Why is prostitution illegal?

[JFrankA]

Let's see. So taking choices away from people will "help" them? What a crock. You moral crusade types that want to run everyones life make me sick.

And that's all what making prostitution illegal is. A "moral" stance: "We know what's best for you."

BTW, good to see you again, Newton!

 

[pgwenthold]

You need ...the right appearance (which often means a couple hours of preparation before working),

Not sure this one holds. At least not for the prostitutes I saw in Amsterdam. Whoa, NOT a good appearance at all...

 

[soylent]

Because pornography is art. They are being paid to have a performance, not get their rocks off.

Tom Lehrer did an interesting song about that called "smut". The funniest part was however not the song but the intro-speech:

"I do have a cause though, it is obscenity... I'm for it.

Unfortunately the civil liberties types who are fighting this issue have to fight it, owing to the nature of the laws, as a matter of freedom of speech and stifling of free expression and so on. But we know what's really involved; dirty books are fun, that's all there is to it.

But you can't get up in the courts and say that I suppose; it's simply a matter of freedom of pleasure, a right which is not guaranteed by the constitution unfortunately.

Anyway, since people seem to be marching for their causes these days, I have here a march for mine..."

 

[I Ratant]

That isn't true, either. While working in the sex industry is not rocket science, you still need a specialized skillset. You need the right personality, the right appearance (which often means a couple hours of preparation before working), some knowledge about fetishes and sexual behaviors that are not openly discussed in general, you have to be able to set your limits and make them clearly known and it helps to have other traits like flexibility.

On top of all that, you have to have the skills to interact with your co workers who can sometimes be quite viscious and unkind. You have to deal with a wide variety of criticisms and you have to know how to take a bad day gracefully so that what business you do get does not face the consequences of your bad day.

While my experience is not in prostitution, I'm guessing that since the above applies to camming and stripping, it probably applies to prostitution as well.

.
It does.
But the excellent (most of the time) people skills are easily developed by anyone with a real job.
The lack of interest in the future, even 20 minutes from now, goes along with the basic lack of any ambition, in my experience.

 

[SophieHirschfeld]

Not sure this one holds. At least not for the prostitutes I saw in Amsterdam. Whoa, NOT a good appearance at all...

I imagine there are exceptions. Some people make it by having just the right niche look. But overall, it does help the income tremendously. I admit that I don't have a perfect look (I'm chubby, wear big glasses and am far from a barbie-ish figure), but I still get business and I get at least one offer per week to escort (though, I turn it down for the sake of safety).

.
It does.
But the excellent (most of the time) people skills are easily developed by anyone with a real job.
The lack of interest in the future, even 20 minutes from now, goes along with the basic lack of any ambition, in my experience.

Lack of ambition? And, no, those skills aren't always easily developed - in fact, the lack of those skills is probably the #1 reason why girls fail in the industry and why the industry has a high turnover rate. A pretty face alone doesn't make money. Being in the sex industry, though, if that is what you're implying, doesn't mean a lack of interest inthe future. In fact, my experience in the industry is a lead-in to what I plan for the future. It will be very important experience for me to have in the long run.

 

[Kittyclaws]

In one of my favorite author's 50-years-from-now world sex workers are trained, licensed, taxed, examined, and rated for various types of work from the casual pick-up to the fetish specialist to the high-end escort, educated and sophisticated enough to accompany clients to professional and social affairs.

Sex workers provide a service that is in high demand. They should be protected and supported in every way, especially in health care and safety.

Sex workers who do the work to support a drug/alcohol habit have other, more serious, issues at hand, and again should be supported to resolve those issues before making the choice to stay "in the business" or explore other employment options.

Legislation of morality seldom works to anyone's advantage but it often provides massive opportunities for violent, criminal people to run the business (drugs, prostitution, protection, and the like).

The basic question of why is prostitution illegal is probably along the same lines of why sodomy was illegal up until quite recently: no one bothered changing or challenging the laws.

 

[JFrankA]

The basic question of why is prostitution illegal is probably along the same lines of why sodomy was illegal up until quite recently: no one bothered changing or challenging the laws.

I think there's more to it than just that.

The duality the United States has with it's attitude towards sex is just scary. I've met some people with whom I've told them that I make pornography and they seem to be alright with it, but when I tell them that I believe that prostitution should be made legal to help protect the women involved in the industry, I get a lot of animosity.

.....seems a bit sexist to me.

The point I'm trying to make here is that legalizing prostitution isn't going to happen until attitudes change more. Right now, a woman who has a lot of sex is still labeled a "slut" and even though it's more understood than it was 40 years ago, it's still a negative thing. A prostitute is still stereotyped as a drug addicted, no-talent, lazy, beaten woman, when in fact, that's not the case most of the time.

Most models I've met to work with, some of them prostitutes, are very intelligent, wonderful people and I know one of them who has been a tea-totaler all her life.

There's more to being a prostitute than just lieing on a bed with your legs spread, but people don't see that.

Anyway, the laws aren't going to change anytime soon because of this duality. It took a long time for gay people to be accepted (hell, it took a look time for gay people to be considered insane), and it's going to take a long time for legalizing prostitution to happen. Just look at the arguments that the opposing view has.

By the way, human trafficking is definitely NOT unique to the sex industry. If I recall correctly there was an article in Newsweek (I have to look it up) stating that there was a lot of human trafficking to divert people to pick the plant that makes chocolate....

Stamping out prostitution is not the answer. Trying to do so has only made a bad situation worse. The women involved are the ones who suffer the most by this way of "protecting" them. I honestly don't see how keeping prostitution illegal protects the women at all. In fact, I don't see how arresting a prostitute and her john would stop human trafficking or drug pushers or violence. Everyone here who opposes the legalization of prostitution hasn't given any form of convincing argument to me. Sorry, all I hear is a bunch of fear mongering, moral stance and spin doctoring that just doesn't hold water for me. No offense, please.

Seems logical to me that legalizing it will give women in the business at least some avenue of legal protection, give them more choices and make the ones that are there easier, gives them health care, and yes, more independent. Not to mention how much money the government is missing out on taxes with this.

Just seems to me that opposing it is just "old world morality": "Hey! How would you like your daughter or your wife to be a whore?"

My answer, honestly: "If she was smart about it, safe, no fear of being arrested and very happy with what she's doing: I will support and love her still."



Sorry for the rant. It's 4:30am on Saturday morning.... felt like I had to say something....

 

[Smackety]

I'm kinda of curious to find some anti-prostitution arguments. I'm having a hard time understanding the basis for prostitution being illegal. I am sure there are some decent arguments out there.

Any opinions?

It is not illegal: certain high risk forms of it are, for the protection of morons who otherwise would die of STDs.

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

Sophie,

Thanks for your answers to my questions. Let me try to answer yours:

Would anyone posting in the thread object to a brothel being set up next to a school?

Why/Why not?

No. Who's telling the kids what the women do? If the kids do find out, why can't the parents take the time to teach them instead of sheltering them from the world?

Probably because most parents do not want their children to think being or using a prostitute is a desirable lifestyle choice, and as such, having a brothel close to a school would breed familiarity and lower inhibitions.

Bingo! The problems I see are twofold:

1) It makes morally dubious behaviour seem more acceptable.

2) It will not significantly reduce the abuse of women because there will plenty of desperate women who will not be eligible to work in a legal brothel for criminals to exploit.

Laws are not there to enforce subjective morals, especially when those 'morals' don't have a rational reason behind them.

It can reduce the abuse of women AND give them a means to seek help when they are harmed that they don't currently have.

Laws are there to uphold subjective morals. For example, there are laws to prosecute those who inflict cruelty on animals. As for objective morals, the closest one to being objective I can think of is ‘treat others as you’d like them to treat you’. How many clients would like to be treated as they treat prostitutes?

For example, if a woman is turning to prostitution to feed a drug habit, I doubt she would pass the entry requirements of a regulated brothel.

but when she is in need of help, she will be able to obtain it easier. And are you saying that women in the brothels are not helped?

Not at all. What I think may happen is legalising prostitution would stimulate the market to grow. There would be high-quality regulated brothels, which would provide good services for both the women and their clients. Then there would be a (possibly much larger) unregulated sex-worker industry, which would not be much better than the ones we have now as far as working conditions and safety are concerned.

I think legalising and regulating prostitution may be a good idea, but I expect it would not provide the degree of improvement many people who support the idea think it would.

 

[I Ratant]

I imagine there are exceptions. Some people make it by having just the right niche look. But overall, it does help the income tremendously. I admit that I don't have a perfect look (I'm chubby, wear big glasses and am far from a barbie-ish figure), but I still get business and I get at least one offer per week to escort (though, I turn it down for the sake of safety).



Lack of ambition? And, no, those skills aren't always easily developed - in fact, the lack of those skills is probably the #1 reason why girls fail in the industry and why the industry has a high turnover rate. A pretty face alone doesn't make money. Being in the sex industry, though, if that is what you're implying, doesn't mean a lack of interest inthe future. In fact, my experience in the industry is a lead-in to what I plan for the future. It will be very important experience for me to have in the long run.

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" high turnover rate."
Some of the gals around here leave the business by dying.. terminated with extreme prejudice.
One of the gals I spend time with talks about chokings, and beatings and stabbings, and jumping out of moving cars... and seldom has any cash for things like... food! And she's been doing it since high school, with no serious thought of trying anything less hazardous.

 

[JFrankA]

.
" high turnover rate."
Some of the gals around here leave the business by dying.. terminated with extreme prejudice.
One of the gals I spend time with talks about chokings, and beatings and stabbings, and jumping out of moving cars... and seldom has any cash for things like... food! And she's been doing it since high school, with no serious thought of trying anything less hazardous.

...and keeping prostitution illegal will help someone like this.....how?

Seems to me that if it was made legal, there would be more avenues for prostitutes to seek help. Right now if they try to get help, most likely they'd be chased away or arrested.

 

[I Ratant]

...and keeping prostitution illegal will help someone like this.....how?

Seems to me that if it was made legal, there would be more avenues for prostitutes to seek help. Right now if they try to get help, most likely they'd be chased away or arrested.

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I'm all for legalizing it!
The abuses would certainly be curtailed by letting the women work in a brothel, instead of off a street corner.
"Bouncer in a brothel" might be a decent job.
I can see "perks" accumulating.
The onus on prostitution is mainly driven by ignorant religious sensitivities that are almost unique to the essentially fundamental Xtian background infesting this country.
It's as two-faced as the "preacher doors" in the liquor stores in the south, where liquor is frowned upon, especially if one is a member of the clergy, and would be formally ostracized from the community were he to use the same door the other liquor disdainers but purchasers use.

 

[Mobyseven]

Does having some ethical clothes manufacturers help children in sweatshops?

You're right. We should outlaw ethical clothes manufacturers!

 

[iamivy]

I'm kinda of curious to find some anti-prostitution arguments. I'm having a hard time understanding the basis for prostitution being illegal. I am sure there are some decent arguments out there.

Any opinions?

It should be legalized if it is not specially when people chose that as their profession.They should be asked for mandatory health care and provided free health care and advice.That would make them tax payers as well.

 

[Jonnyclueless]

One of the problems is that legal prostitutes have trouble getting health care because of their profession. And being in such a high risk profession it's understandable for insurance companies.

 

[kerikiwi]

One of the problems is that legal prostitutes have trouble getting health care because of their profession. And being in such a high risk profession it's understandable for insurance companies.

And illegal prostitutes find it easier to get health care?
Really, I think you should choose a name which is genuinely ironic...

 

[jimtron]

One of the problems is that legal prostitutes have trouble getting health care because of their profession. And being in such a high risk profession it's understandable for insurance companies.

What keeps legal prostitutes from getting health care? eta: Do you have evidence of this?

 

[pgwenthold]

One of the problems is that legal prostitutes have trouble getting health care because of their profession. And being in such a high risk profession it's understandable for insurance companies.

Are you speaking from some basis or are you making this up?

Consider, legal prostitutes get regular (as in monthly) physical checkups and disease testing. Seems to me like they have very good health care.

 

[I Ratant]

And illegal prostitutes find it easier to get health care?
.../QUOTE]
.
ERs treat everyone that shows up. They really really like you to have health insurance, but if you don't, you get the medical treatment you need anyway.

 

[Tsukasa Buddha]

Just as an interesting factoid, prostitutes actually have a lower preponderance of AIDS etc. than the general population.

(Sorry, I will find my linky later)