Continuation Part 20: Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito

[Zephyrgeist]

Oh, PLEASE be Chinese !

Not Even Wong is not only Smart, but Hilarious !

(How is it possible I still have an account here!? and AngloLawyer and Dan-O don't? I'm a dumb-ass. You wouldn't even allow me to use my real name: Cherocoy.)

 

[Planigale]

Vixen do you really believe that reading Manga changes people in to psychopaths? Or do you believe that only psychopaths read Manga? I have never listened to Marilyn Manson knowingly but I thought it was only significant if you listened to the music played backwards?

Both Managa and Marilyn Manson sell millions. They are mainstream just go into HMV. Manga is no more violent than Buffy or Batman. Definitely less so than GTA.

 

[Strozzi]

The Texas Forensic Science Commission is calling for Texas courts to ban bite mark analysis in criminal cases, saying it is based on junk science. An article (link below) states that since 2000 at least two dozen men convicted of crimes on the basis of bite mark "evidence" have been exonerated.

Perugia prosecutor Mignini may complain about this, afraid that his commissioned "watery-blood partial-foot smear on thick absorbent bathmat analysis" may also be exposed as junk science.

You can see an article about the Texas Forensic Science Commission's recommendation at
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/02/13/texas-recommends-court-ban-on-bite-mark-evidence.html?intcmp=hplnws

 

[NotEvenWrong]

Vixen do you really believe that reading Manga changes people in to psychopaths? Or do you believe that only psychopaths read Manga? I have never listened to Marilyn Manson knowingly but I thought it was only significant if you listened to the music played backwards?

Both Managa and Marilyn Manson sell millions. They are mainstream just go into HMV. Manga is no more violent than Buffy or Batman. Definitely less so than GTA.

She in all likelihood doesn't believe Manga turns people into psychopaths. That would be ridiculous, as not everyone in Japan is a psychopath.

What she does believe, and is the overarching worldview that is the basis for her entire life, is that Amanda and Raffaele killed Meredith. Therefore, she has to reason backwards and construct a scenario by finding patterns that are consistent with Amanda and Raffaele being violent people. Since there is no actual evidence of this, and she needs to find a motive that makes sense, she creates a fantasy in her mind that Raffaele's Manga and knife collection implies he is into vampire slaying occult fantasies. Boom we have a motive.

Unfortunately none of this is actually consistent with any physical evidence of the crime. But no top-in-their-field world renowned forensic geneticists like Gill, Hampikian, Moore (etc. etc. etc. etc etc.) is going to convince our Vixen. She has evidence that they were all paid off by the Amanda Knox PR supertanker. But she can't reveal her source, of course.

 

[NotEvenWrong]

Oh, PLEASE be Chinese !

Not Even Wong is not only Smart, but Hilarious !

(How is it possible I still have an account here!? and AngloLawyer and Dan-O don't? I'm a dumb-ass. You wouldn't even allow me to use my real name: Cherocoy.)

Unfortunately I can't take all the credit for being funny. All my material comes from Vixen's posts.

 

[acbytesla]

Unfortunately I can't take all the credit for being funny. All my material comes from Vixen's posts.

She does sort of tee up the punchlines.

 

[sept79]

The Texas Forensic Science Commission is calling for Texas courts to ban bite mark analysis in criminal cases, saying it is based on junk science. An article (link below) states that since 2000 at least two dozen men convicted of crimes on the basis of bite mark "evidence" have been exonerated.

Perugia prosecutor Mignini may complain about this, afraid that his commissioned "watery-blood partial-foot smear on thick absorbent bathmat analysis" may also be exposed as junk science.

You can see an article about the Texas Forensic Science Commission's recommendation at
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/02/13/texas-recommends-court-ban-on-bite-mark-evidence.html?intcmp=hplnws

Sort of like 'handwriting analysis' which was, as I recall, presented by the prosecution against Knox . . .

 

[acbytesla]

Sort of like 'handwriting analysis' which was, as I recall, presented by the prosecution against Knox . . .

Actually, I don't remember any handwriting analysis. But it wouldn't surprise me.

I mean Amanda Knox is the suburbia she witch and Raffaele, her vampire stabbing Manga warrior. By day, both mild mannered and sweet. By night sex and blood thirsty.

Police in Seattle and in Italy are closely monitoring the pair and trying to pin, I mean connect any unsolved murders to them. Detective Risotto is sure that recent stabbings in the homeless encampment must be the work of Knox. Two heroin addicts were arrested but Risotto is convinced that Knox directed the pair from her International District apartment. There are no actual witnesses or any electronic communications that connect Knox to either suspects but hey, we just know she's somehow involved. After all a knife was used.

Ever since Knox was released from Italy we've been worried that Knox would use her sexual powers on other defenseless men. The heroin addicts may have done the killing, but Amanda is the real reason.

 

[Bill Williams]

Sort of like 'handwriting analysis' which was, as I recall, presented by the prosecution against Knox . . .

Scroll down to page 42-46 of this PDF......

http://tighar.org/Publications/TTracks/2015Vol_31/October2015WEB.pdf

They are using a similar soft-science, "Aviation Language Baseline Test," to try to analyze if the radio-voices heard post-Amelia Earhart's disappearance, were actually Amelia Earhart. The thesis is that pilots in distress revert to a different cadence of speech in radio communication than when operations are normal. If Earhart was broadcasting past July 2, 1937, then that means she did not crash in the ocean and sink that day, that she managed to land on a reef somewhere - they think Gardner Island (now Nikumaroro, part of the Phoenix Islands, Kiribati, in the western Pacific Ocean).

This is such "soft" science, that you'd only use it when you had nothing else - especially to solve something as tenuous as the Earhart disappearance in 1937. It's what you try when there's nothing else to try.

You never take stuff like this into court to prove anything.

 

[Strozzi]

She in all likelihood doesn't believe Manga turns people into psychopaths. That would be ridiculous, as not everyone in Japan is a psychopath.

What she does believe, and is the overarching worldview that is the basis for her entire life, is that Amanda and Raffaele killed Meredith. Therefore, she has to reason backwards and construct a scenario by finding patterns that are consistent with Amanda and Raffaele being violent people. Since there is no actual evidence of this, and she needs to find a motive that makes sense, she creates a fantasy in her mind that Raffaele's Manga and knife collection implies he is into vampire slaying occult fantasies. Boom we have a motive.

Unfortunately none of this is actually consistent with any physical evidence of the crime. But no top-in-their-field world renowned forensic geneticists like Gill, Hampikian, Moore (etc. etc. etc. etc etc.) is going to convince our Vixen. She has evidence that they were all paid off by the Amanda Knox PR supertanker. But she can't reveal her source, of course.

Would owning a pair of stiletto heals indicate that the lady has an affinity for knives?

 

[acbytesla]

Would owning a pair of stiletto heals indicate that the lady has an affinity for knives?

Now you're getting it. But only if they are Italian shoes.

 

[sept79]

Actually, I don't remember any handwriting analysis. But it wouldn't surprise me.
.
.
.

Could have this wrong, but I seem to recall that during his closing in the massei trial Mignini stated some very negative comments about Knox which were the conclusions made from a book written by an author professing to be some kind of handwriting/statement analyst.

 

[acbytesla]

Could have this wrong, but I seem to recall that during his closing in the massei trial Mignini stated some very negative comments about Knox which were the conclusions made from a book written by an author professing to be some kind of handwriting/statement analyst.

Mignini? Saying negative comments about Amanda? Say it isn't so.

 

[query grind]

Query Grinder

This is a question for Grinder - as he/she is the undisputed expert of all things related to the Perugia murder.

Sometime ago - I think towards the end of 2015 - you posted one of your early newspaper reports of the autopsy by Dr Lalli which was quite explicit in term of traces of semen were found on the body of Meredith Kercher. You made some kind of comment about this was kind of information/rumour that was circulating in those early days.

I have been methodically searching the various threads and I can't seem to find it - was it my imagination? Have I missed it? Or did someone ask you to remove it as being too explicit?

I have been trying to find it by searching the online newspapers and although I find things from the 5th of November that get very close: eg two attackers believed involved, organic liquids taken for analysis - nothing quite as clear cut as the one I seem to recall you posting.

Would you be able to repost it, post a link or describe where it was you found it? If you do feel it was too explicit then a PM would be just fine.

Thanks in advance
The Query Grinder Team

 

[Methos]

Could have this wrong, but I seem to recall that during his closing in the massei trial Mignini stated some very negative comments about Knox which were the conclusions made from a book written by an author professing to be some kind of handwriting/statement analyst.

I'm searching for the reference to it in the closing arguments, but fact is that the only psycological "evaluation" of Guede, Sollecito and Knox was made by Vincenzo Maria Mastronardi who was a consultant for Guede's defense.
He is co-author of the book "Meredith, Luci e ombre a Perugia" (Jan 2009) together with Giuseppe Castellini (Giornale dell'Umbria).
The last part of the book is indeed Mastronardi's psycological evaluation of the suspects based on their handwriting:
Conclusion for Rudy Guede: (google translation)

Diagnostic hypotheses:
No severe personality disorder (not otherwise specified) (DSM-IV TR NAS) as are observed:
- Obsessive-compulsive traits that lead ultimately be carried to the surface and unproductive social and occupational functioning;
- Is concerned (especially) of rejection and criticism of of others;
- Tends to take advantage of others to achieve their goals;
- Is easily suggestible;
- The design is paranoid and is accentuated as a result of physical or psychological stress;
- Impulsivity;
- Tendency to hold grudges;
- Susceptibility to criticism, mainly interpreted in the sense malicious and often with a hidden meaning. We report extremely important because in the third last leaf Rudy, about himself, says: "My life was not easy, yes, I am biased to say the lies ...".

Conclusion for Raffaele Sollecito: (google translation)

Diagnostic hypotheses:
Whether, as a dependent personality* afraid to express disagreement frankly unrealistic fears of losing support, it is also available from under the thumb facing unpleasant situations in order to obtain the approval of others.
It is capable of discernment.

* Fears and anxieties make it vulnerable to relational interaction with each other.

Conclusion for Amanda Knox: (google translation)

Diagnostic hypotheses:
The DSM-IV-TR defines borderline personality disorder as "a pervasive pattern of instability of interpersonal relationships, self-image and affects, and marked impulsivity ..." (p. 756).
From examination of psiocografologica made some writings by Amanda revealed that the same is not suffering from severe personality disorder borderline, not able to disabling the ability to understand (the value or disvalue of acts, facts or omissions, as well aware of the determine the variations which might be appropriate for the occasion) and will.
An examination of previous similar cases evaluated psicografologicamente, when deepened psychiatric diagnostics due to mode-psychiatric clinical interview (see Mastronardi, operators manual for forensic criminology and psychopathology, Giuffre, 2001) and through the use of testistica universally accepted (eg Rorschach, MMPI, etc..), did not appear separated by highlighting the most minute until you get in certain cases to the revaluation of the total or partial impairment of the ability to understand and desire.
The relationship with the drug does not rule out Amanda in her ability to understand the risk of the consequences of their actions, after taking the drug.
The predominant features psicografologiche Amanda are:
1) heightened narcissism;
2) anger and aggressiveness;
3) manipolativita and theatricality;
4) tendency to transgression;
5) lack of empathy and emotional anesthesia;
6) tend to dominate the relationship with sudden satisfaction of immediate needs;
7) tendency to develop easy dislikes when interacting with people who do not share her views or that they have very competitive;
8) the most profound feeling of neglect of the dictates of authority to which attitudes tend to defend themselves with concealed internal challenge.

 

[Bill Williams]

I'm searching for the reference to it in the closing arguments, but fact is that the only psycological "evaluation" of Guede, Sollecito and Knox was made by Vincenzo Maria Mastronardi who was a consultant for Guede's defense.
He is co-author of the book "Meredith, Luci e ombre a Perugia" (Jan 2009) together with Giuseppe Castellini (Giornale dell'Umbria).
The last part of the book is indeed Mastronardi's psycological evaluation of the suspects based on their handwriting:

So I was wrong..... there WAS a psychological evaluation available to Judge Massei in 2009. Apologies for claiming otherwise.

Please note, though, that this makes it worse. If there had been such an analysis available to his court - albeit one derived from friggin' handwriting analysis!!!! - why did he not make mention of it?

Even in convicting RS and AK, it becomes apparent how different even Judge Massei ruled on things compared with the judicially-created, fast-track factoids Mignini managed to lock into this case at Rudy's trial.

Conspiracy theory alert - I am beginning to revise my opinion of Judge Massei. He knew he had to convict - yet reading his motivations report leaves one with the feeling he never thought they were guilty. Hr continually makes bald-faced, arbitrary choices to believe people like Stefanoni, mainly because he cannot believe an officer of the court would lie.

So he convicted, and threw this up the line for another court to sort out - leaving behind a mass of contradictions and arbitrarily found facts - and decisions which did not line up with Rudy's fact-track farce.

First piece of evidence in this conspiracy theory of mine - Massei actually DID have a psychological analysis available to him. And in the end wrote that forcing RS and AK into this murder required a theory of a "choice for evil", rather than the psychological dysfunction a few of the remaining guilters peddle to this day.

If such conspiratorial thinking is anywhere near the mark, it still makes Massei an immoral toady, to convict people he thought were innocent.

 

[Bill Williams]

This conspiracy would also explain why the convicting judges never complained when their decisions were annulled.

 

[acbytesla]

I'm searching for the reference to it in the closing arguments, but fact is that the only psycological "evaluation" of Guede, Sollecito and Knox was made by Vincenzo Maria Mastronardi who was a consultant for Guede's defense.
He is co-author of the book "Meredith, Luci e ombre a Perugia" (Jan 2009) together with Giuseppe Castellini (Giornale dell'Umbria).
The last part of the book is indeed Mastronardi's psycological evaluation of the suspects based on their handwriting:
Conclusion for Rudy Guede: (google translation)

Conclusion for Raffaele Sollecito: (google translation)

Conclusion for Amanda Knox: (google translation)

What a crock of FECES. I'd say the more common word for this, but you know.

The idea that one can evaluate somebody's personality by their hand writing is such absurdity. You might as well use the position of the stars at the time of birth.

Is there a forum for handwriting analysis on ISF?

 

[Desert Fox]

What a crock of FECES. I'd say the more common word for this, but you know.

The idea that one can evaluate somebody's personality by their hand writing is such absurdity. You might as well use the position of the stars at the time of birth.

Is there a forum for handwriting analysis on ISF?

Might as well be in "Eyes for Lies" territory.

 

[query grind]

This is a question for Grinder - as he/she is the undisputed expert of all things related to the Perugia murder.

Sometime ago - I think towards the end of 2015 - you posted one of your early newspaper reports of the autopsy by Dr Lalli which was quite explicit in term of traces of semen were found on the body of Meredith Kercher. You made some kind of comment about this was kind of information/rumour that was circulating in those early days.

I have been methodically searching the various threads and I can't seem to find it - was it my imagination? Have I missed it? Or did someone ask you to remove it as being too explicit?

I have been trying to find it by searching the online newspapers and although I find things from the 5th of November that get very close: eg two attackers believed involved, organic liquids taken for analysis - nothing quite as clear cut as the one I seem to recall you posting.

Would you be able to repost it, post a link or describe where it was you found it? If you do feel it was too explicit then a PM would be just fine.

Thanks in advance
The Query Grinder Team

While I understand the need for sensitivity regarding descriptions of a murder/rape victim, if sensitivity extends to expunging all record of the physical condition of the victim upon discovery off the internet, then it seems to be sensitivity has crossed over a line and is in danger of becoming complicit in the crime.

I mean if we really want to sugar coat reality why not just say Meredith Kercher was smothered to death under a cascade of unicorn kisses? That's way nicer.