Yet more NLP BS

You know, I'm really embarassed about this now... okay, I guess there's no need to be, since I was a teenager then. Anyway, I read all of Wilson Bryan Key's books. (There's some info in the subliminal ads link.) I'llnever forget the front cover of The Clam Plate Orgy. It was a reproduction of the old Howard Johnson's ad for its clam plate, you see, and the idea was that it subliminally influenced people to... I don't know, order the clam plate, I guess... through wild sexual images imbedded in the clams. :boggled: He also testified at a weird court case against Judas Priest, and wrote several other books. He was quite the proponent of the "our children are going insane and committing mass murders because of subliminal messages in Coke ads" type argument. It all seemed to make sense at the time...
 
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Maia said:
You know, I'm really embarassed about this now... okay, I guess there's no need to be, since I was a teenager then. Anyway, I read all of Wilson Bryan Key's books. (There's some info in the subliminal ads link.) I'llnever forget the front cover of The Clam Plate Orgy. It was a reproduction of the old Howard Johnson's ad for its clam plate, you see, and the idea was that it subliminally influenced people to... I don't know, order the clam plate, I guess... through wild sexual images imbedded in the clams. :boggled: He also testified at a weird court case against Judas Priest, and wrote several other books. He was quite the proponent of the "our children are going insane and committing mass murders because of subliminal messages in Coke ads" type argument. It all seemed to make sense at the time...
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Don't feel badly. I fell for it too. In fact, when I first started getting into hypnosis, back in my college days, I completely fell for all the hypnosis/subliminal stuff.

It does seem to make sense on the surface. To be honest, that's where a lot of people look and don't bother digging into the information deeper, or even seeing the information from another angle.

It took me 40 years to be an atheist. It took me 20 years to figure out what hypnosis really was. I still find myself falling for woo, it's just normal, I think.

The thing is to not stop asking challenging everything. Including yourself. :)

.....err...I hope this mini rant was helpful.


ETA: In high school, I was the kid who believed in UFO's and knew a lot about them.........that bit all changed in college....
 
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JFrankA said:
ETA: In high school, I was the kid who believed in UFO's and knew a lot about them.........that bit all changed in college....
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Tommie Lee Jones found you with his red flashing light on a silver stick, did he?
 
Maia said:
I'llnever forget the front cover of The Clam Plate Orgy. It was a reproduction of the old Howard Johnson's ad for its clam plate, you see, and the idea was that it subliminally influenced people to... I don't know, order the clam plate, I guess... through wild sexual images imbedded in the clams. :boggled:
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When I was in eighth grade a book called Subliminal Seduction was what all the cool kids were reading. I must admit -- I was a skeptic that S E X buried in the ice cubes would make you buy a particular brand of gin. Or that flashing "eat popcorn" two of seven frames per second would make a difference.

Now I worked at HoJo's while I was in college and young woman eating clams were sexually harrassing me, no bulloney (maybe it wasn't the subliminal stuff:rolleyes:)
 
Senex said:
Now I worked at HoJo's while I was in college and young woman eating clams were sexually harrassing me, no bulloney (maybe it wasn't the subliminal stuff:rolleyes:)
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Clams are said to have aphrodisiac properties :D. Nothing subliminal there.
 
No, I don't have proof that NLP has the same success rate as guessing, but there's no evidence to the contrary, now is there? ;)

microdot said:
Scenario

A person with a phobia of some kind, let's take a fear of swimming as an example. That person has negative feelings about swimming and water in general which may well lead them to decide to _not_ swim....Assuming that they are physically capable of swimming, the thing that's stopping them from swimming is entirely in their head and thus _should_ be under their control....Let's now imagine that this person has asked for our help and we've chosen to help them using NLP....
So, to recap, we have this imaginary person who has decided to _not_ swim but is capable of swimming, feels that their life is the poorer for not swimming and has asked for our help...._IF_ we use NLP here to assist them we're not just getting them to do something that _we_ wish them to do and we're certainly not tricking them into it....
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You forgot to tell us how NLP would solve the problem!! Talk about anticlimactic. :(

I realise I've been a little verbose on this but I wanted to try to make my point as clearly as possible.
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If that's the case, I think I missed the point... Was it "NLP is pragmatic?"

(Plus _everyone_ knows that blue quartz doesn't work for cravings :p)
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That made me snort Gatorade. Thanks.
 
Hiya MikeSun5 - hope you're well :)

MikeSun5 said:
You forgot to tell us how NLP would solve the problem!!
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Incorrect.

Your statement incorrectly presupposes my intention - are you a mind reader? :p

That section of my post was my full response to:-

MikeSun5 said:
remirol said:
It's a technique to get people to do things that _you_ wish them to, ideally bypassing any conscious decisions they may make to _not_ do those things.
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Like it or not, this is an accurate representation of what NLP claims.
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and the point of that section of my post was to explain, as clearly as I'm able, why my opinion - ETA on that particular point - differed from yours and remirol's.


MikeSun5 said:
microdot said:
(Plus _everyone_ knows that blue quartz doesn't work for cravings )
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That made me snort Gatorade. Thanks.
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LOL - yeah, I was quite please with that one :D

Is Gatorade carbonated? I can't remember as I only tried it once and didn't like it.
 
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microdot said:
and the point of that section of my post was to explain, as clearly as I'm able, why my opinion - ETA on that particular point - differed from yours and remirol's.
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Well the next obvious questions: How would you use NLP to help that guy to swim? Which tactic or technique do you think an NLP therapist would start with?

Is Gatorade carbonated?
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Hex no. One of the reasons I left Europe is all the bubbles in everything. ;)
 
MikeSun5 said:
Well the next obvious questions: How would you use NLP to help that guy to swim? Which tactic or technique do you think an NLP therapist would start with?
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Well, the standard model for that would be what is known as the fast phobia cure.
 
IMHO, the whole phobia cure has one advantage that gives it a better chance to work. The person wants the phobia gone.

But if a person is using that same technique on a woman who has no interest in that person, it won't work.
 
JFrankA said:
IMHO, the whole phobia cure has one advantage that gives it a better chance to work. The person wants the phobia gone.
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Absolutely :)

JFrankA said:
But if a person is using that same technique on a woman who has no interest in that person, it won't work.
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Women - such uncooperative creatures :rolleyes:
 
JFrankA said:
IMHO, the whole phobia cure has one advantage that gives it a better chance to work. The person wants the phobia gone.

But if a person is using that same technique on a woman who has no interest in that person, it won't work.
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Same with smoking.

I was at a party some months ago, one of the people there was really into NLP.

When he learned that I smoke (occasionally, at parties), he immidiately did me the "favour" of NLP-ing me out of my disgusting habit.

He did the whole re-framing thing, which in itself isn't bad. It made me feel bad about smoking.

Him: 'So, you smoke? That's sooo 1985'.
Me: 'Yeah, but only occasionally'.
Him: 'How many do you smoke then?'
Me: 'Uh, between three and five cigarettes a week, I guess.'
Him: 'So, that's what? two hundred cigarettes a year? Probably a lot more, counting holidays and such.'
Me: 'Hmmm, yeah probably. Oh look there's someone I know. I have to go talk to her now. Bye.'

Her: 'Oh my god. Were you talking to him? '
Me: 'Yeah, he tried to make me quit smoking'.
Her: 'Tell me about it. He came into my office two months ago and noticed a pack of cigarettes on my desk. Then he talked and talked and me say that I had now stopped smoking. He even talked me into throwing away the pack I had.'
Me: 'So, have you quit?'
Her: 'No but I smoke where he can't see it. I feel stupid, but I told him I'd quit'.
Me: 'have you got any cigarettes on you?'
Her: "Yes. But let's go smoke out front so he doesn't notice.'
 
Eddie Dane said:
Same with smoking.

I was at a party some months ago, one of the people there was really into NLP.

When he learned that I smoke (occasionally, at parties), he immidiately did me the "favour" of NLP-ing me out of my disgusting habit.
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I take it that you didn't ask for his 'help'?
 
Eddie Dane said:
When he learned that I smoke (occasionally, at parties), he immidiately did me the "favour" of NLP-ing me out of my disgusting habit.
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I designed a sticker for just such occasions!

STOP-BREATHING.jpg
 
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