Obamacare 5 years later. Crow, anyone?

[Upchurch]

One of the criticisms of the ACA is that it would be socialized medicine, which it isn't.

Another criticism of the ACA is that it should be socialized medicine, which it isn't.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Well a lot of states refused the Medicaid expansions because know that letting the poor get health care will totally kill their motivation to work. So you kill some of them as an object lesson by letting them die of treatable causes and then you motivate the rest.

Wait! The lack of ACA leads to FEMA death camps?

 

[ponderingturtle]

Wait! The lack of ACA leads to FEMA death camps?

No, you are just left to die at home. That was the traditional way Americans dealt with poor people with chronic conditions that needed constant medical care.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Another criticism of the ACA is that it should be socialized medicine, which it isn't.

It is at least partially. The expanded Medicaid and subsidized insurance for those who can afford to pay some are socialized policies.

It fails to be a fully socialized system but it was mainly focused on fixing the most egregious moral failings of the existing system.

Fixing the cost of health care is not politically palatable anytime soon. It would hit to many groups with good lobbyists to make it politically feasible to do anything about costs.

 

[Upchurch]

Fixing the cost of health care is not politically palatable anytime soon. It would hit to many groups with good lobbyists to make it politically feasible to do anything about costs.

There is something so egregiously wrong with that statement and, yet, it is so completely true at the same time.

 

[BStrong]

It doesn't effect me (yet) but a good friend of mine who signed up has a very, very common Sicilian name (to the point he has two cousins with the same name) that has found out the hardway that there a bunch of deadbeat dad's and tax cheats that share the same name, and the system seems to default to blaming him for their bad debts or tax liabilities - it's been a nightmare for him.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

No, you are just left to die at home. That was the traditional way Americans dealt with poor people with chronic conditions that needed constant medical care.

At home, yes, but when we had extended families there was a safety net for the ill, the elderly, and the lame.

 

[ponderingturtle]

There is something so egregiously wrong with that statement and, yet, it is so completely true at the same time.

Yea you also understand the problems of fixing the health care system. Getting it anywhere close to in line with any other industrial nation would mean redirecting at least 4-5% of out GPD. That is going to hurt the bottom lines of a lot of people with political power and likely cost a lot of jobs. Those make it politically impossible. Maybe if we had a serious enough crisis, though I am not sure what that would be.

 

[ponderingturtle]

At home, yes, but when we had extended families there was a safety net for the ill, the elderly, and the lame.

The thing is that people who couldn't afford insurance couldn't afford medical bills either. So that isn't much of a safety net.

 

[BobTheCoward]

I was never a burden on the system before Obamacare; now I am. The way Medicaid works is that the state (AZ in this case) pays premiums to an insurance company. Those premiums get paid whether I go to the doctor or not. I seldom go to the doctor, so that money just goes to enrich the insurance company rather than helping someone who actually needs it. It's a complete waste of taxpayer money.

The states set the value of Medicaid premiums (called capitation payments. State medicaid receives all the records. For their enrollees from the health plans. Suppose it was 5 billion dollars of medical services. They would factor in inflation, population, etc and pay something like 5.3 billion the following year it isn't wasted because in aggregate it should be close to the cost of health care provided

 

[Lowpro]

There is something so egregiously wrong with that statement and, yet, it is so completely true at the same time.

Heh I think a lot of people aren't as cognizant of the state's political issues with the political issues of healthcare (predating ACA before my lifetime at least).

A good example, and actually one of the weirdest ones, is BCBS of Alabama and HealthSouth during Scrushy's illegal bookcooking. BCBS has always had...political discourse...with Alabama lawmakers because BCBS is a massive majority health insurance provider and though they claim it keeps the premiums low, the truth is far stranger and seditious. It's a long derail to discuss but if you want to have some reading material to google, just do BCBS+HealthSouth+Scrushy and see how far that rabbit hole goes.

Hint: you'll become a very disaffected individual for all things that start with the word "health" afterwards.

 

[eeyore1954]

My insurance company sends a document that breaks down the "extra" cost. Something like 40% of the total cost of the policy is now due to "covering pre-existing conditions" (within what would have previously been an exclusionary period).

If they said that I believe they are trying to pull the wool over your eyes. That percentage seems way to high. Although I am having trouble finding data to back up either my belief or their statement.

 

[3point14]

If they said that I believe they are trying to pull the wool over your eyes. That percentage seems way to high. Although I am having trouble finding data to back up either my belief or their statement.

Sounds about right given the massive* increase in risk that comes with insuring a pre-existing condition.


(*No, bigger than that)

 

[Varanid]

My wife, who has recurrent kidney stones, could not get health insurance until the ACA was passed. This is a hard enough problem with health insurance; without it, it is horrible.

If you have a problem with ACA, I would invite you to watch your loved one in unthinkable pain.

I take it very personally when right-wing douche bags brag about wanting to get rid of the ACA.

 

[Newtons Bit]

My rates are still triple what they were pre-Obamacare, and I still lost my dental. So... yea.

 

[3point14]

My rates are still triple what they were pre-Obamacare, and I still lost my dental. So... yea.

Were you underpaying before?

Are you now no longer subject to exlusions you were before?

Are your limits higher? Do you now have less financial responsibility in the contract?

Do you think the system's working now?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

For people who are annoyed at the mandatory insurance, I am annoyed at the bad debt they leave behind (when they lose the gamble and need medical care they cannot afford) that is then absorbed into my medical bills. It's either you or someone else that ends up paying for your medical expenses and I'd prefer everyone pays their own share.

 

[Newtons Bit]

Were you underpaying before?

Nope. I was(still am?) young and healthy and I was paying a reasonable rate for someone who was very low risk to serious issues.

Are you now no longer subject to exlusions you were before?

Nope. But now I have to get dental separately. Weee.

Are your limits higher? Do you now have less financial responsibility in the contract?

My maximum yearly out-of-pocket is about $1,500 lower. My deductible is the same. My monthly payments are about 1,500 per year more expensive. It'd be a wash if I was hitting my yearly max each year. But I'm not. I use the services in my insurance once a year.

Do you think the system's working now?

I think it's broken in a different way. As a Gen Y'er, I'm exceptionally annoyed that the older generations are expecting my generation to pay for their problems and mistakes (once again) instead of creating reasonable systems decades ago. We know who is responsible for this crap. And when it comes time to start cashing in the SS and Medicare IOUs previous generations created for their children to pay, they might find we're not very sympathetic.

 

[DavidJames]

I think it's broken in a different way. As a Gen Y'er, I'm exceptionally annoyed that the older generations are expecting my generation to pay for their problems and mistakes (once again) instead of creating reasonable systems decades ago. We know who is responsible for this crap. And when it comes time to start cashing in the SS and Medicare IOUs previous generations created for their children to pay, they might find we're not very sympathetic.

I love whiny temper tantrums from self centered greedy kids.

"I hope I die before I get old"

P. Townsend.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

The thing is that people who couldn't afford insurance couldn't afford medical bills either. So that isn't much of a safety net.

Why did you quote me?