Merged Continuation - Feminist Bullies Tearing the Video Game Industry Apart Part II

[TeapotCavalry]

This kind of thing confuses me.

You seem to want to be able to represent gamergate at will, or not represent it at will.

You seem to want to be able to speak for gamergate at will, or not speak for gamergate at will.

You seem to want to be able to declare exactly what gamergate is and isn't at will, but also to deny anyone else's claims about gamergate, because gamergate is everything and nothing.

I alone do not represent gamergate, I've said this before many times. Check what the majority do in KiA, if that is still unclear. I'm reporting what I'm seeing gamergaters as a whole do and want, not what I personally do and want.

You seem to want to be able to redefine gamergate's history completely at will, so the discreditable origins and actions of the gamergate community somehow never manage to count against it, because it's different now, or it's someone else, or you never saw me do it, and you can't prove anything, and it could have been a false flag!

No need to redefine the history. Everything's archived and plain to see to anyone willing to take a look. The facts are there, I'm merely following them. You and other anti-GG folks have been asserting things that simply are not true about the history of GG, obvious by the consistent lack of evidence to back up your claims.

Do you see why people tend to think gamergaters are, as a group, dishonest actors who have no interest in open discussion, and who are just repeating whatever talking points they think will best serve them at just that time?

Remind me again, who's blocking who, who never has anyone pro-GG stating their position in their articles, who never accept invites to public debates, who disable comments, who delete threads after threads of discussion, who b a n people from expos because of political disagreement?
And we're the ones not willing to discuss?
Wow.

 

[TeapotCavalry]

If you can't respond to a short, simple, straightforward and sensible article without resorting to inarticulate scatology that doesn't convey the message that you have rational criticisms to share.

As far as I can see he's completely right. Rape is a thing that has happened, and does happen, and will continue to happen, and art should have the option of being about things that happen, including bad things. In fact literature that isn't about bad things risks being boring.

There's a nutty fringe movement in feminism that wants to declare rape to be Their Special Sacred Thing, that only they may speak of, and even then only in the specified and appropriate tones. I see no particular reason to respect this demand or those who make it. I think those specific people are not only irrational but do more harm than good to feminism with their self-indulgent, divisive antics.

You can't claim a kind of crime as your special private property.

We don't see eye to eye with this GamerGate thing, but this is extremely well said.

 

[Axiom_Blade]

That's fine. I disagree and think that "her" being trans and a spoiled little baby who was given everything by wealthy parents is perfectly relevant given the BS "she" constantly spreads and supports.

You should drop the scare quotes around pronouns. She is not a "she". Transwomen are women by any reasonable definition of the word. Moreover, it discredits your cause (whatever that is), makes you look like a bigot, and is a huge ad hominem.

 

[cntdrv55]

You should drop the scare quotes around pronouns. She is not a "she".

You're right, he doesn't even come close enough to passing as a female to be called "she". My mistake... I'll go back to using "him" from now on. Better?

Transwomen are women by any reasonable definition of the word.

False.

Moreover, it discredits your cause (whatever that is),

Only to people that are already desperately trying to discredit an entire group.

makes you look like a bigot

Only to SJW neo-fascists that get offended by everything. Won't keep me up at night.

and is a huge ad hominem.

Oh no! An ad hominem! Yeah I probably shouldn't argue that one since you guys (omg such sexist language, triggered) are foremost experts on those and know best.

 

[Stout]

You're right, he doesn't even come close enough to passing as a female to be called "she". My mistake... I'll go back to using "him" from now on. Better?

You could always go for the gender neutral pronouns like zim or zer or xim if you're adverse to calling Wu a woman.

After reading Wu's screed on male privilege wrt the spilled drink on the plane incident I'm convinced Wu is nothing more than an attention seeking clown who is using victim feminism to reinforce an outdated gender binarist veiwpoint.

Using gender neural pronouns will deny Wu that sought after binarist identity and avoid derails over misgendering.

 

[Axiom_Blade]

You're right, he doesn't even come close enough to passing as a female to be called "she". My mistake... I'll go back to using "him" from now on. Better?

I've seen cis women who looked a lot more masculine than Brianna does. Are they not women, either? There are even cis women who can grow mustaches! They must be men, too!

False.

"Gender" is a construct that is independent of "sex" (what's between your legs). When the two don't match up, you get a trans-person.

Only to people that are already desperately trying to discredit an entire group.

Sure. Why are you giving them ammo, though?

Oh no! An ad hominem! Yeah I probably shouldn't argue that one since you guys (omg such sexist language, triggered) are foremost experts on those and know best.

Who are "you guys"? Who are you talking to here?

 

[Wildy]

You're right, he doesn't even come close enough to passing as a female to be called "she". My mistake... I'll go back to using "him" from now on. Better?

No. That's actually worse. I agree with Stout and think you should probably use a gender neutral pronoun.

Only to SJW neo-fascists that get offended by everything. Won't keep me up at night.

As someone who isn't an SJW neo-fascist I can say your views make you look like a bigot. Then again maybe it's because I don't view trans people as mentally ill.

After reading Wu's screed on male privilege wrt the spilled drink on the plane incident I'm convinced Wu is nothing more than an attention seeking clown who is using victim feminism to reinforce an outdated gender binarist veiwpoint.

Also profit. Victim feminism is surprisingly profitable if you play your cards right.

 

[Cl1mh4224rd]

If you're against free expression of ideas, fairness and equality, then you're against #gamergate. It really is that simple.

Is criticism of someone's bigotry actually a criticism of free expression in your mind?

 

[Babbylonian]

Is criticism of someone's bigotry actually a criticism of free expression in your mind?

It's one of the more common attempted "gotchas," where criticizing what someone has to say is equated with denying their right to say it. It's lame nonsense, of course. While I'm in favor of restrictions on specific kinds of speech (such as threats of physical violence), in general I think everyone should be free to say as many ignorant, foolish things as they want.

 

[Kevin_Lowe]

Is criticism of someone's bigotry actually a criticism of free expression in your mind?

Straw man! The Gamergaters are of course actually concerned about places like 4chan declining to be a staging ground for their campaigns to harass and deceive, which was a terrible restriction of their inalienable right to freely express whatever ideas or plans they like, on whatever forum they like, whenever they like.

It's nearly as bad as people not enabling comments on a YouTube video! Seldom have any group of people been more oppressed.

 

[cntdrv55]

You could always go for the gender neutral pronouns like zim or zer or xim if you're adverse to calling Wu a woman.

I could, but I think those are ridiculous.

After reading Wu's screed on male privilege wrt the spilled drink on the plane incident I'm convinced Wu is nothing more than an attention seeking clown who is using victim feminism to reinforce an outdated gender binarist veiwpoint.

There it is. This poster gets it. The contradictory and hypocritical nature of "his/her's/whatever's" actions are worth noting when they are the self proclaimed "most harassed person ever".

Using gender neural pronouns will deny Wu that sought after binarist identity and avoid derails over misgendering.

Good call. My bad.

 

[cntdrv55]

I've seen cis women who looked a lot more masculine than Brianna does. Are they not women, either? There are even cis women who can grow mustaches! They must be men, too!

No, if they were born as a woman then they are a woman to me. Regardless of their facial hair.

"Gender" is a construct that is independent of "sex" (what's between your legs). When the two don't match up, you get a trans-person.

No. Gender is not a bleeping construct. It is very simple and scientific. People like you trying to redefine very simple things to suit your social justice agenda is a big part of what is pissing people off these days. If I want to call brianna wu a man and be an ***hole, that's my *********** right and I'll just have to deal with the consequences of that. Your side's "safe spaces" and "gender neutral zones" and treating everybody like a special snowflake that must be sheltered is pissing more and more "normal" and ""regular" people off.

Sure. Why are you giving them ammo, though?

Because that is what people reply to. I can make a perfectly rational point about the ethics side of gamergate, or see somebody like TeapotCalvary make 5 posts in a row that are filled with good rational points, and everyone on the anti side seems to grow blinders or just flat out refuse to reply.

But god forbid I say brianna wu is actually a man... then we get 15-20 different people jumping in ready to call be a bigot because I think ze still qualifies as a "privileged spoiled white man" and should just STFU with the whole "self promoted spokesperson for the poor unprivileged minority harassed women out there" thing.

Who are "you guys"? Who are you talking to here?

This debate is, if nothing else, great at creating sides. So "you guys" are the ones that keep quoting my posts picking at things instead of digesting the overall points. I'm willing to bet it will happen again right here with this post and I'll get selectively quoted to "highlight my bigotry" and paint the entire group of gamergaters as a transphobic intolerant bunch of people.

 

[cntdrv55]

No. That's actually worse. I agree with Stout and think you should probably use a gender neutral pronoun.

Noted.

As someone who isn't an SJW neo-fascist I can say your views make you look like a bigot.

Ok. Well. Uhm. Thanks?

Then again maybe it's because I don't view trans people as mentally ill.

You should. Gender Identity Disorder is literally and scientifically classified as a mental illness.

Also profit. Victim feminism is surprisingly profitable if you play your cards right.

 

[cntdrv55]

in general I think everyone should be free to say as many ignorant, foolish things as they want.

Oh. So you're a filthy gator then? Definitely not left/PC/fascist enough for the anti side, so you must be a misogynist racist sexist white male. Welcome aboard. Don't worry you can say whatever you want here.

 

[cntdrv55]

It's nearly as bad as people not enabling comments on a YouTube video! Seldom have any group of people been more oppressed.

 

[Primus]

[qimg]http://media0.giphy.com/media/14smAwp2uHM3Di/giphy.gif[/qimg]

Buzzfeed is that way mate ----------------->

 

[TeapotCavalry]

Is criticism of someone's bigotry actually a criticism of free expression in your mind?

No.
Now you only have to convince us that advocacy of free expression is bigotry.

ETA: but I think we both now the crutch of the problem is not what is free expression and what is bigotry, but what actions and beliefs are actually attributed to the gamergate movement. If you think gamergate movement is intolerant and prejudice, you ought to make a case for it.

From what is ostensibly visible is that gamergate movement fights against bigotry.

 

[Butter!]

No.
Now you only have to convince us that advocacy of free expression is bigotry.

Advocacy of free expression is not bigotry.

Saying transwomen are men is widely viewed as bigotry.

Calling someone a bigot for expressing what I feel are bigoted opinions is me exercising MY freedom to to also express MY opinions. I don't want to silence anybody. I will, however, disagree until the cows come home if that's what I feel like doing, and I may eventually decide the person with whom I'm disagreeing is a tool.

This is not censorship. This is subjective experience.

 

[TeapotCavalry]

You should. Gender Identity Disorder is literally and scientifically classified as a mental illness.

I think that's starting to derail the thread.
How about not making it an issue how she identifies herself as?

 

[TeapotCavalry]

Advocacy of free expression is not bigotry.

Saying transwomen are men is widely viewed as bigotry.

Calling someone a bigot for expressing what I feel are bigoted opinions is me exercising MY freedom to to also express MY opinions. I don't want to silence anybody. I will, however, disagree until the cows come home if that's what I feel like doing, and I may eventually decide the person with whom I'm disagreeing is a tool.

This is not censorship. This is subjective experience.

Transgender issues has nothing to do with gamergate. If you have a problem with how cntdrv55 refers to transpeople, that's between you and him/her/[insert pronoun]. This is not a gamergate issue. Don't try to make it a gamergate issue.