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[ozeco41]

I got them all at a yard sale for fifty cents.(the seller had .50 each and I talked him down)

I have the full collection of Richard Dawkins' writings on evolutionary biology. ( My posting experiences started on the Dawkins forum - my first Googling for WTC 9/11 info took me there. Started my interest in the evolution v creationism topics. )

Alongside them on the bookshelf I have about half a dozen creationist authored books allegedly proving evolutionary biology wrong. They average about one page to "first lie". Astonishing that people would write a book about a topic and not even understand the basics of the topic they disagree with. In effect most of those books are chasing strawmen.


But the situation here with spooky is not a new phenomenon - a debunker side person disagreeing with debunkers and posting insults rather than evidence. Maybe it just stands out given current low level of activity - fewer posts being made these days.

So he comes from the "debunker" side - has some fixed and errant understandings - doesn't understand the issues therefore resorts to insulting those who can think clearly. Breaks the usual "rule" of "don't insult debunkers".

Now where have I seen that occur regularly over many years????

Who was the engineering professor who has some loyal supporters who still think he could do no wrong??

 

[DGM]

Now where have I seen that occur regularly over many years????

Who was the engineering professor who some loyal supporters still think could do no wrong??

Just love those buttons...............

 

[ozeco41]

Just love those buttons...............

I sometimes vary the degree of subtlety.

From near zero to ..????

My problem is that my interest is in the engineering physics of the collapses. And everyone is locked in their comfort zones on those topics.

I'm not into the metallurgical science of ThermXte - not my field of science and those managing it are top rank.

But I see it as wasted effort because it is at least two degrees remote from WTC 9/11 reality. Absent any CD thermXte is an irrelevant set of moot points.

The Towers did in fact collapse so understanding of mechanisms is directly relevant. Especially when those misunderstandings remain so entrenched in confusion over basic premises which should be "bleedingly obvious^TM"

 

[beachnut]

William Pepper has no useful information on 911; a perfect fit for 911 truth, nobody in 911 truth has useful information on 911. 911 truth should be named properly: Fellowship of Dolts who Can't Figure out 911 Given the Answers.

Searching for evidence of intelligent life in 911 Truth for 13 years; nothing found.

Being on the fence about 911 (for more than the time it takes to do research, aka days or weeks); impossible for anyone with critical thinking skills. Falling off the fence into the the pit of ignorance known as 911 truth, takes great skills in mastering ignorance. 13 years, going on 14 - think the fence rotted away days after 911.

None of you here have ever read a single one of them. One of them is Professor Griffin's and I know your clueless about that too.

-
LOL, Griffin, the high priest of 911 Truth Woo and BS.

http://www.911myths.com/tgitc_1_0_final.pdf

Nobody studies the failed 911 truth nuts... lol

day and night? is there any truth in 911 truth? Like BS on Flt 800, some people failed to read why it was the CWT, and fail to understand why. 911 truth leaves out the logic, reason, facts, evidence, science, and goes direct to lies based on fantasy and nonsense. Griffin uses this model to fool people who refuse to think for themselves.

Now I know.

Yes, intelligent people use evidence to learn 911 was done by 19 failed followers associated with UBL, and the BS flowing from 911 truth is false on face value; the BS is of interest to study why dolts fall for such dumbed down tripe. Like p4t claiming the maneuvers are too hard for any but expert pilots, presenting no data, just talk, which is false. Like Griffin's claims, failed on face value. Why is the maneuver of crashing to hard for any but expert pilots... lol - 911 truth, a failed movement of BS, and when you find science minded truthers, it gets dumber.

This is why intelligent people can skip 911 truth CT sub-forum; 911 truth has nothing of value, and only fools people with the mental capacity of people like the Boston bombers.

Is reading Griffin needed to understand 911? His work is doo doo - certified woo

 

[DGM]

My problem is that my interest is in the engineering physics of the collapses. And everyone is locked in their comfort zones on those topics.

The problem there is this no longer falls into the realm of conspiracy. Your interest is a ship without a port (so to speak). Discussing Bazant et al (name the paper), in conspiracies always falls back to it's use/misuse in conspiracy.

The works are not that hard to understand. Good luck getting everyone on the same page for application.

 

[ozeco41]

The problem there is this no longer falls into the realm of conspiracy. Your interest is a ship without a port (so to speak).

Beg to differ - that is the false argument which has been deployed in recent years ONLY against persons like Major Tom by persons who could not disprove him on those points where he was right.

Remember the historic reason for the sub forum was to quarantine ALL 9/11 related material to prevent it contaminating the remainder of the forum.

I haven't seen the argument recently but if we removed all the technical stuff in the past Ryan Mackey et als material would be banished. AND all the current stuff on thermXte for the very reason I posted in my previous post.

IF collapse mechanisms are not legit without "conspiracy" THEN thermXte is even less related to conspiracy.

Remember also no one objected to me posting the layman's understanding of "initiation" for Jango. And only a small number of debunkers resorted to personal attacks because they could not legitimately disagree with my posts. And that thread was pure technical. In fact IIRC only one PA in the thread.

Still. You and I understand each other. And no loss if I finally decide to stop posting with some members still confused...

Discussing Bazant et al (name the paper), in conspiracies always falls back to it's use/misuse in conspiracy...

Would you accept T Sz as a conspirator? So provided I explain why T Sz was wrong I would be permitted to show where both he and Z B were wrong??

The works are not that hard to understand. Good luck getting everyone on the same page for application.

The key two or three premises are "bleedingly obvious"^TM.


OK - nuff fun for now - I have work to do.
..and my twisted sense of humour could get me into trouble...

Cheers.

 

[Georgio]

http://911blogger.com/topics/william-pepper

Scroll down to the NYCANT article....took me less than a minute for this tid bit

Out of interest, did you do what I've just tried to do and search for 'William Pepper anti semit' in the hope of catching both 'anti semite' and 'anti semitism'? Because if you do that you get the NYCAN article in the first ten results, however the only reference within the article itself to anti-semitism has nothing to do with William Pepper.

@spooky24 - are you going to substantiate your claim that William Pepper said, "and we all know George Bush shot down EWA -excuse me- TWA 800 in order to enrich his fellow---you know it's coming-you have been waiting-now here it is THE JEWS!!!!!!!!! '?

Maybe someone else has seen this clip and can link me to it.

 

[carlitos]

I dug up one of these A&E lectures-for lack of anything else to call it-in archives.org.
........

He gets the shakes as he struggles to say "and we all know George Bush shot down EWA -excuse me- TWA 800 in order to enrich his fellow---you know it's coming-you have been waiting-now here it is THE JEWS!!!!!!!!!

As others have asked, please provide a link to this video.

 

[beachnut]

Out of interest, did you do what I've just tried to do and search for 'William Pepper anti semit' in the hope of catching both 'anti semite' and 'anti semitism'? Because if you do that you get the NYCAN article in the first ten results, however the only reference within the article itself to anti-semitism has nothing to do with William Pepper.

@spooky24 - are you going to substantiate your claim that William Pepper said, "and we all know George Bush shot down EWA -excuse me- TWA 800 in order to enrich his fellow---you know it's coming-you have been waiting-now here it is THE JEWS!!!!!!!!! '?

Maybe someone else has seen this clip and can link me to it.

What value does William Pepper add to the delusional claims of 911 truth? Nothing; you are off on a tangent as you sit on a fence based on ignorance and BS. The tangent; is Bill Pepper anti-Semitic? Who cares, the fact is Bill Pepper is full of plagiarized BS on 911, zero evidence, and he tells everyone he is clueless as he spews BS from 911 truth nuts.

A fringe few are fooled by 911 truth, including Bill Pepper, and the Boston bombers. What is the purpose of finding what Bill Pepper may or may not of said. How does proving Pepper is not anti-Semitic help his credibility on 911 issues, which he explains he has no credibility in his speech, he repeats he is not up to speed on the lies and delusional claims. He can't even figure out they FBI investigated the Puts and found them to be hedges on long positions - Bill's speech makes him a cretin on 911; aka a typical 911 truth follower.

If you stick to the 911 related material William Pepper presents, it makes him look dumber than dirt, a nut who repeats failed claims from a failed movement based on massive ignorance.

I would comment on his technical claims, or any of his claims, but he has no valid information, I doubt he knows the date 911 took place. Like 911 truth, there is no substance, only nonsense.

Did you go to engineering school? What is your expertise which has you off on the tangent you can ignore, since William Pepper has nothing to offer on 911, and he is one of the many reasons for not being on the fence you are stuck on.

 

[Georgio]

@beachnut - I notice you don't mind so much when carlitos, Oystein and jaydeehess all make the same request of spooky24 to back up his claims but continually post your usual garbage whenever I post. You seem to be following me around trying to get my attention. Could it be that you're secretly in love with me?

 

[beachnut]

@beachnut - I notice you don't mind so much when carlitos, Oystein and jaydeehess all make the same request of spooky24 to back up his claims but continually post your usual garbage whenever I post. ...?

For fence sitters the truth is, "usual garbage". Are you fooled by the lies and delusional claims? You use to post the dumbest videos by old failed nuts who joined Gage; that was cool, you found the dumbest claims and failed to realize it was all BS, lies and nonsense. The truth is, 911 truth has nothing, and you can't show otherwise; thus the frustration when 911 truth claims are properly identified as lies, BS and nonsene; all on face value, no need to debunk; 911 truth has always been self-debunking, otherwise their claims would have earned the biggest Pulitzer in History.

Following you around; my first post was in 2011... when was your first post; lol.

Why is Pepper so darn paranoid. Did you hear him say they are after him? lol, it was funny.

I read the post, and I found that the section, the quote, the tangent, ""said, "and we all know George Bush shot down EWA -excuse me- TWA 800 in order to enrich his fellow---you know it's coming-you have been waiting-now here it is THE JEWS!!!!!!!!! '?
""", was what you might expect next out of the delusional BS William Pepper would say next, or was what you might expect from someone like Pepper to say next; not what he said. That is how I read it, I don't care if Pepper said it, or if Spooky was thinking he expected Pepper to say something that dumbed down.

Maybe Spooky has a different video, maybe it is like I thought, ;;; Spooky said those are words Spooky thought he could say next;;; again, not what he said - who cares, I care a little, but this is a tangent, and it has nothing to do with 911, the same as 911 truth has nothing to do with 911.

The sentence for me does not imply Pepper saying "the Jews". Since Spooky can't figure out Flight 800 blew up do to the CWT, I don't expect closure on this tangent; do you? Also, a post implying Griffin has something for 911, is silly.

A year to be on the fence is a long time; It takes the best minutes to figure out 911, and most no longer than a few days. 911 truth is not in the most column, and orders of magnitude out of the "best".

Following around? First post for me in this thread, reply to RedIbis, who has not figured out 911; also... in 2011, where you here in 2011? no
Second post, I warned you Pepper was a nut, and covertly implied the question you asked is tangential at best; do you have evidence Pepper has any valid information on 911? no
Next post, more notes on Pepper and 911, not a reply to you;
Next post, a reply to you, which I hinted at Spooky may not of posted what Pepper said, but what we might expect next to come out of his CT brain.
This is a forum, put me on ignore, and you can stop seeing "noise", and the "usual garbage", as I properly identify the category 911 truth claims are in... , I am amazed someone is on the fence for 13 plus years; There is an Ignore button; use it.

Do you have some evidence to save 911 truth claims from being BS, lies and nonsense? No. Does replying to your posts 3 out of 6 posts in one thread have anything to do with the fact Pepper has no useful information on 911?

 

[Georgio]

Methinks the lady doth protest too much. It's love, no question.

 

[Georgio]

As others have asked, please provide a link to this video.

Bump for spooky24. Spooky24 - Could you please provide evidence for or retract what you said in this post:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10806667#post10806667

Thanks.

 

[beachnut]

Bump for spooky24. Spooky24 - Could you please provide evidence for or retract what you said in this post:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10806667#post10806667

Thanks.

How do you retract the fact 911 truth dolts, the fake experts are liars? It is a fact.

But the evidence is in the key words, "look like".

No need to wake up the all the NWO operatives, the key was, "look like". Go back to weekend off for NWO shill holiday. We don't work weekends... cut backs, etc.

How is that fence of woo doing

 

[Georgio]

How do you retract the fact 911 truth dolts, the fake experts are liars? It is a fact.

You make it sound like I want spooky24 to retract or prove some vague idea or statement, whereas what I am asking him to retract or prove is ONE SPECIFIC statement that he saw a video where William Pepper:

stumbles from conspiracy to conspiracy-without any mention of explanation or, heaven forbid evidence. He gets the shakes as he struggles to say "and we all know George Bush shot down EWA -excuse me- TWA 800 in order to enrich his fellow---you know it's coming-you have been waiting-now here it is THE JEWS!!!!!!!!!

 

[beachnut]

You make it sound like I want spooky24 to retract or prove some vague idea or statement, whereas what I am asking him to retract or prove is ONE SPECIFIC statement that he saw a video where William Pepper:

stumbles from conspiracy to conspiracy-without any mention of explanation or, heaven forbid evidence.

William Pepper seems to do this every time he speaks. So true, anyone who has heard William Pepper speak knows this is a fact; unless they are stuck on a fence of woo; This is a known fact.
Drop this, it is a fact.

He gets the shakes as he struggles to say "and we all know George Bush shot down EWA -excuse me- TWA 800 in order to enrich his fellow

Anyone found this one yet? William speaks for an hour or more, how do you find 10 seconds out of and hour of BS and idiotic 911 truth claims.
William Pepper goes from CT to CT, he claims the FAA failed to notify NORAD in time, and has no clue he is speaking BS he made up out of ignorance; a perfect fit for 911 truth, he qualifies as an expert. He take BS and spews it freely.
How do you find 10 second of other BS in between the many CTs he Gish Gallops into his support for lies on 911.

Anyone found the TWA 800 stuff out of William Pepper's CT Gish Gallops talks on 911? or MLK, or...

---you know it's coming-you have been waiting-now here it is THE JEWS!!!!!!!!!

Not so sure this was said, but something a BS artist spewing 911 truth nonsense might say next.

So you are looking for the TWA 800 CT spewing from William Pepper. How can you ask someone to watch pile of BS flowing from Pepper for hours to find the 800 CT BS?

Pepper has no useful knowledge on 911; can we drop 800 from his many CT claims?
How many Pepper videos have you screened for the 800 CT? Are you looking? Do you agree with Pepper that the FAA and NORAD messed up?

Who is going to wade through hours of Pepper to find Flt 800? That is cruel and unusual punishment... worse than waterboarding for the few who can hold their breath for 5 minutes...

 

[Oystein]

Burden of evidence is on the claimant. That would be spooky24 here.
Unless you, beachnut, share in that claim, then you ought to assume your share of the burden

anyone who has heard William Pepper speak knows this is a fact

I have listened to a part of one William Pepper speech and do not know this is a fact.

I can be convinced of the claim with proper evidence

 

[Georgio]

William speaks for an hour or more, how do you find 10 seconds out of and hour of BS and idiotic 911 truth claims.

Pretty easily if you've already seen it once. Besides, all spooky24 has to do is to link to the correct video - I'm willing to watch the whole thing.

By the way, by 'drop this' do you mean the bit about him 'stumbling from conspiracy to conspiracy' or the claim that he said, 'and we all know George Bush shot down EWA -excuse me- TWA 800 in order to enrich his fellow---you know it's coming-you have been waiting-now here it is THE JEWS!!!!!!!!!

Because it's the second one I'm talking about. I wouldn't class 'stumbling from conspiracy to conspiracy' as as serious an accusation as one of someone saying someone did something in order to enrich his 'fellow jews'. That is a serious accusation of anti-semitism - surely you don't want me to drop pressuring the person who made it to back it up? Having said that, I couldn't care less whether you want me to drop it or not.

 

[beachnut]

Pretty easily if you've already seen it once. Besides, all spooky24 has to do is to link to the correct video - I'm willing to watch the whole thing.
...

I would like spooky24 to link to the video too. However, it might kill him to have to wade through a video to find the quote. Have you watched a Pepper video, it is torture, and so much dumbed down BS. It hurts.

How many Pepper videos have you watched; how many hours? It is as bad as Gage, and Pepper makes up more BS about every event he can remember.

The Jew part? Do you think that was part of Pepper's quote. I read that as what you might expect from someone who is spewing the dumbest 911 truth claims as Pepper does; and not the what he said. As if spooky24 stopped watching the video when 800 came up... and added what might come out.
And spooky24 did not put the quote in quotes, thus technically we have no idea what spooky24 says Pepper said in the video.

Pretty easily if you've already seen it once. ...

It is not easy if you have seen it once. I have seen hundreds of idiotic claims by 911 truth and I don't remember what video has specific BS in it.

How many hours of Pepper have you watched? Does he have any evidence for the idiotic claims AE911T have? He likes to push Gage as an expert, but Pepper has no clue what happened on 911.


There is no way someone can watch Pepper speak, he keeps repeating failed lies.
42:54 PUTS ... The FBI investigated, Pepper says they did not with BS claim.
43:12 - steel removed quickly? lol 8 months - can't believe Pepper can't figure out 8 months is not quickly, or the fact scientist looked at the steel; and the bigger clue, fire caused the collapse, a fact, except in 911 truth land steel can't fail in fire.
43:24 - tampering with evidence - lol, no evidence for this lie. He thinks evidence was tampered with. What was it? Poor Pepper making up lies on the fly.
50:01 Northwoods, Pepper lies, says the plan was to kill... it was not a plan to kill. ... It was a stupid plan, and thus bringing up Northwoods is only a sign of BS, and not evidence for 911 being an inside job since 19 terrorists did 911, it was not a Pentagon plan, it was a UBL supported plan.
Darn, I left out the part with NORAD and the FAA. He has a very shallow grasp on the standard 911 truth lies, false claims and fantasy. He also supports Gage, which means he has no clue.

Watching Pepper speak is torture for rational people.

Burden of evidence is on the claimant. That would be spooky24 here.
Unless you, beachnut, share in that claim, then you ought to assume your share of the burden

I have listened to a part of one William Pepper speech and do not know this is a fact.

I can be convinced of the claim with proper evidence

The proof is in his videos...
Watch a video of Pepper for an hour, Pepper does go from CT to CT without evidence, a Gish Gallop of BS; which does fool the crowd; he hits on so many CTs, I would not be surprised if the audience gathered to hear BS about 911 and CTs is not happy when their favorite CT is mentioned... if you watched a Pepper video for an hour, it is a fact. Unless you are a CTer on Bobby, Martin and John; and more.
On 911, LOL, he has the PUTS is a conspiracy theory, steel was removed quickly BS another CT, tampered with evidence a CT he can't back up with facts; guess the Northwoods is not a CT, it is a plan not used, thus makes no sense to bring it up except to claim and praise JFK stopped it, and was the super president of the day (i like JFK, part of why I was an engineer). He plays the JFK card, MLK card, Bobby Card, etc, etc. All were conspiracy theories he has. Pepper is so far off on 911, it makes his support of JFK, Bobby and Martin CTs more suspect... Ironically he spews BS which is easy to debunk, and he warns people they will be discredited, as he discredits himself with BS on 911.

I guess you are fooled by BS when you listened to Pepper, but he does go from CT to CT, BS to BS.
https://archive.org/details/William_Pepper


Summary...
William Pepper has no useful knowledge on 911. spooky24 did not provide a source. After watching Pepper in action; Flight 800 CTs would not do him more harm, it would be expected, or would not be a surprise.
I will pay attention, if I find Pepper spewing BS on 800, then I will report back. as for the last part, is that what Pepper said, or what one might expect from 911 truth nuts...

 

[ProBonoShill]

I would like spooky24 to link to the video too. However, it might kill him to have to wade through a video to find the quote. Have you watched a Pepper video, it is torture, and so much dumbed down BS. It hurts.

How many Pepper videos have you watched; how many hours? It is as bad as Gage, and Pepper makes up more BS about every event he can remember.

The Jew part? Do you think that was part of Pepper's quote. I read that as what you might expect from someone who is spewing the dumbest 911 truth claims as Pepper does; and not the what he said. As if spooky24 stopped watching the video when 800 came up... and added what might come out.
And spooky24 did not put the quote in quotes, thus technically we have no idea what spooky24 says Pepper said in the video.



It is not easy if you have seen it once. I have seen hundreds of idiotic claims by 911 truth and I don't remember what video has specific BS in it.

How many hours of Pepper have you watched? Does he have any evidence for the idiotic claims AE911T have? He likes to push Gage as an expert, but Pepper has no clue what happened on 911.


There is no way someone can watch Pepper speak, he keeps repeating failed lies.
42:54 PUTS ... The FBI investigated, Pepper says they did not with BS claim.
43:12 - steel removed quickly? lol 8 months - can't believe Pepper can't figure out 8 months is not quickly, or the fact scientist looked at the steel; and the bigger clue, fire caused the collapse, a fact, except in 911 truth land steel can't fail in fire.
43:24 - tampering with evidence - lol, no evidence for this lie. He thinks evidence was tampered with. What was it? Poor Pepper making up lies on the fly.
50:01 Northwoods, Pepper lies, says the plan was to kill... it was not a plan to kill. ... It was a stupid plan, and thus bringing up Northwoods is only a sign of BS, and not evidence for 911 being an inside job since 19 terrorists did 911, it was not a Pentagon plan, it was a UBL supported plan.

Watching Pepper speak is torture for rational people.


A fact for rational people. Fact is Pepper goes from CT to CT, a fact... Guess you might want to believe his BS, but it does not make it real. On 911 he has CT after CT...
LOL, on 911 he has the PUTS is a conspiracy theory, steel was removed quickly BS another CT, tampered with evidence a CT he can't back up with facts; guess the Northwoods is not a CT, it is a plan not used, thus makes no sense to bring it up except to claim and praise JFK stopped it, and was the super president of the day (i like JFK, part of why I was an engineer). He plays the JFK card, MLK card, Bobby Card, etc, etc. All were conspiracy theories he has. A fact.

I guess you are fooled by BS when you listened to Pepper, but he does go from CT to CT, BS to BS.
https://archive.org/details/William_Pepper

Isn't it cute how Georgio asked for cites from debunkers but lets twoofer dolts off the hook completely.