating genes in human embryos. Then it went worse places. Like using the kids in nature vs. nurture experiments. I know it sounds out there. But this is China, which has different values than the West.

Not these days

I'd also like to see some evidence for the so called white babies

 

[Wolrab]

Hand made, one off. I could do that....again and again.

 

[Minoosh]

Not these days

I'd also like to see some evidence for the so called white babies

All I know is what my friend told me and he hasn't asked a lot of questions. He's in love. He told me she worked for an adoption agency and supervised the process of creating children from donor sperm, donor egg, in vitro fertilization and implantation in a surrogate. I asked "why" and he said, "I don't know, maybe they just want a blond-haired, blue-eyed child." Then he said something about going to college in the U.S. which didn't make much sense to me. If it's OK with the U.S. I suppose an anchor baby could be manufactured here, become a U.S. citizen and be issued a passport to go to its adoptive parents. I just don't know that process.

I'm not sure what you mean by "evidence for the so called white babies." Pictures of Chinese couples with white-looking children? I've tried Googling this and predictably got a bunch of hits that went in the other direction - Americans adopting Chinese infants. Maybe this is a well-established practice; I've just never heard of it.

 

[cullennz]

All I know is what my friend told me and he hasn't asked a lot of questions. He's in love. He told me she worked for an adoption agency and supervised the process of creating children from donor sperm, donor egg, in vitro fertilization and implantation in a surrogate. I asked "why" and he said, "I don't know, maybe they just want a blond-haired, blue-eyed child." Then he said something about going to college in the U.S. which didn't make much sense to me. If it's OK with the U.S. I suppose an anchor baby could be manufactured here, become a U.S. citizen and be issued a passport to go to its adoptive parents. I just don't know that process.

I'm not sure what you mean by "evidence for the so called white babies." Pictures of Chinese couples with white-looking children? I've tried Googling this and predictably got a bunch of hits that went in the other direction - Americans adopting Chinese infants. Maybe this is a well-established practice; I've just never heard of it.

I think they are talking pants. Mainly because it sounds like bollocks. Ask them for proof of this production line and then I might listen.

There are plenty million enough mixed race babies from intermarriage

 

[marplots]

I think they are talking pants. Mainly because it sounds like bollocks. Ask them for proof of this production line and then I might listen.

There are plenty million enough mixed race babies from intermarriage

It's in the news now and again. Google "China White."

 

[cullennz]

It's in the news now and again. Google "China White."

Lol

 

[Darth Rotor]

Wait a sec. Madonna and Angelina Jolie made a big deal about adopting black babies from Africa.
What the heck is wrong with people in China wanting to do something similar?
If you have the money, a whole lot of things are possible.
Rich people often do curious things with their money that the rest of us don't consider.

 

[Minoosh]

It's in the news now and again. Google "China White."

That will make me want to do heroin.

ETA: I'm not joking.

 

[Minoosh]

I think they are talking pants. Mainly because it sounds like bollocks. Ask them for proof of this production line and then I might listen.

If anyone is talking pants (whatever that is), it's me. I'm the one who has imagined some questionable scenarios. Separate out what he's saying vs. what I'm speculating. He's just saying his GF supervises the creation of babies for export to China.

Wait a sec. Madonna and Angelina Jolie made a big deal about adopting black babies from Africa.
What the heck is wrong with people in China wanting to do something similar?

I didn't say there was anything wrong with it. I'm wondering if other people have heard of it. Also: If Madonna or Angelina Jolie abused their adopted kids it might come out in the media, or their kids might grow up to write tell-all books. This is not the culture in China. And high-profile U.S. celebs who adopt third world babies are finding them in orphanages, not commissioning a new person. AFAIK.

If you have the money, a whole lot of things are possible.
Rich people often do curious things with their money that the rest of us don't consider.

I wasn't questioning the fact that rich people do odd things with money. In the past I had heard or read that racial minorities in (relatively) genetically homogeneous populations sometimes face stigma, and that some large proportion of Han Chinese think they belong to the world's most desirable sub-population in the human race. So I wondered why Chinese would go through this much expense to adopt a white infant, specifically from the U.S. I wonder about the logistics as much as anything else. If the children are born here they are U.S. citizens being expatriated with no ability to consent.

This doesn't have to be nefarious, but I don't think it's a joke either. I'd like to learn more about the practice - how it's accomplished, how widespread it is and whether the children have any kind of advocate.

I hoped someone who knew something would post.

 

[Cainkane1]

I posted this is another thread but it was somewhat OT. The thread referred to Chinese scientists' mixed success with genetic experiments involving embryos. I want to know if anyone has heard of this practice:

I have a friend whose Chinese GF's job is finding American egg donors and American sperm donors, supervising in vitro fertilization and arranging for a surrogate to gestate the embryos who are then sent to China for adoption.

He hadn't thought much about why a Chinese would want this but mentioned some wanted blond-haired blue-eyed children. I thought maybe as a novelty or status symbol.

Given the expense, they must have money and to me this seemed a lot like building an infant from spare parts to sell abroad. It has no parents, no one with biological or emotional investment in the kid. When I try to envision all this I see the woman getting passports (?) for newborns for export. Though sending the surrogate to China on "vacation" might make more sense.

If that's the case, is anyone adopting babies at all, or could the Chinese be harvesting not only embryos but fetuses - even viable fetuses - for genetic manipulation? It occurred to me maybe they wanted different-race babies to have a wider gene pool to manipulate. Is it sick that my mind goes therem or could rich Chinese really be pining for a blond-haired, blue-eyed child to love? Has anyone else heard of it? I haven't been able to find reports of this elsewhere. It sounds ethically dodgy but I doubt that's much of a barrier.

Perhaps this is a reaction to Americans adopting unwanted girl babies in China. If anyone does want a blond haired blue eyed baby in China I bet it would be a male baby. Surely this isn't really happening?

 

[Minoosh]

Perhaps this is a reaction to Americans adopting unwanted girl babies in China. If anyone does want a blond haired blue eyed baby in China I bet it would be a male baby. Surely this isn't really happening?

According to this article there is a culture of equating lighter skin with status and prosperity, but that means lighter skin with Asian features, not looking like a white American.

Yes, as far as I can tell some Chinese want white babies and have the money to commission bespoke American-bred infants, according to my friend, who says his new girlfriend makes such arrangements for a living. I didn't get around to asking about gender preference and he probably doesn't know. I don't know this lady but she sounds pretty hardheaded. I've always said if China wants something it will go out into the world and get it, but I was thinking of minerals and lumber, not babies.

The scheme sounds weird to me, that's all. I've told a couple of girlfriends and they think it's weird. The men I've asked are kind of meh. One of them has a neighbor who is a Chinese flight attendant and is China now, so maybe I'll ask her when she gets back.

 

[cullennz]

According to this article there is a culture of equating lighter skin with status and prosperity, but that means lighter skin with Asian features, not looking like a white American.

Yes, as far as I can tell some Chinese want white babies and have the money to commission bespoke American-bred infants, according to my friend, who says his new girlfriend makes such arrangements for a living. I didn't get around to asking about gender preference and he probably doesn't know. I don't know this lady but she sounds pretty hardheaded. I've always said if China wants something it will go out into the world and get it, but I was thinking of minerals and lumber, not babies.

The scheme sounds weird to me, that's all. I've told a couple of girlfriends and they think it's weird. The men I've asked are kind of meh. One of them has a neighbor who is a Chinese flight attendant and is China now, so maybe I'll ask her when she gets back.

Please tell me your not taking that blokes blog seriously

 

[Roboramma]

Do you know the name of the company that his girlfriend works for? Or any way that we can independently check the information that you're presenting?

 

[Minoosh]

Please tell me your not taking that blokes blog seriously

It seemed a respectable piece of cultural journalism, with research, interviews etc. That's what reporters do. But, it did not really address what I'm talking about anyway.

Do you know the name of the company that his girlfriend works for? Or any way that we can independently check the information that you're presenting?

I'm going to see what I can find out, but this guy's a friend, I don't want to grill him too hard. If it's happening on any widespread basis it would be an interesting news feature. With the size of China, if there is one customer there are bound to be others. I don't think this lady is conning him.

Thanks for the opinions, I wanted a read on what other people thought.