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Women's Cycling Champion is a Man

River said:
Do feminists support this?
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I've seen quite a few examples of males dominating against women in sports, with no apparent objection from women, that I'd have to say yes.

Perhaps they are afraid to object?

This would seem to lead to the end of women's sports, as men can now compete against women.

Maybe we should just have "sports", no gender mentioned, despite the fact that one gender is actually likely to be totally dominant.

Didn't they used to try to sneak men into women's events back in the day?
 
WingerII said:
Here's a link to a CBC article, for those who would rather not give clicks to anti-gay outlets like LifeSiteNews. It says she's had to suppress her testosterone to what she considers to be an unhealthy level.
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She is very clear that there should be no restrictions on those levels, though. She believes she should be able to compete as a woman, as she is. That is, a man.
 
All this sort of does call into question what the point of separate mens and womens sports is then.
 
TragicMonkey said:
If women can't win bicycling races the entire sex will cease riding bicycles?
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If women don't see role models succeeding in sports fewer of them will be excited about them.

TragicMonkey said:
If a recreation is enjoyable people will participate in it, even if there are no contests or professionals at all.
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You must be aware that's factually and historically untrue. It isn't rocket science. Women's sports at youth levels exist in a positive feedback loop with women's professional sports. Go back a few decades and you'll see fewer women in competitive sports and far fewer girls taking up those sports.

Surely those sports haven't changed in enjoyability over the years?
 
GlennB said:
It means biological females don't even bother to compete, as they can't win. That's more than 'hurt feelings' in my book - it deprives them of partaking in something significant.
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If they chose not to compete they can hardly complain they didn't get to participate. The grievance here is that they want to win, which is something that shouldn't be guaranteed to anyone in any competition.
 
Ziggurat said:
This is a stupid question trying to masquerade as a clever question, and failing.

It's important to the people who enjoyed watching the sport because people value enjoyment. It's important to the people who make a living from the sport because that's how they earn the money they need to live. No deeper answer is necessary.

The fact that it may not be important to anyone else doesn't stop it from being important to them. This should be obvious, it shouldn't need explaining. If you are indifferent to the issue (and I make no claim that you shouldn't be), then the logical choice is to not participate in the discussion. Crapping on others for having an interest in something you have no interest in isn't enlightened.
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Had this thread appeared in the Sports forum you might have a point. But it didn't. It appeared in Social Issues because we're supposed to have a social response to it: we're supposed to be outraged at the Massive Injustice that someone won a bicycle race. My position is that bicycle races are not important enough to even generate Mild Injustice. Apparently everyone else disagrees, and that's fine. But I certainly have every right to have made my point, which, for the record, is neither "stupid" or "crapping on" anyone (stay classy, bro!).

Since the counterpoints so far are that bicycle races are important because people feel strongly about them, and that some people make money from them, I'm not really impressed by the brilliance of the opposite view.
 
JoeMorgue said:
All this sort of does call into question what the point of separate mens and womens sports is then.
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Indeed. I don't see how women tolerate being placed in a separate-but-equal league in which their triumphs are necessarily appended with "that's great!...for a woman".
 
I guess I don't see the distinction. Yes it being about sports does make it pointless for most definition of pointless, but inevitable social reaction to it would not be.

Basically TM you can't argue that other people aren't going to get worked up about things you and I agree are pointless.
 
TragicMonkey said:
Indeed. I don't see how women tolerate being placed in a separate-but-equal league in which their triumphs are necessarily appended with "that's great!...for a woman".
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And I agree with you, but we have to at least acknowledge that fact that other people don't.

It would be a magically wonderful world TM if the only "Social Issues" we had to worry about where ones where we acknowledge the importance of the catalyst for them. We do not live in that world.
 
TragicMonkey said:
If they chose not to compete they can hardly complain they didn't get to participate. The grievance here is that they want to win, which is something that shouldn't be guaranteed to anyone in any competition.
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Being guaranteed to lose is a bit of a disincentive, no? Like the humans vs.the dolphins? (freestyle and maybe butterfly only - i don't know if dolphins can manage breaststroke and backstroke)
 
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If I may a slight addendum.

It's not that people want to compete and win pers se. People want to compete and feel competitive, as they at least feel like they have a chance to win..

Gender segregated sports was one of the ways we provided that. It's also why we have weight classes in boxing.

Again whether this is good or bad is a linked but separate question. But we can't maintain it with one hand and undermine it with the other and expect this center to hold.
 
TragicMonkey said:
Indeed. I don't see how women tolerate being placed in a separate-but-equal league in which their triumphs are necessarily appended with "that's great!...for a woman".
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If you're being facetious, this basically undermines everything you've said in this thread because none of your posts can be taken at face value. If you're being serious, this... basically undermines everything you've said in this thread because you can't understand basic demonstrated human behavior.
 
Ziggurat said:
Again, what's with this need to crap all over people for caring about something you don't care about?
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Disagreeing with someone about the relative importance of a thing, even a thing near to their heart, isn't "crapping on it".

I am very fond of literature and read a lot. I would not, however, expect a massive surge of righteous outrage should one particular author win a literary prize over another author. Nor would I be sympathetic should the losing author undertake a media campaign to complain about it. Even if I personally agree the losing author had the superior work. Because I can differentiate between things I like and things that are important.
 
JoeMorgue said:
If I may a slight addendum.

It's not that people want to compete and win pers se. People want to compete and feel competitive, as they at least feel like they have a chance to win..

Gender segregated sports was one of the ways we provided that. It's also why we have weight classes in boxing.
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And age groups as well--the guy in the OP won the age 35-39 championship.
 
TragicMonkey said:
Disagreeing with someone about the relative importance of a thing, even a thing near to their heart, isn't "crapping on it".

I am very fond of literature and read a lot. I would not, however, expect a massive surge of righteous outrage should one particular author win a literary prize over another author. Nor would I be sympathetic should the losing author undertake a media campaign to complain about it. Even if I personally agree the losing author had the superior work. Because I can differentiate between things I like and things that are important.
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Would it bother you if an adult entered and won a writing contest meant for children? Would you be confused about why it bothered other people?
 
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