WTC 1,2 Collapse Sequence

[BasqueArch]

BasqueArch, congratulations. You did great work... there's not much I would change.



I would go further here by saying that the collapse involved two mechanisms; one that led to the collapse initiation, and the other which progressed the collapse. The first was creep, which AE911truth, et al seems to forget happens to unprotected steel when it's heated under loads. This means the column begins to bend out of the vertical and the load above creates an increasing lever that accelerates the bending even further until the column either completely fails or the connecting elements fail from torsional or tensile stresses introduced by the buckling.

The other mechanism was the pancaking floors which you correctly point out pancaked downwards. As this happened all of the connections were sheared off leaving the exterior panels to either topple freely as a group or individually.

Thanks Grizzly
You're right of course about the columns creep as a sign of impending collapse.

It appears that at least in this instance most of the truss seat angles survived. Other plates, angles are missing.
After the initial collapse the loads were chaotic. Perhaps the falling debris concentrated away from the floor edges (center of floor deflected under load first before failure) , with the joist top chord forced upwards at the ends the single 5/8" per truss connecting bolt either sheared or punched through.

http://www.debunking911.com/construction.jpg
http://www.studyof911.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10002/normal_BTflyingcolumns.jpg

 

[Safe-Keeper]

WTC 1,2 Collapse Sequence

There was a version 1,2 of the WTC?

 

[leftysergeant]

Well, in the real world an upper part C of a structure cannot one-way crush down a bigger part A of same structure, that carried C above before, when some local structural elements between C and A fail due, e.g. fire and C thus displaces downwards due to gravity and failed elements. The only result will be more local failures, generally in C, that quickly absorbs the potential energy released and applied and ... the process is arrested.

Pay attention. You have been shown the Balzac-Vitry demolition. Your crap don't fly. Can you get that through your skull?

The Balzac-Vitry structure was more traditional, in that there were internal columns at more or less regular intervals to entangle and thus arrest collapse, but they did not.

The towers had no columns in the areas that failed for most of the collapse. Just wide open floors. Those wide open floors used to hold the walls up. When they broke, the walls peeled away.

The towers were not ships. What little you apparently understand even about ships does not apply here.

 

[A W Smith]

Excellent post, BasqueArch.

Originally Posted by Swing Dangler
The video you linked to "The South Tower Falls, shot front of Trinity Church" proves this statement incorrect. There are at least 6 individual billowing plumes of expulsions separated from each other by approximate the same distance (no math needed). Even to the casual observer they look like detonation points.

Of course you can't see much of anything due to the vast volume of smoke and the over exposure so who knows if columns were blown outward. Were you expecting to see whole columns of 'shrapnel' of columns?

Nothing to debate here as the evidence is in the coverage. lol

Oh and still no one has completed Hewia's challenge yet?? Why is that? It happened twice on 9/11 only to never happen or be modeled again. With all the brains on this site, I would have expected to see the challenge completed quite easily if the OS were even close to being reality.

Swing Dangler spectacularly ignorant failpost #1,045!

That makes swing dangler sad

 

[FineWine]

Quote of the year!














The video you linked to "The South Tower Falls, shot front of Trinity Church" proves this statement incorrect. There are at least 6 individual billowing plumes of expulsions separated from each other by approximate the same distance (no math needed). Even to the casual observer they look like detonation points.

Of course you can't see much of anything due to the vast volume of smoke and the over exposure so who knows if columns were blown outward. Were you expecting to see whole columns of 'shrapnel' of columns?

Nothing to debate here as the evidence is in the coverage. lol

Oh and still no one has completed Hewia's challenge yet?? Why is that? It happened twice on 9/11 only to never happen or be modeled again. With all the brains on this site, I would have expected to see the challenge completed quite easily if the OS were even close to being reality.

Lots of people beat Heiwa's challenge. Heiwa is a fraud. He has been exposed as an agenda-driven incompetent who lacks rudimentary engineering skills. He can't grasp the idea that the collapsing floors hit one floor below them and repeat the process until the building is gone. Can you understand the way the towers actually fell, or do you share Heiwa's belief that the collapses arrest themselves through some form of magic?

"Detonation points"--that's hilarious. You loons never give up, do you? What the hell is a "detonation point"? You're all masochists. You just love that debunker lash across your silly butts.

 

[Heiwa]

Pay attention.
The towers had no columns in the areas that failed for most of the collapse. Just wide open floors. Those wide open floors used to hold the walls up. When they broke, the walls peeled away.

So a structure that is arranged with open floors and with walls than can peel away will one-way crush down, when an upper assembly of elements (with open floors and walls that can peel away) is dropped on the lower assembly?

I like your statement that wide open floors used to hold the walls up. Or you mean that the walls used to hold the floors in position?

Could you, please, provide such a structure in any size and demonstrate this amazing process!

 

[Grizzly Bear]

I like your statement that wide open floors used to hold the walls up. Or you mean that the walls used to hold the floors in position?

The Perimeter columns and the core supported the gravity loads, the floors acted as an internal diaphragm to help resist lateral forces. Without the columns the floors wouldn't stand, without the floors the columns would have buckled under their self weight.

If the columns received any significant load off the vertical axis, it's integrity was gone, the connections would have given out well before the column itself was deformed.

 

[Heiwa]

The Perimeter columns and the core supported the gravity loads, the floors acted as an internal diaphragm to help resist lateral forces. Without the columns the floors wouldn't stand, without the floors the columns would have buckled under their self weight.

If the columns received any significant load off the vertical axis, it's integrity was gone, the connections would have given out well before the column itself was deformed.

Could you, please, provide such a structure in any size and demonstrate this amazing process!

 

[Grizzly Bear]

Could you, please, provide such a structure in any size and demonstrate this amazing process!

Long, slender, and unbraced column assemblies. If you've read any literature in structures this wouldn't be difficult to understand. The longer the effective unbraced length and the smaller the cross sectional area of the column relative to that length, the easier the column buckles.

 

[funk de fino]

Could you, please, provide such a structure in any size and demonstrate this amazing process!

Join a lot of drinking straws together to about a 10 foot length then see if they can stand up vertically on their own.

Then do the same with 1 straw.

Note the difference

 

[Newtons Bit]

The Perimeter columns and the core supported the gravity loads, the floors acted as an internal diaphragm to help resist lateral forces. Without the columns the floors wouldn't stand, without the floors the columns would have buckled under their self weight.

If the columns received any significant load off the vertical axis, it's integrity was gone, the connections would have given out well before the column itself was deformed.

This is a very simple concept in engineering. Sadly, "truther" "engineers" do not understand it.

Henry Ford said that the whole is more than the sum of the parts. The reverse is also true. You take a few important pieces out of an engine and a car will no longer run. You take a few important pieces out of a skyscraper and it will no longer stand.

 

[Architect]

It's a point which has been made time and time again here on the forum yet Heiwa and other Truthers apparently fail to grasp just how the overall structural system on WTC worked. Personally - and as I've said before - I don't believe that any competent engineer could make such a basic error.

 

[BasqueArch]

WrestleMania IX/XI
Truthers-JREFers - Epic Battle Pitting Shadow Against Light !​

JREF’s Newtons Bit , R.Mackey, Architect and ElMondoHummus set a deliberate and destructive pace pinning the shadowy Swing Dangler early in the match.

That’s when Heiwa leaped off the ring over the top rope, taking aim at Grizzly Bear. But just as Heiwa was about to land atop GB with the full force of his nearly 105 pound frame, GB darted aside and pulled a cameraman into Heiwa’s path. Firecoins, johnnykarate, leftysergeant, Gravy then toppled Heiwa onto Richard Gage’s table. After a near count-out, Heiwa dragged himself back into the ring, and the legendary JREF Superstars administered Heiwa some of the most explosive maneuvers in their arsenal.

FineWine, alienentity, A W Smith, funk de fino then pancaked Heiwa. Heiwa however enjoys quite a reputation for obstinate stamina and ignored the crowd’s chants to “STAY DOWN !!!” as his dismal demolition continued.

An addled Tony Szamboti and a vacuous David Chandler were spotted in the audience.​

__________________________________________________________________________________________
"Contrariwise," continued Tweedledee, " if it was so, it might be;
and if it were so, it would be but as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic."
- Alice in Wonderland

 

[Heiwa]

Long, slender, and unbraced column assemblies. If you've read any literature in structures this wouldn't be difficult to understand. The longer the effective unbraced length and the smaller the cross sectional area of the column relative to that length, the easier the column buckles.

Good! Design such a structure, build it and demonstrate that upper part C with long slender and unbraced column assemblies can one way crush down a similar lower part A when dropped on A. In my view the whole thing cannot be built = it is not a real structure.

 

[Audible Click]

WrestleMania IX/XI
Truthers-JREFers - Epic Battle Pitting Shadow Against Light !​

JREF’s Newtons Bit , R.Mackey, Architect and ElMondoHummus set a deliberate and destructive pace pinning the shadowy Swing Dangler early in the match.

That’s when Heiwa leaped off the ring over the top rope, taking aim at Grizzly Bear. But just as Heiwa was about to land atop GB with the full force of his nearly 105 pound frame, GB darted aside and pulled a cameraman into Heiwa’s path. Firecoins, johnnykarate, leftysergeant, Gravy then toppled Heiwa onto Richard Gage’s table. After a near count-out, Heiwa dragged himself back into the ring, and the legendary JREF Superstars administered Heiwa some of the most explosive maneuvers in their arsenal.

FineWine, alienentity, A W Smith, funk de fino then pancaked Heiwa. Heiwa however enjoys quite a reputation for obstinate stamina and ignored the crowd’s chants to “STAY DOWN !!!” as his dismal demolition continued.

An addled Tony Szamboti and a vacuous David Chandler were spotted in the audience.​

Audible Click, also known as the Greek Chorus of the JREF Skeptics vs. 9/11 Twoofers,
was in the front row cheering loudly for the JREF Skeptics during their epic smackdown of the now bedraggled twoofers.

 

[LashL]

WrestleMania IX/XI
Truthers-JREFers - Epic Battle Pitting Shadow Against Light !​

JREF’s Newtons Bit , R.Mackey, Architect and ElMondoHummus set a deliberate and destructive pace pinning the shadowy Swing Dangler early in the match.

That’s when Heiwa leaped off the ring over the top rope, taking aim at Grizzly Bear. But just as Heiwa was about to land atop GB with the full force of his nearly 105 pound frame, GB darted aside and pulled a cameraman into Heiwa’s path. Firecoins, johnnykarate, leftysergeant, Gravy then toppled Heiwa onto Richard Gage’s table. After a near count-out, Heiwa dragged himself back into the ring, and the legendary JREF Superstars administered Heiwa some of the most explosive maneuvers in their arsenal.

FineWine, alienentity, A W Smith, funk de fino then pancaked Heiwa. Heiwa however enjoys quite a reputation for obstinate stamina and ignored the crowd’s chants to “STAY DOWN !!!” as his dismal demolition continued.

An addled Tony Szamboti and a vacuous David Chandler were spotted in the audience.​

Okay, now that there is seriously funny. Well done, indeed, Basque Arch!

 

[Heiwa]

"the legendary JREF Superstars administered Heiwa some of the most explosive maneuvers in their arsenal."

LOL. When, where, how?

 

[TruthersLie]

pretty much every time you show your ignorance of building engineering...

and everytime you talk about your parts a,b and c...

and your "challenge" which has been met and defeated by at least 4 people

and your inability to show proof of your $1 Million prize

and ...
and ...
and ... (the list goes on and on and on)

 

[stateofgrace]

LOL. When,

Daily.

where,

Here.

how

Easily.

 

[leftysergeant]

Good! Design such a structure, build it and demonstrate that upper part C with long slender and unbraced column assemblies can one way crush down a similar lower part A when dropped on A. In my view the whole thing cannot be built = it is not a real structure.

Why are you ignoring Balzac-Vitry? It blows your whole fantasy out of the water and...oh. I get it.