Merged Scientology in decline\High noon...

Filippo Lippi said:
Just read about the cruel punishments that LRH meted out to the original Sea Org - what an absolutely monstrous individual.
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It was that in "Going Clear" which made me change my mind about Hubbard:Up until then I just considered him a con man and a fraud;and that the really abusive side of COS did not come in until Misciviage took over;but now I consider Hubbard a psychotic monster,and that abuses in the COS started with Hubbard, Misciviage just got it organized and took it to a new level.
 
dudalb said:
It was that in "Going Clear" which made me change my mind about Hubbard:Up until then I just considered him a con man and a fraud;and that the really abusive side of COS did not come in until Misciviage took over;but now I consider Hubbard a psychotic monster,and that abuses in the COS started with Hubbard, Misciviage just got it organized and took it to a new level.
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The really monstrous thing is what they do to children.

The future of Scientology:

This shows how the present situation came to be and speculates on what might happen.
I have a feeling that the IRS or the FBI is biding its time, watching as Scientology continues to shrink and weaken. At some point, they’ll move in. And then Miscavige and Scientology will be caught up in court actions basically forever, and a succession will be a moot point.
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Well, "Going Clear" certainly ripped the CO$ a new one.
A few people are complaining that the show only spent a short time on the COS's beliefs (the whole Xenu saga) but IMHO concentrating on the way the COS abuses people both inside and outside the Church was the right approach. That is what makes the COS so dangerous and despicible. Their beliefs are insane, but no more so then other UFO cults.
But most of the other UFO cultus are relatively harmless, the COS is not.
 
dudalb said:
Well, "Going Clear" certainly ripped the CO$ a new one.
A few people are complaining that the show only spent a short time on the COS's beliefs (the whole Xenu saga) but IMHO concentrating on the way the COS abuses people both inside and outside the Church was the right approach. That is what makes the COS so dangerous and despicible. Their beliefs are insane, but no more so then other UFO cults.
But most of the other UFO cultus are relatively harmless, the COS is not.
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I agree, the ideology is no more insane than virgin births, talking serpents, demons, evil spirits etc. Their actions are despicable, at present the Church has been going after the former members who spoke out in the movie, the attacks on the film makers have been mild by comparison. I noticed that as the air date approached, there were more frequent news articles about the documentary. The Co$ has made a lot of enemies in the news world, it's common knowledge what they did to Paulette Cooper and the day for vengeance may have arrived.
 
One thing that was in the film that was not in the book and is making the headlines is the COS apparently had Nicole Kidman's phone bugged after she broke up with Cruise. A lot of "what did Tom know and when did he know it" discussion about that.
 
dudalb said:
One thing that was in the film that was not in the book and is making the headlines is the COS apparently had Nicole Kidman's phone bugged after she broke up with Cruise. A lot of "what did Tom know and when did he know it" discussion about that.
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The subject of Tom Cruise is becoming a problem for me. Normally, unless they do something really outrageous, I generally ignore the politics, antics and religious ideologies of entertainment celebrity's. But the fact is, TC has benefited heavily from the quasi-slave labor from the Co$, he can't help but know this, and that makes him an accessory to what they do.
The Co$ auditioning girl friends for him is downright creepy. Katie Holmes divorcing him to keep their daughter away from Scientology doesn't help him either. Like Michael Vick, it gets to the point that you can't look at the man without being reminded of what he is.
 
I did not see the movie, but I actually listened to the book. I have three observations and a question.

-I don't think it can be regarded out of the context of evolving new faith movements.

-as the author argued, LRH worked long past the point of a con. There was too much of him invested. I respect that to the extent I will respect crazy people.

-I find it notable that Miscavige, as the next leader in a religion, never claims special insight PR interpretation of the material. Heck, as far as I can tell, he never talks about even being a very good scientologist.

- the church claims he broke up. Black magic cult, right? Is that a tacit admission that they believe black magic is real? Or did it just need to be broken up because of more mundane crimes?
 
BobTheCoward said:
I did not see the movie, but I actually listened to the book. I have three observations and a question.

-I don't think it can be regarded out of the context of evolving new faith movements.

-as the author argued, LRH worked long past the point of a con. There was too much of him invested. I respect that to the extent I will respect crazy people.
-I find it notable that Miscavige, as the next leader in a religion, never claims special insight PR interpretation of the material. Heck, as far as I can tell, he never talks about even being a very good scientologist.

- the church claims he broke up. Black magic cult, right? Is that a tacit admission that they believe black magic is real? Or did it just need to be broken up because of more mundane crimes?
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In the books epilogue it states that shortly before LRH's death there was a conversation between his personal security guard that Hubbard didn't plan to return after his death because he had failed to do what he had set out to do. (clear the planet?) Hubbard was very ill and perhaps a little crazy and was telling a last minute tall tale or he may actually have come to believe his own BS.
 
MontagK505 said:
In the books epilogue it states that shortly before LRH's death there was a conversation between his personal security guard that Hubbard didn't plan to return after his death because he had failed to do what he had set out to do. (clear the planet?) Hubbard was very ill and perhaps a little crazy and was telling a last minute tall tale or he may actually have come to believe his own BS.
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Did someone forget to report this conversation to the general horde? All that effort to build, furnish and maintain an office for him in every Org on Teegeeack for his use on his return has been wasted? :boggled:
 
Gord_in_Toronto said:
Did someone forget to report this conversation to the general horde? All that effort to build, furnish and maintain an office for him in every Org on Teegeeack for his use on his return has been wasted? :boggled:
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What ev's... The illusion of the immortality and ultimate return of the godhead figure is paramount. Your stinkin' facts are useless.
 
Gord_in_Toronto said:
Did someone forget to report this conversation to the general horde? All that effort to build, furnish and maintain an office for him in every Org on Teegeeack for his use on his return has been wasted? :boggled:
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Apparently not. There were only two people that were comms between LRH and the main church org. One of them was DM. There is no indication that anyone spoke to LRH's personal security man.
 
MontagK505 said:
Apparently not. There were only two people that were comms between LRH and the main church org. One of them was DM. There is no indication that anyone spoke to LRH's personal security man.
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Ah. So. OK. Just carry on with the occasional furniture dusting and vacuuming then. He could be back any day now. :covereyes
 
BobTheCoward said:
I did not see the movie, but I actually listened to the book. I have three observations and a question.

-I don't think it can be regarded out of the context of evolving new faith movements.

-as the author argued, LRH worked long past the point of a con. There was too much of him invested. I respect that to the extent I will respect crazy people.

-I find it notable that Miscavige, as the next leader in a religion, never claims special insight PR interpretation of the material. Heck, as far as I can tell, he never talks about even being a very good scientologist.

- the church claims he broke up. Black magic cult, right? Is that a tacit admission that they believe black magic is real? Or did it just need to be broken up because of more mundane crimes?
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B.S.
Most evolving new faith movement don't do the evil crap the CO$ does.
The CO$ should be treated as a crinimal orgnization,and Misdavige should be in jail.
 
dudalb said:
B.S.
Most evolving new faith movement don't do the evil crap the CO$ does.
The CO$ should be treated as a crinimal orgnization,and Misdavige should be in jail.
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Being a new faith movement is independent of evil or criminal activity.
 
dudalb said:
All New Faith Movements are not involved with criminal and out and out evil activities, but the CO$ sure as hell is.
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Butca religion can be both a religion and criminal. Or, they succeed in clearing the world and it is the greatest good for the greatest number of whatever they call it.
 
The High Noon Of Scientology

So, SNL more or less eviscerated Scientology tonight. If you didn't see it, I'm sure they'll have it up sometime this week.

To me, this seems like a turning point. It appears criticism of Scientology has hit the mainstream.

Anyone else see this as a culturally important moment.
 
The "L. Ron" images were both frighteningly and hilariously accurate.
 
Loss Leader said:
To me, this seems like a turning point. It appears criticism of Scientology has hit the mainstream.

Anyone else see this as a culturally important moment.
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Not really - I think South Park's dealing with the organization was probably a more significant moment
 
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