• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Yar, Ghost Ships!

You changed the question. The original question was "Don't you think it's very irresponsible of you to pass yourself off as an expert on this for a national television program," which is the equivalent of asking me why I beat my cats. So, no, I won't answer the question as anyone can see it is loaded with venom, and I have no reason to prove anything to you.

I have a wide breadth of knowledge concerning mythology as well as paranormal claims made about oceanographic phenomena. I started this thread in the hopes of deepening my knowledge on a very specific topic with help from fellow forumites - if you don't have anything constructive to add, the thread will be a lot more informative without your posturing. I'll be ignoring any more posts in this thread not related to the OP. Thanks.

That's the equivalent of me saying that I have a wide breadth of knowledge about history in the Middle East (which I do) and then I try to pass myself off as an expert in the area on a program about it on the radio or on TV. I would never do that. Why? Because I'm NOT an expert.

Yes, I have something constructive to add. I have a couple of questions on the table. Why ignore them? They are valid questions.

Asking for help from forumites to gain knowledge on a particular topics is one thing, but passing yourself off as an expert on this is another.

So, what is it, Rebecca? Why not answer my questions and put this to rest?

Answer the question and maybe you will find me apologizing to you for some misinformation that I may have come across. It's really simple.

G6
 
G6, this is all the result of a big, big misunderstanding. Rebecca didn't misrepresent herself; someone else (inadvertantly, mistakenly) misrepresented the situation. I don't feel I'm the right one to give you the details, so for now, please take my word for it.

Please, I hate it when I people I like and respect are fighting. So in the name of making peace, I hereby direct all involved parties to proceed immediately to the hugging area. Do not pass go, do not collect $200.
 
hey tell everyone why you have to become an expert in a few days!

It's cable people! And let's face it, she's going to look good.

Rebecca,

Don't you think it's very irresponsible of you to pass yourself off as an expert on this for a national television program?

G6



That's the equivalent of me saying that I have a wide breadth of knowledge about history in the Middle East (which I do) and then I try to pass myself off as an expert in the area on a program about it on the radio or on TV. I would never do that. Why? Because I'm NOT an expert.

Yes, I have something constructive to add. I have a couple of questions on the table. Why ignore them? They are valid questions.

Asking for help from forumites to gain knowledge on a particular topics is one thing, but passing yourself off as an expert on this is another.

So, what is it, Rebecca? Why not answer my questions and put this to rest?

Answer the question and maybe you will find me apologizing to you for some misinformation that I may have come across. It's really simple.

G6

Aaaand the mystery has been solved.

A few days ago, a producer contacted me asking if I'd do an interview about the myths we build up around the ocean, for a show about ghost ships. We spoke at length, and I detailed for her the areas of my expertise on the subject. She asked what I knew about ghost ships in particular, and I told her about the Mary Celeste, the Doyle story, and other fun facts about that incident. I told her I could discuss generalities of the Queen Mary "hauntings" and the fairly recent case of the High Aim 6, but I wasn't at the moment overly familiar with the details of those or some other "ghost ships." She thanked me and asked if I could brush up on a few points like that in time for an interview within the following few days. I answered in the affirmative, telling her I'd spend the next few days cramming, confident that I could consult my library, the Internet, and most importantly, a community of people who would be knowledgeable on the subject.

I mentioned the interview on the JREF chat room, where kittynh was chatting. I asked for some help finding info, and we all joked a bit about how I had to become an expert on ghost ships in three days. Of course this wasn't literal truth - it's just the way I operate. When I do something, I really like to be prepared. It's why sometimes my blog entries take forever to write, because as I research I jump from topic to topic. (I briefly talked about this once.)

I posted the request for help here, on the forum of the James Randi Educational Foundation. I think this forum's greatest strength is that it collects an incredible diversity of knowledgeable and helpful people together in one place. I knew there would be some people here who had studied ghost ships and other bits of info I could absorb, to make sure that I contributed as much skeptical information as possible, and that the producer really got what she needed to make a great show. Because I didn't yet have plane tickets et. al. and therefore things weren't definite yet, I didn't post the details about the interview.

I just found out that Kittynh in her enthusiasm took from my few lines of text in the chat room and posted (on MySpace and elsewhere) that I was about to be interviewed on television as an expert on ghost ships, yet knew nothing about ghost ships.

Upon reading Kittynh's interpretation of events, Girl 6 immediately took it upon herself to email me and ask for clarification find this thread and post a public message accusing me of misrepresenting myself to get on television. She then insisted that I defend myself against her spurious and (from my perspective, and that of 99.99% of readers) completely out-of-left-field accusation based on "information [she] may have come across."

In my previous post I said I'd ignore future off-topic posts, but I just wanted to get all that out while it is fresh. I think it makes for a very interesting study on how easily the Internet version of the game "telephone" works even on people who fancy themselves critical thinkers. Additionally, it illustrates that no matter how hard we all work to make this forum (and others like it) a place where skeptics can receive support and information, it will still always be an open forum on the Internet, where any clown with an agenda can crash right in, attack someone, and derail a thread - not just any thread, but one which was set up for the specific and very direct purpose of helping someone communicate science and skepticism to a large audience.

Anyway, this certainly illustrates my point about how I get lost in research. I started out by researching ghost ships, and now I've spent the past hour marveling at what I find to be a very interesting sociological issue, which I may turn into an essay at some point in the near future. So despite the rather ludicrous hassle, overall the thread has still been a net gain.

...especially, thanks to all the great links and book recommendations (like bruto's suggestion to read Maryat's Phantom Ship - happily, I actually already have that! It's by my side at this very moment waiting to be digested). I'm still not sure if the interview is actually happening or not, but one thing's for sure, I'm going to be damned knowledgeable on ghost ships before the weekend is over.
 
G6, this is all the result of a big, big misunderstanding. Rebecca didn't misrepresent herself; someone else (inadvertantly, mistakenly) misrepresented the situation. I don't feel I'm the right one to give you the details, so for now, please take my word for it.

Please, I hate it when I people I like and respect are fighting. So in the name of making peace, I hereby direct all involved parties to proceed immediately to the hugging area. Do not pass go, do not collect $200.

I'm sorry if you feel uncomfortable, Cleon. I'm uncomfortable too. Sometimes, people will have disagreements. I'm more than happy, as I stated previously, to apologize if I have a wrong impression here. But, I think that only Rebecca can clear this up.

I don't want to fight. I'm seeking answers to the questions that I asked. She can answer them. I really would like to have the right impression of what IS going on. That's why I asked the questions. Unfortunately, my bias for fairness and accuracy are showing. If I have the wrong impression, then, it's rather easily cleared up. If not, then that's a different matter.

So, I ask Rebecca one more time. Are you passing yourself off as an expert on Ghost Ships on a future upcoming television program for National Geographic?

I won't pursue this much further beyond this thread since I don't believe in dogging people to get answers. Silence speaks for itself sometimes.

G6
 
Thank you for taking the time to respond, Rebecca. I do appreciate that.

G6
 
I don't want to fight. I'm seeking answers to the questions that I asked. She can answer them. I really would like to have the right impression of what IS going on. That's why I asked the questions. Unfortunately, my bias for fairness and accuracy are showing.

Except that the first question you asked is still not the same question you've asked later, and trying to pretend there's nothing accusing about it is a pure lie, simple as that.

Why do you lie like that?
 
I hereby state before this Congress that I am not, and have not ever been, a member of the experts-on-ghost-ships party.
 
I'm not lying. I asked some questions. Rebecca gracioiusly answered them. And, I do thank her.

I'm not taking this any further because she did take the time to answer my questions. And, I do appreciate that.

G6
 
There was a thread here that I ran across and read for a while about the rogue waves reported over the years. When I left reading the idea was seeming to be upgraded from "no way, never could happen" to "could happen, maybe did" based on new satellite images, ways of modeling ocean behavior, etc.

That might be an example of how new ways of gathering data and better theories (the Ways of Science) can be a good thing.
 
Not only luxury liners are claimed to be haunted, but automobile ferry boats too:

http://www.metafilter.com/16062/

I've was aboard the Kalakala when it was docked on Lake Union here in Seattle. I saw no specters, but a great deal of corroded metal...
 
And then there's the so-called "Ghost ships of Truk lagoon". They have the
unique distinction, unlike the subjects of all the other tedious "ghost ship"
yarns, of actually existing!
 
Trouble is...

Being labeled an 'expert' by others, when you are not, can have a nasty habit of jumping up later and biting you right on the butt...

Maybe i'm being paranoid...But it happened to me in a big, legal kinda way (non-skeptic related) and i had nothing to with it.

DB
 
Amazingly, in spite of the fact that I live here at the so-called "Graveyard of the Pacific" (it seems as if every bit of costal geography is named for a ship that wrecked here), there seem to be ablosoutly NO local ghost legends. Maybe I should bring that up at the next merchants association meeting. If we could stretch the tourist season into late October with a haunted beach themed Halloween weekend, then local business owners might start seeing some ghosts stalking the beach at night and have it credulously reported by the local newspaper. Hmmmmm...

http://www.funbeach.com/attractions/shipwrecks.html

I don't know why I'm posting this link as there are no ghost stories associated with it. Maybe It'll generate more tourist business. ;-)
 
It seems that my initial post was a bit more aggressive and accusatory that I would have liked it to be. So, I apologize for that.

I also thank the SC gang for helping me think about it some more. :)

I do wish Rebecca luck, but will add that she may need to be careful if she is representing herself as an expert. And, that's just a general caveat that can be applied to everyone.

G6
 
And here I thought you simply had an inside line on what Steve Novella was going to be asking on this week's "Science or Fiction?", and were hoping to get an edge on maintaining your record. Good idea, though, to ask in the JREF forum instead of the SGTTU forum. :D
 
It seems that my initial post was a bit more aggressive and accusatory that I would have liked it to be. So, I apologize for that.

I also thank the SC gang for helping me think about it some more. :)

I do wish Rebecca luck, but will add that she may need to be careful if she is representing herself as an expert. And, that's just a general caveat that can be applied to everyone.

G6

Rebecca did ask for as much information about the subject as could be found. And got quite a bit. There is, of course, also the ever-growing Cross Reference on SkepticReport.

Considering the condensed form of TV, the trick is not a high volume of knowledge, but how to present the information that is interesting to the viewers.

We also shouldn't forget that, if anyone are "experts" in the world of superstition, it is us. Are you not far more capable of explaining what e.g. cold reading is, than the vast majority of people? Can you not speak intelligently - and sound very much like an expert - about most paranormal subjects?

What good is it to have a forum such as this, if we can't ask for information, provide it - and put it to good use?
 

Back
Top Bottom