Bullish on Bernie: The Bernie Sanders 2016 Thread

[Skeptic Ginger]

It's true if you define honeymoon as "a trip taken by newlyweds." It's false if you define honeymoon as "a vacation taken by newlyweds."

It would definitely come up in the general. But because the percentage of the population that thinks "working-honeymoon" is an oxymoron is nearly 100%, it's extremely likely that anyone pushing this idea is a slime-ball.

Or you could say he took his honeymoon on the company dime, unless you think the citizens of Burlington benefitted from a taxpayer funded trip for their mayor and his wife to visit a sister city in the USSR?

But I wasn't going to go there.

By the way, what work does a mayor do when visiting a sister city?

This is what the city's webpage says:

Yaroslavl, Russia
Burlington established its sister city relationship with Yaroslavl, Russia, in 1988. Since then, exchanges between the two cities have involved mayors, business people, firefighters, jazz musicians, youth orchestras, mural painters, high school students, medical students, nurses, librarians, and the Yaroslavl Torpedoes ice-hockey team. In 1993, Champlain and Trinity Colleges in Burlington sponsored six students from Yaroslavl; since then, dozens of Yaroslavl students have attended Champlain College. In 1997, Burlington Sister City Committee members donated children's books by Vermont authors and illustrators toward the creation of an English-speaking room at the Yaroslavl Children's Library. 1876

Sounds nice but to a TEA Party member it looks like a waste of government spending.

 

[Dog Town]

Or you could say he took his honeymoon on the company dime, unless you think the citizens of Burlington benefitted from a taxpayer funded trip for their mayor and his wife to visit a sister city in the USSR?

But I wasn't going to go there.

By the way, what work does a mayor do when visiting a sister city?

For the Google challenged:

A sister city organization is a volunteer group of ordinary citizens who, with the support of their local elected officials, form long-term relationships with people and organizations in a city abroad. Each sister city organization is independent and pursues the activities and thematic areas that are important to them and their community including municipal, business, trade, educational and cultural exchanges with their sister city.

Sister city organizations promote peace through people-to-people relationships—with program offerings varying greatly from basic cultural exchange programs to shared research and development projects between cities with relationships.

Many have done it. I did in the same year as the Bern, for Los Angeles/ Leningrad

ABOUT SISTER CITIES INTERNATIONAL

Founded by President Dwight D. Eisenhower in 1956, Sister Cities International is a 501(c)(3) nonpartisan nonprofit serving as the national membership organization for 545 U.S. sister cities, counties, and states with 2,121 partnerships in 145 countries on six continents. This network unites tens of thousands of citizen diplomats and volunteers.

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

But 16 negative stories in 16 hours is flawed evidence of bias when it can also be shown that they ran 16 positive stories in 16 hours. I'm a Sanders supporter as well and this wasn't meant negatively towards you.

Of course, one has to define "negative" and "positive" and also recognize that different groups of people might judge the same story to be "negative" or "positive".

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I didn't realize there was a debate last night. But apparently, Hillary won. Another tough night for Bernie.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/03/09/winners-and-losers-from-the-washington-postunivision-demoratic-debate/

 

[AlaskaBushPilot]

So, regarding Sanders vs. Trump in the general...

The voter comments referenced in the articles make it even more clear that this election is less about conservative vs. liberal, and more about establishment vs. populist, especially on the GOP side.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/...-Hillary-Puts-Trump-Closer-to-the-White-House
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/seth-...nst-trump-than-hillary-clinton_b_9390892.html

Yes, and that is why I posted an earlier poll saying the same thing, and commenting that it went agaist the theory of Sanders being too radical for a general election win.

I've been saying it for a long time but the establishment doesn't care much whether it is democratic or republican in office. The military-industrial-security-banking complex is going to rake in trillions and we'll still be putting out kids just competitive with Ghana in school.

Except for Bernie, who is more predictable as a European style socialist and Trump, whatever you wish to call him. I don't really know, I think a lot of him is calculated bombast and brashness. But neither one is pandering to the typical money powers in Washington.

 

[Donal]

I didn't realize there was a debate last night. But apparently, Hillary won. Another tough night for Bernie.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/03/09/winners-and-losers-from-the-washington-postunivision-demoratic-debate/

Ya, that standing ovation he got at the end was a death knell. This will be a bigger disaster for him than the Michigan primary.

 

[Trakar]

All the videos and other records of his views on socialism.

Keep in mind, I don't believe all these interpretations of Sanders. I agree with many of his views. My argument is he can't get any of that done. This country is not going to become a socialist country by electing one POTUS.

But this is what you can expect to see more of if Sanders wins the primary:

Don’t be fooled by Bernie Sanders — he’s a diehard communist

That's just the beginning. You can read the rest if you are interested. And of course the article was attacked right away.

Sanders time on a KibbutzAgain, I don't think this makes Sanders a communist. And this is an interview with a man from the Kibbutz, not an interview with Sanders. But it will come up.


The Daily Beast: When Bernie Sanders Thought Castro and the Sandinistas Could Teach America a Lesson
Again, there's more if you chose to read on.

Sanders has been very outspoken his whole adult life and a lot of it is on the record in all its raw hippie form.

Hippie doesn't scare or disgust people as much as Establishment, and most prefer socialist to corporatist.

Compared to the last three+ decades of Hillary gate (between the issues in Arkansas - many of which have still never registered on the national public's radar - during her time as first lady, as she was a senator, and then through her SoS stint), the distorted crumbs about Sanders are few and far between and generally don't have very strong legs among the electorate.

 

[PhantomWolf]

Ya, that standing ovation he got at the end was a death knell. This will be a bigger disaster for him than the Michigan primary.

We'll see, the demographics tend to suit Clinton better, larger older population than younger, also about a 1/3 Hispanic, Latino and Black. Also more women than men. Sander's did not endear himself with the Cuban community and his favoured demographic, young white males, are well outnumbered in Florida.

 

[luchog]

Ah, by skeletons in the closet I assumed you meant some dark secret Sanders wants to keep hidden, as the phrase implies. I didn't realize you meant "same old redbaiting bullcrap."

Apparently, the Clinton camp still hasn't gotten over the old redbaiting crap; and she and her supporters are taking yet another page from the GOP playbook.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/01/22/clinton-now-red-baiting-sanders/

Shows just how out of touch with the people the political establishment truly is at this stage.

 

[Donal]

I dunno. Is communism a buzzword for Baby Boomers?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Ya, that standing ovation he got at the end was a death knell. This will be a bigger disaster for him than the Michigan primary.

You can always find an opinion that one's preferred candidate won the debate. Surely all those online surveys where Sanders supporters flood the poll are not valid measures.

But Sanders made a fatal move not countering his earlier Castro sentiments. Anywhere but Miami that might have been overlooked. The last FL poll which showed Clinton's lead jumping from +30 to +45 was taken before the debate, but we don't know what messaging is being played in FL social circles and advertising. There's little doubt the Castro tapes are going to be an issue in FL.

Sanders cannot get his young minions in large enough numbers in so many states at once. I doubt he's going to have a miraculous Tuesday this time.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Hippie doesn't scare or disgust people as much as Establishment, and most prefer socialist to corporatist.

Compared to the last three+ decades of Hillary gate (between the issues in Arkansas - many of which have still never registered on the national public's radar - during her time as first lady, as she was a senator, and then through her SoS stint), the distorted crumbs about Sanders are few and far between and generally don't have very strong legs among the electorate.

While your conclusion has some merit, you are generalizing to a larger population that doesn't share your beliefs. Neither Trump nor Sanders have 50% of their respective parties and independents are not enough to counter 50% losses in either party.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Apparently, the Clinton camp still hasn't gotten over the old redbaiting crap; and she and her supporters are taking yet another page from the GOP playbook.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/01/22/clinton-now-red-baiting-sanders/

Shows just how out of touch with the people the political establishment truly is at this stage.

Clinton is not doing the red baiting. It was the moderators that brought it up.

You are blaming Clinton for the fact there is still a large anti-Castro population in FL.

 

[Donal]

You can always find an opinion that one's preferred candidate won the debate. Surely all those online surveys where Sanders supporters flood the poll are not valid measures.

But Sanders made a fatal move not countering his earlier Castro sentiments. Anywhere but Miami that might have been overlooked. The last FL poll which showed Clinton's lead jumping from +30 to +45 was taken before the debate, but we don't know what messaging is being played in FL social circles and advertising. There's little doubt the Castro tapes are going to be an issue in FL.

Sanders cannot get his young minions in large enough numbers in so many states at once. I doubt he's going to have a miraculous Tuesday this time.

The Republicans courted anti-Castro population in Miami for a long time. Since Florida is a closed primary, how many of the old Cubans are actually able to vote for Hillary?

 

[Axiom_Blade]

Clinton is not doing the red baiting. It was the moderators that brought it up.

You are blaming Clinton for the fact there is still a large anti-Castro population in FL.

Did you read the article? Clinton is indeed doing the red-baiting. It's part of her strategy.

 

[BenBurch]

You have to laugh at the Bernbots.

"We won Michigan! The pollsters don't know what they are talking about! They had Hillary 20 points ahead! LOL!"

"Here are some polls showing Bernie beating Trump"

We tied MI.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

We tied MI.

That's a non sequitur to his point.

 

[Dog Town]

Did you read the article? Clinton is indeed doing the red-baiting. It's part of her strategy.

Religious fervor, is hard to see facts through.

 

[luchog]

Did you read the article? Clinton is indeed doing the red-baiting. It's part of her strategy.

Is that a rhetorical question? Why would anyone read anything that might be counter to their own firmly held beliefs?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Is that a rhetorical question? Why would anyone read anything that might be counter to their own firmly held beliefs?

I read the article. But this is true:

... warning that if Sanders were to win the Democratic nomination, he would then be attacked by whoever is the Republican nominee, who would “surely” call him a communist.

And I don't interpret that as Clinton doing the red-baiting.

It's a no-brainer.

Whereas this:

This time they will fail because Americans are no longer spooked about the idea of socialism.

... is not supported by the evidence.

Like the recent poll where 'socialism' was at the top of list for qualities one did not want to see in a POTUS.