Is there a legitimate reason to question the official narrative*?

[Tony Szamboti]

So is that a no?

You haven't actually shown anything. You've denied a lot.

I showed you and the others here why it could not have happened the way NIST wants to allege.

If you want to be an ostrich go ahead.

 

[Spanx]

Everyone I talk to outside of the regulars on this forum agrees with what I am saying when I give the explanations I did here. It does make one wonder about the regulars like you here.

Perhaps you should get out a bit more often then.

 

[Animal]

Everyone I talk to outside of the regulars on this forum agrees with what I am saying when I give the explanations I did here. It does make one wonder about the regulars like you here.

As most people do when confronted with some one that is bat **** crazy......you keep nodding your head in agreement hoping the go away soon, and then just shake your head in amazement at the "crazy"

 

[JayUtah]

Everyone I talk to outside of the regulars on this forum agrees with what I am saying when I give the explanations I did here.

Then where's your Nobel Prize?

 

[Animal]

I showed you and the others here why it could not have happened the way NIST wants to allege.

If you want to be an ostrich go ahead.

You have shown nothing.....all you have done is proclaimed your fantasy over and over....will 0 proof.

It doesn't matter what NIST said or thought....the inward bowing HAPPPED minutes before the collapse. You fantasy CD is left in shreds.

 

[DGM]

I showed you and the others here why it could not have happened the way NIST wants to allege.

If you want to be an ostrich go ahead.

I'm sorry, I must have missed it. Could you quote the post for me? Thanks.

 

[JayUtah]

If you want to be an ostrich go ahead.

The "ostriches" are the ones who agree with how ninety-nine point five percent of your stated profession approach your technical arguments.

 

[NoahFence]

Video at least has a lot more problems being manipulated and it has inherent timing and other things going on which could corroborate it.

Don't forget what I am saying is also buttressed by the fact that NIST could not supply a mechanism for inward bowing of the south face of the North Tower occurring minutes before its collapse.

LOL

"Supply a mechanism" must be the new "testable theory"....

 

[pgimeno]

By 1988 are you referring to when they put in the changes due to Northridge?

[OT] Funny that, yours was post #1988. What are the chances?

A: 100%, because it happened. A principle some truthers fail to grasp.

 

[pgimeno]

It is pretty clear that someone at NIST fraudulently changed the timing of when the inward bowing occurred to fit a story they wanted to tell rather than what really happened. Unfortunately for them their story doesn't work without a mechanism to cause the inward bowing minutes before collapse. The inward bowing could only have occurred when the core dropped during the collapse initiation.

You can't blame NIST without also blaming Greg Semendinger from the NYPD, who has provided the photos with EXIF data that disprove your made-up claims.

Semendinger said he gave the digital images to the 9/11 Commission and believes those images were released by the NSIT [sic]. In the days after the attack, he e-mailed some of the photos to friends and several were posted on the Internet.​

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/02/10/new-911-aerial-photos-rel_n_457163.html

 

[GlennB]

I think someone at NIST changed the time on the photos to support the story they wanted to tell.

I've also pointed out, multiple times, that the angle of the photos changes, indicating a moving helicopter. Therefore they're genuine or totally photoshopped. Editing the time alone can't explain them.

Comments?

 

[tsig]

Apparently, no, you haven't, because Tony says nobody has.

It's getting rather pointless to argue any more, because Tony simply is not living in the real world. It's the classic woo peddler's argument; if the evidence doesn't agree with the theory, then the evidence must be ignored.

Dave

Much like the creationists," If reality doesn't agree with the bible it's wrong".

 

[tsig]

NIST couldn't provide a mechanism to cause inward bowing minutes before the collapse and apparently neither can anyone here. I just said I can't think of one either.

I have also said I can provide a mechanism to cause it but that can only happen at the time of collapse. That is the core falling and pulling the exterior columns inward and causing them to buckle under their own load due to eccentricity and p-delta effects. That is likely what the photos are of, with the time changed by someone to fit a story they wanted to try and tell differently than the way it really happened.

Now we have time altering ninjas along with the arsonist and explosive rigger ninjas.

The conspiracy grows wider, how soon til it engulfs you Tony?

 

[Grizzly Bear]

The photo manipulation angle is just the latest... Between WTC 7 and the WTC 1 discussion we've had these points made "in support" of CD:

• The fairy tale about the hijacker passport being found two blocks from the North Tower.
• Everyone [he] talk to outside of the regulars on this forum agrees with what [he's] saying when [he] give the explanations [he] did here.
  [*]No inward bowing of perimeter columns and denial of any mechanism related to the known conditions
  [*]Ad homs:

  This seems to be just sore loser garbage talk because you don't like to be shown your theory is nonsense and isn't what happened.

  [*]90% of posters denying his line of events are likely shills for the government
  [*]Bazants' "crush down" limiting case requires there to be a jolt that was not observed in the real world events
  [*]Not much of [burning debris] material made it to WTC 7.
  [*]Have never seen the perimeter fall over towards WTC 7
  [*]No legitimate way to start the fires in WTC 7.
  [*]Fires didn't show up [in WTC 7] until nearly two hours [after the collapse of WTC 1]
  [*]Arsonists started the fires in WTC 7
  [*]Thermite ejecting from the buildings at various points are the only things that could ignite adjacent cars and debris
  [*]Time stamps on photos have been fudged
  
  

I'm pretty sure I am missing some things but I'm noticing a pattern here. Lots of doubt casting based on denial and insinuation, and nothing concretely demonstrating a case for "CD" with hard evidence more than capable of overriding the observed conditions. Somebody want to start adding to this list and linking to the examples for each one?

I see arguing this as all over the map, against reality, using innuendo, and strictly avoiding a concrete evidence based approach to proving "CD".

 

[LSSBB]

Much like the creationists," If reality doesn't agree with the bible it's wrong".

That's it, the devil faked those pictures of bowing!

Seriously, why do wooists make things up to validate things they made up? "This had to be CD, so the photo times had to be fake". Except add this to a refusal to admit any explanation for a mechanism because a) " NIST" and b) "because I say so" and you have quadrupally recursive fail. It's fail all the way down.

Say, I don't see Tony addressing Chainsaw's request for backing on Tony's claim regarding Dr. Greening. That discussion seems more germane to the OP anyway.

 

[Seymour Butz]

NIST couldn't provide a mechanism to cause inward bowing minutes before the collapse and apparently neither can anyone here. I just said I can't think of one either.

I have also said I can provide a mechanism to cause it but that can only happen at the time of collapse. That is the core falling and pulling the exterior columns inward and causing them to buckle under their own load due to eccentricity and p-delta effects. That is likely what the photos are of, with the time changed by someone to fit a story they wanted to try and tell differently than the way it really happened.

Are you aware that Major Tom has documented, and rather convincingly, that the core columns above floor 98 were bolted, rather than welded?

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=6094100#post6094100

This may be mechanism that you are looking for:

1- truss sag and increased load on the exterior columns are not able to cause inward bowing. NIST needs to add in another 6kip pull to make it happen.

2- The columns above 98 are bolted together. A few of the bolted connections fail, resulting in the core columns "hanging". Would a few "hanging" core columns should be able to provide another 6kip pull in?

 

[Dave Rogers]

Say, I don't see Tony addressing Chainsaw's request for backing on Tony's claim regarding Dr. Greening. That discussion seems more germane to the OP anyway.

From the way Frank was going just before he got banned here, it wouldn't surprise me. He was one of the best tests for sceptical thinking I ever encountered here, in that his work on the collapse dynamics and energetics was very good and stood on its own merits, whereas his later theories on exotic incendiaries were very clearly completely divorced from the evidence at hand; it was a valuable lesson that one should not believe something simply because the person saying it has a good record of being right in the past, but that every theory should be evaluated on its own merits. Sadly, his later ideas failed that test quite convincingly.

Dave

 

[Oystein]

The "ostriches" are the ones who agree with how ninety-nine point five percent of your stated profession approach your technical arguments.

Actually ninety-nine point nine-five percent of Tony's colleagues have so far not signed up to his delusions. This includes ninety-nine point nine-five percent of all engineers in Tony's home city and region that he has failed to reach and convince.

 

[carlitos]

Tony:

A research project for you. Go to any city with steel high-rises and ask fire fighters what the phase, "Don't trust the trusses" means.

I think someone at NIST changed the time on the photos to support the story they wanted to tell.

LOL. Paranoia will destroy ya.

Now we have time altering ninjas along with the arsonist and explosive rigger ninjas.

The conspiracy grows wider, how soon til it engulfs you Tony?

No kidding. These ninjas - they are everywhere.

That Bush administration sure was competent. No secrets ever leaked; no policies were ever screwed up and backfired. No tell-all books every told the inside story. An amazing, all-encompassing super-duper machine of evil, and they would have gotten away with it all, if not for geniuses like Craig Ranke and Dylan Avery, along with some high school physics teachers and mormon fantasists.

 

[abaddon]

Now we have time altering ninjas along with the arsonist and explosive rigger ninjas.

The conspiracy grows wider, how soon til it engulfs you Tony?

It's hard to keep track but so far we seem to have:

1 Invisible ninjas who place conventional explosives.
2. Invisible ninjas who place thermite. Or thermate or whatever
3. Invisible ninjas who weaken structures.
4. Invisible ninjas who alter photographs, or video if it suits them.
5. Invisible ninjas who alter collapse speeds at a whim.
6. Invisible ninjas who create fires that must be simultaneously to hot and too cool.
7. Invisible ninjas who create squibs and dets which nobody sees. Or hears. Or witnesses. Or photographs.

I could extend that list, but what is the point? Tony cares not a whit.
8.