Continuation Part 14: Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito

[Kauffer]

Um. As Rudy was a friend of the house residents, all he had to do was knock, or ring the door bell. If someone home, just say, hi, I was just passing.

If not, the balcony nearby was a far better bet in gaining entry, not least, because it was concealed from the road and there are no shutters in the way.

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Guede was an acquaintance of the boys downstairs and had been to their flat. He most certainly was not a friend of anybody in the upstairs flat. You do know this right? Romanelli and Mezzetti wouldn't have had a clue who he was. Amanda and Meredith may have recognised his face, but he would not have had any legitimate reason to call and would not have been met at the door with anything other than suspicion. But this was not an option for Guede in any case,

Guede likely knew the boys downstairs were away. It would be reasonable to conclude that his observations led him to believe, correctly, that the upstairs flat was empty. The rock through the window is both a final check and a method of entry - a modus operandi he was previously associated with.

The balcony is not concealed, nor is the front door. Romanelli's window makes perfect sense and fits his access point for throwing the rock - from the uncovered car port. Neither Amanda or Meredith's rooms offer the same accessibility.

A number of people here now including me have already dealt with your point about the shutters.

 

[Vixen]

WRONG WRONG WRONG. There are NO, Absolutely NO GPS records. What there are are antenna records such as Piazza Lupatelli or WIND 30064. But if you would like to attempt to prove me wrong..go for it. Come back with a cite, This has been gone over thoroughly. I personally mapped every cell tower with in miles of the cottage.

OK. I'll correct that, to say "the phone records were retrievable".

 

[carbonjam72]

Hellman said Rudy took Meredith's key to exit the apt

No. The attempted burglary was premeditated. Throwing a rock is designed to elicit a response from anyone inside. If no response, the way is clear to burgle. Unfortunately, the strategy does not take into account the coming home of a resident later. Hence, an unpremeditated murder.

Burglars, on the whole, go out of their way not to get into a confrontation. It's bad for business. I've asked a few.

My own suspicion, which I really cannot prove, is that Guede did not want to get into a fight with Kercher, would have preferred an escape, but was challenged by her in a manner, which was sufficient to cause him to attack, restrain and ultimately kill her. This would appear to have aroused him.

The front door lock was broken, and required a key to get out. When Meredith came home, she locked herself inside with Guede. Meredith's keys were never found, Rudy needed to have them in order to leave out the front door, which is the trail his footprints in wet blood demonstrate occurred.

This is all explained in Judge Hellman's excellent motivation report.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

foot tracks and DNA

Rudy's DNA = Stefanoni absolutely correct. Raf's DNA = Stefanoni is bent and the DNA contaminated.

Rudy's footprint = absolutely correct. Raf's footprint = the same expert must be bent and corrupt.

The same footprint expert (Vinci) who thought that Raf's reference footprint does not match the bloody foot track on the bathmat also pointed out certain errors that Rinaldi and Boemia made with respect to shoe prints in Meredith's room. They are different prosecution "experts" from the ones who could not or did not realize that Raf's shoes did not make the prints in the hallway (Ippolito?). Professor Vinci was right, and the prosecution's witnesses were wrong. Simples. There is no inconsistency that I can see.

The DNA is a little more complex, but I suppose since you trotted this facile argument out for one more lap, I can respond. One, you can toss all of the DNA evidence against Rudi, yet there is still enough evidence to convict him twice over BARD. The same is certainly not true of Raffaele, given that the bra clasp is the only piece of evidence against him that is even worth the bother of discussing. Two, Rudi's DNA in the flat is somewhat more damning than Raffaele's and much more damning than Amanda's if for no other reason that Raf visited there and Amanda lived there (Rudi had never previously been there). DNA cannot tell you how or when it arrived on an object (that has practically the status of an axiom among DNA profilers). Three, the bra clasp was poorly collected and was a mixture, and the knife had no blood and was low template number DNA. If the same problems were in play with respect to Rudi's DNA, then some or all of the same caveats would have to be raised. Rudi had excellent lawyers; if they didn't raise questions, that is their call.

 

[Vixen]

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Guede was an acquaintance of the boys downstairs and had been to their flat. He most certainly was not a friend of anybody in the upstairs flat. You do know this right? Romanelli and Mezzetti wouldn't have had a clue who he was. Amanda and Meredith may have recognised his face, but he would not have had any legitimate reason to call and would not have been met at the door with anything other than suspicion. But this was not an option for Guede in any case,

Guede likely knew the boys downstairs were away. It would be reasonable to conclude that his observations led him to believe, correctly, that the upstairs flat was empty. The rock through the window is both a final check and a method of entry - a modus operandi he was previously associated with.

The balcony is not concealed, nor is the front door. Romanelli's window makes perfect sense and fits his access point for throwing the rock - from the uncovered car port. Neither Amanda or Meredith's rooms offer the same accessibility.

A number of people here now including me have already dealt with your point about the shutters.

My parents' barns have wooden doors which are not exactly square, as wood gets misshapen over time. We still manage to lock them securely.

Rudy and Mez did chat to each other in passing. It was easy enough for Rudy to just knock on the door on a pretext, without embarrassment.

Rudy must have really hated Mez to have caused 43 injuries and to have taken her cash, cards and mobiles but left Filomena's laptop and jewellery. Where do you speculate this level of hatred came from?

 

[RWVBWL]

The front door lock was broken, and required a key to get out. When Meredith came home, she locked herself inside with Guede. Meredith's keys were never found, Rudy needed to have them in order to leave out the front door, which is the trail his footprints in wet blood demonstrate occurred.

This is all explained in Judge Hellman's excellent motivation report.

We really do not know if this happened,
for maybe she went downstairs to check the hurt lil' kitty and/or feed it.
Heck, she still had her jacket on...

Maybe Guede,
on the toilet heard Meredith enter and drop off her purse and that borrowed history book of Robyn's.

Suppose he came out as she grabbed the keys off the foyer holder,
and Guede followed her downstairs.

Might this be where the attack of Meredith Kercher 1st started,
which escalated when he forced Meredith upstairs at knifepoint needing $$$ and decided to sexually assault her, and things spiraled outta control then?

Just another possible scenario,
poke holes in it if ya want,
no biggie to me, friends...

RW


* * *

Rudy must have really hated Mez to have caused 43 injuries and to have taken her cash, cards and mobiles but left Filomena's laptop and jewellery. Where do you speculate this level of hatred came from?

Uh,
Rudy Guede hadn't gotten laid in a long time and
and forgot the condoms and Meredith,
who knew karate, was puttin' up a fight on their 1st date?

I don't know.
Do you?

Realistically speaking,
After Rudy went ballistic,
he grabbed what he could steal of Meredith's of value that was untraceable, took the phones too so, if she were ever to regain consciousness, she can not call 112 for help, then locked her inside her bedroom to die lying on her bloody, sperm covered pillow in her bedroom, went downstairs to freshen up and then go out dancin', ^^^^*** freak...
My opinion only,
RW

 

[Bill Williams]

My parents' barns have wooden doors which are not exactly square, as wood gets misshapen over time. We still manage to lock them securely.

Rudy and Mez did chat to each other in passing. It was easy enough for Rudy to just knock on the door on a pretext, without embarrassment.

Rudy must have really hated Mez to have caused 43 injuries and to have taken her cash, cards and mobiles but left Filomena's laptop and jewellery. Where do you speculate this level of hatred came from?

You keep asking questions, and don't answer any yourself.

Are you saying you believe Rudy, when he said that Meredith let him in, and that the sex he said they had was consensual?

 

[carbonjam72]

We really do not know if this happened,
for maybe she went downstairs to check the hurt lil' kitty and/or feed it.
Heck, she still had her jacket on...

Maybe Guede,
on the toilet heard Meredith enter and drop off her purse and that borrowed history book of Robyn's.

Suppose he came out as she grabbed the keys off the foyer holder,
and Guede followed her downstairs.

Might this be where the attack of Meredith Kercher 1st started,
which escalated when he forced Meredith upstairs at knifepoint needing $$$ and decided to sexually assault her, and things spiraled outta control then?

Just another possible scenario,
poke holes in it if ya want,
no biggie to me, friends...

RW

I'm not sure how that scenario is a better fit with the available evidence.

The fact that the majority of blood is in Kercer's room, suggests I think, that that is where the assault originated. The diluted blood drops downstairs would seem to come later, and lab results on those blood samples would be helpful were the data not also suppressed.

I like the creativeness of the effort Randy, but reality allows only one course through the world, which careful observation allows us to ever more closely approximate.

So, I guess its possible, but why suggest it? Is it possible Rudy really did have a date w/Meredith, and is innocent?

 

[HumanityBlues]

My parents' barns have wooden doors which are not exactly square, as wood gets misshapen over time. We still manage to lock them securely.

Rudy and Mez did chat to each other in passing. It was easy enough for Rudy to just knock on the door on a pretext, without embarrassment.

Rudy must have really hated Mez to have caused 43 injuries and to have taken her cash, cards and mobiles but left Filomena's laptop and jewellery. Where do you speculate this level of hatred came from?

Remember what I said about the laptop earlier y'all? Too funny. It's like every guilter suffers from the same syndrome.

 

[RWVBWL]

I'm not sure how that scenario is a better fit with the available evidence.

The fact that the majority of blood is in Kercer's room, suggests I think, that that is where the assault originated. The diluted blood drops downstairs would seem to come later, and lab results on those blood samples would be helpful were the data not also suppressed.

I like the creativeness of the effort Randy, but reality allows only one course through the world, which careful observation allows us to ever more closely approximate.

So, I guess its possible, but why suggest it? Is it possible Rudy really did have a date w/Meredith, and is innocent?

Hi CarbonJam!
I seem to recall Grinder believes that Rudi might have had a date with Meredith, was indeed possible,
but hey, I'll let him chime in soon to collaborate this...
RW

 

[Kauffer]

My parents' barns have wooden doors which are not exactly square, as wood gets misshapen over time. We still manage to lock them securely.

Rudy and Mez did chat to each other in passing. It was easy enough for Rudy to just knock on the door on a pretext, without embarrassment.

Rudy must have really hated Mez to have caused 43 injuries and to have taken her cash, cards and mobiles but left Filomena's laptop and jewellery. Where do you speculate this level of hatred came from?

I don't know what your parents' barn doors have to do with this. There is no evidence the outside shutters were locked, and as Dan pointed out earlier, there is evidence that the interior shutters were not latched. You see the lump taken out of the right side by the rock?

If I chatted to you "in passing" vixen, and a day or two later showed up at your house, apparently hoping to be invited inside, what kind of a welcome would I get? But your argument neglects Guede's style and the housebreaker's marque - avoid contact with people. This guy likes windows and he's a wiry climber. Remember, if nobody is home , he still has to get in. And, the front door is more exposed than Romanelli's window. But, if you want to write to him and tell him where he's been going wrong, I'm sure he'll take note of it for when they have to let him out of prison.

As for your last paragraph, as I have previously suggested, after the killing, he's really not thinking about computers - he's got more important things to worry about. More than that, you don't really want to risk getting caught in possession of stolen computers or linked to them when you try to sell them on when said computers come from a dead girl's flat you've tried to burgle, after you've killed her. That seems pretty obvious right?

I infer from the attack on Kercher, a cornered animal - and we know his reaction to being cornered when trying to burgle from before. I'm speculating, but I think he tried to get out the door, found he couldn't, went looking for the keys, got challenged by Kercher who he might not even have realised had returned (and she certainly didn't know he was there). The violence escalates, he gets angrier and angrier (and she is not complying), probably has some kind of episode, ends up slaughtering her and finds himself sexually aroused by the encounter.

 

[Strozzi]

You reference one of the great holes in the PGP's theories. If they went to the trouble of all the premeditation and needed planning including turning off the phones, sneaking the knife through the streets, the theft from Q's store of the mop head, disposing of a knife and bloody clothes and shoes, the hoover DNA dial-a-matic cleanup, etc. ; yet they forgot to have basic coordination of their stories? They turned off their phones (hello the unanswered calls would be recorded so no benefit) but didn't agree the reason was not to be disturbed? Hogwash. Horse pucky.

One other thing wrong is that Amanda and Rudi really did not speak a mutually intelligible language. Rudi did not speak English, or German for that matter. (Knowing a few phrases doesn't count.). Amanda had been in Italy for six weeks. She probably did not speak enough Italian to command Rudi directly like a Luciferina must do to order her sniveling man-boys to rape and slash.

 

[bagels]

My parents' barns have wooden doors which are not exactly square, as wood gets misshapen over time. We still manage to lock them securely.

Rudy and Mez did chat to each other in passing. It was easy enough for Rudy to just knock on the door on a pretext, without embarrassment.

Rudy must have really hated Mez to have caused 43 injuries and to have taken her cash, cards and mobiles but left Filomena's laptop and jewellery. Where do you speculate this level of hatred came from?

We don't know that he didn't knock on the door and then proceed to break-in through the window when nobody answered.

It seems odd that Amanda would go to both sets of shutters firmly shut and locked and proceeded to unlock and open them from the inside to clear a path for the simulated rock throw without thinking about the contradiction. But then again she did tell the police she invited the murderer in through the front door five days later without remembering she did the staging so she's obviously not too bright.

As for poor Rudy, if he can become sexually aroused at the sight of a terrified/dying woman being assaulted, and proceed to sexually assault her, as it is will established he did, I'm quite confident he could also inflict any number of injuries upon her.

 

[Dan O.]

OK. I'll correct that, to say "the phone records were retrievable".

What was the location of Raffaele's phone when his father sent the text message at 23:41:11 on November 1, 2007?

 

[Kauffer]

We don't know that he didn't knock on the door and then proceed to break-in through the window when nobody answered.

It seems odd that Amanda would go to both sets of shutters firmly shut and locked and proceeded to unlock and open them from the inside to clear a path for the simulated rock throw without thinking about the contradiction. But then again she did tell the police she invited the murderer in through the front door five days later without remembering she did the staging so she's obviously not too bright.

As for poor Rudy, if he can become sexually aroused at the sight of a terrified/dying woman being assaulted, and proceed to sexually assault her, as it is will established he did, I'm quite confident he could also inflict any number of injuries upon her.

This is an excellent point. We also have to remember that a shard of glass from Romanelli's window was found in one of Guede's bloody shoe prints in Meredith's room. So, this means we can say with certainty that someone went into Meredith's room AFTER Romanelli's window was broken.

Therefore, if there was a post murder staging of the break in by a murderous Amanda and Raffaele, then minimally, she or Raffaele would not only have been in Meredith's room while the murder took place, but would have left the room after the murder, walked into Romanelli's room to stage the break in, collect the shard (either deliberately or incidentally) AND walked back into Meredith's room in order to deposit it there.

There are no prints consistent with such an activity. There is no evidence of Amanda or Raffaele having walked either in Meredith's or Romanelli's room. And if one of them had, then it is inconceivable that such prints would not be bloody and discoverable.

 

[Dan O.]

I don't know what your parents' barn doors have to do with this. There is no evidence the outside shutters were locked, and as Dan pointed out earlier, there is evidence that the interior shutters were not latched. You see the lump taken out of the right side by the rock?

Let's be accurate here. Presuming that someone didn't spend hours staging the crime scene and all is as it appears: The latch for the main window is also the latch for the right interior shutter. That latch is presumed to have been closed otherwise there is no need to break the window to get in (and other evidence having to do with where glass was found on the window sill). The Right inner shutter cannot have been closed or it would have been latched and there is no damage to the latch or shutter indicating that it was latched when the rock came through. The left inner shutter has a separate latch and this was closed in the first police photos indicating that it was probably closed through the night.

 

[Vixen]

You keep asking questions, and don't answer any yourself.

Are you saying you believe Rudy, when he said that Meredith let him in, and that the sex he said they had was consensual?

Rudy is a pathological liar. I do not believe a single word he says. So he was sitting on the loo when the murder happened? How convenient. (Pun intended.)

 

[acbytesla]

OK. I'll correct that, to say "the phone records were retrievable".

No offense Vixen. You clearly do not understand this very well. Phones are multi-frequency radio transceivers. They are constantly sending out pings omnidirectionally, (in every direction) Their signals are received by cell tower antennas. The towers are connected to the telephone network and other antennas through land lines. Each cell tower is managed by a computer called a base station. Each base station sees every signal from the phones within range. Based upon signal strength, call volume and sometimes other parameters, the base stations decide together, which cell tower and which frequency will handle the call.

What you don't understand is while the base stations do log calls, it varies tremendously what data they log. This varies from carrier to carrier and from base station to base station. Sometimes pings are recorded and sometimes they are not.

Also, and this is very important. Just because the network can't see you, doesn't mean that you turned off your phone. So if you are behind a thick wall, it would appear exactly as if you turned off your phone.

 

[Vixen]

We don't know that he didn't knock on the door and then proceed to break-in through the window when nobody answered.

It seems odd that Amanda would go to both sets of shutters firmly shut and locked and proceeded to unlock and open them from the inside to clear a path for the simulated rock throw without thinking about the contradiction. But then again she did tell the police she invited the murderer in through the front door five days later without remembering she did the staging so she's obviously not too bright.

As for poor Rudy, if he can become sexually aroused at the sight of a terrified/dying woman being assaulted, and proceed to sexually assault her, as it is will established he did, I'm quite confident he could also inflict any number of injuries upon her.

The theory put forward here is, that although Filomena said she pulled the shutters to, before leaving for the weekend, she could not latch them as one was deformed and were not square.

My point was, from the outside, from the ground, could anyone looking up decide they were unlocked, just because they are not square? Noting lack of cohesion doesn't work, cos any fule kno that a long latch across the offending shutter can still secure it, perhaps by a padlock.

 

[Grinder]

It cannot be assumed - as the Defence Consultant did - that the shutters were left completely open, since this contradicts the declarations of Romanelli, which appear to be detailed and entirely likely, considering that she was actually leaving for the holiday and had some things of value in her room; already she did not feel quite safe because window-frames were in wood [38] without any grille. Also, the circumstance of the shutters being wide open does not correspond to their position when they were found and described by witnesses on November 2, and photographed (cf. photo 11 already mentioned).

The window that couldn't possibly be one chosen was the window F closed the shutters on because "considering that she was actually leaving for the holiday and had some things of value in her room; already she did not feel quite safe because window-frames were in wood [38] without any grille."

And on the day she went away, she recalled "having closed them because I knew that I would be away for a couple of days" (p. 96). She later added, when noting what she had declared on December 3, 2007, that "I had pulled the shutters together, but I don't think I closed them tight" (p. 115).

Funny, she didn't close them tight. Soooo worried about someone breaking in the impossible climb window, yet didn't even close them tight. Definitely didn't lock them then. Maybe not like barn doorsd.