So what are we supposed to believe?

[Cainkane1]

I read two science articles. One said that astronomers have discovered what could be 11 billion planets in the goldilocks zone hinting that there could be life on these planets. Then another article soon after said that astronomers after careful study of the universe they could find no sign of an advanced civilization or even a hint of life.

So what should a layman be thinking?

 

[Stee]

Any chance of a link to these so we can take a look?

The paradox of lots of possible planets for habitation verses no sign of life is a facinating one to me and we are no closer to finding any answers right now.

We are getting better at being able to detect possible signs of life though so maybe we are getting closer to being able to confirm extra terrestrial life of some sort!!

 

[The Don]

I read two science articles. One said that astronomers have discovered what could be 11 billion planets in the goldilocks zone hinting that there could be life on these planets. Then another article soon after said that astronomers after careful study of the universe they could find no sign of an advanced civilization or even a hint of life.

So what should a layman be thinking?

The layman should be thinking that they were probably very sloppily written articles. The 11 billion is a WAG and there's no way that astronomers have carefully studied our galaxy, much less the entire universe.

Looking at the Earth, it's only in the last 100 years or so that we've been doing things that are detectable off-planet. Of course that assumes that what we're doing is compatible with the detectors and that the detectors are sensitive enough to pick up what we're doing.

 

[MG1962]

I read two science articles. One said that astronomers have discovered what could be 11 billion planets in the goldilocks zone hinting that there could be life on these planets. Then another article soon after said that astronomers after careful study of the universe they could find no sign of an advanced civilization or even a hint of life.

So what should a layman be thinking?

Life does not equal ET. Life on Earth has been around for 3.5 billion years. Life capable of communicating across the stars, less than 100 years

 

[Cainkane1]

I lways thought that while its very doubtable that aliens will ever come to us or we will ever be able to go to them but it would be nice to contact an alien civiliaation and exchange philosophies and technology.

 

[Dancing David]

I lways thought that while its very doubtable that aliens will ever come to us or we will ever be able to go to them but it would be nice to contact an alien civiliaation and exchange philosophies and technology.

Well the lag time on interstellar internet is rather daunting....

 

[Trebuchet]

There's really no contradiction between the articles. It's a given that there are lots of planets probably capable of supporting life. And it's a fact that we currently have no way of detecting it, other than possible radio signals.

 

[phunk]

Then another article soon after said that astronomers after careful study of the universe they could find no sign of an advanced civilization or even a hint of life.

If this is the one I think you're referring to, they were looking for extremely advanced life that had colonized entire galaxies and filled them with dyson spheres to the point that they had a specific infrared signature.

 

[MG1962]

I lways thought that while its very doubtable that aliens will ever come to us or we will ever be able to go to them but it would be nice to contact an alien civiliaation and exchange philosophies and technology.

Which would quickly be supplanted by porn and reality TV shows

 

[Ziggurat]

Well the lag time on interstellar internet is rather daunting....

Long ping times really screw up those League of Legend matches.

 

[tsig]

I read two science articles. One said that astronomers have discovered what could be 11 billion planets in the goldilocks zone hinting that there could be life on these planets. Then another article soon after said that astronomers after careful study of the universe they could find no sign of an advanced civilization or even a hint of life.

So what should a layman be thinking?

That the speed of light is an absolute barrier.

 

[Spindrift]

The rest of the universe doesn't want us to know they are there. We're the cousin Eddie of the universe.

ETA:

 

[Beelzebuddy]

As soon as we start capturing a significant percentage of our own sun's power output, I'm sure a representative from the Stellar Neighborhood Housing Administration will be along to cite our civilization for impacting the "scenic views" of others' sky.

 

[casebro]

Supposing that an alien civilization has interstellar travel fueled by an as yet unknown to us source, and travel via some physics also unknown to us- wormhole, folding, "transporter". Would they also have some kind of communications so advanced we couldn't eavesdrop on it? Think cell phone frequency jumping in AM days. But not even in the EMFs, but via wormholes etc. If one is possible, aren't the others? Does SETI even know what to look for in the physics that is either unknown to us, or impossible.

 

[Ziggurat]

Supposing that an alien civilization has interstellar travel fueled by an as yet unknown to us source, and travel via some physics also unknown to us- wormhole, folding, "transporter". Would they also have some kind of communications so advanced we couldn't eavesdrop on it? Think cell phone frequency jumping in AM days. But not even in the EMFs, but via wormholes etc. If one is possible, aren't the others? Does SETI even know what to look for in the physics that is either unknown to us, or impossible.

What data transfer method has the highest bandwidth?

1) Ethernet
2) Fiber Optic cable
3) Truck

The correct answer is 3. Stuff your data on storage devices, load them up on a truck, and drive it where you want it to go. You can deliver more data, and faster, with a truck than you can over wires or fiber optic cable.

What's the relevance here? Simply this: any method for transportation of physical objects will work with data as well, and often quite well. If aliens can move physical objects at speeds faster than light, why wouldn't they move data the same way? It seems natural that they would. And since we have no idea how faster than light transportation works (if it works), we cannot know what to look for to see it. That applies both to travel and to communication.

 

[casebro]

What data transfer method has the highest bandwidth?

1) Ethernet
2) Fiber Optic cable
3) Truck

The correct answer is 3. Stuff your data on storage devices, load them up on a truck, and drive it where you want it to go. You can deliver more data, and faster, with a truck than you can over wires or fiber optic cable.

What's the relevance here? Simply this: any method for transportation of physical objects will work with data as well, and often quite well. If aliens can move physical objects at speeds faster than light, why wouldn't they move data the same way? It seems natural that they would. And since we have no idea how faster than light transportation works (if it works), we cannot know what to look for to see it. That applies both to travel and to communication.

And that is why it is useless to look for a further advanced civilization. Flip side, it's also a waste of time to look for an equal level of civilization, those signals can't reach us.

Other fields of endeavor have made useful side discoveries. AIDS research brought us anti-virals. The space race boosted technologies in several fields. Has SETI?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

The layman should be thinking that they were probably very sloppily written articles. The 11 billion is a WAG and there's no way that astronomers have carefully studied our galaxy, much less the entire universe....

I don't know what the number actually is but I think we are collecting a big enough sample to calculate the average number of Goldilocks planets per star and we have an idea (I would think) of the number of stars in the galaxy. So they need not study the whole galaxy.

... And it's a fact that we currently have no way of detecting it, other than possible radio signals.

Which take light years to get anywhere.

What data transfer method has the highest bandwidth?

1) Ethernet
2) Fiber Optic cable
3) Truck

The correct answer is 3. Stuff your data on storage devices, load them up on a truck, and drive it where you want it to go. You can deliver more data, and faster, with a truck than you can over wires or fiber optic cable....

That might be true over a short distance. But intuitively it would seem there must be a break even point where distance trumps volume. In other words, which is faster if you were delivering the data to the other side of the planet?

 

[blutoski]

I read two science articles. One said that astronomers have discovered what could be 11 billion planets in the goldilocks zone hinting that there could be life on these planets. Then another article soon after said that astronomers after careful study of the universe they could find no sign of an advanced civilization or even a hint of life.

So what should a layman be thinking?

Looks like you're asking about Fermi Paradox^WP ?

 

[p0lka]

I read two science articles. One said that astronomers have discovered what could be 11 billion planets in the goldilocks zone hinting that there could be life on these planets. Then another article soon after said that astronomers after careful study of the universe they could find no sign of an advanced civilization or even a hint of life.

So what should a layman be thinking?

That there might be a lot of life out there, but we haven't found the means to detect it yet,

 

[casebro]

That there might be a lot of life out there, but we haven't found the means to detect it yet,

I like the way you get to the heart of the problem.


Glass half full or half empty? Neither, the glass is too big for the contents.