What's your theory about 9/11?

Reply to LSSBB

"Mass casualties" is undefined. It could mean hundreds.

Since the CIA already knew that KSM was directing this attack and that his plan for this attack would involve flying several large commercial airliners that had been hijacked into the sides of the World Trade Center Towers, one can assume that the CIA meant thousands when they were referring to mass casualties. Over 15,000 people work in each tower of the World Trade Center Towers.

In addition after the USS Cole was bombed nine months after the failed attack on the USS The Sullivans in the exact same location in Yemen as the Cole, it was clear that the al Qaeda terrorists never give up on a target if they were not successful the first time in destroying it. Everyone was aware that the World Trade Center Towers were a continuing target for the al Qaeda terrorists.
 
Ok, what evidence did they have at that time ?


The evidence I sited in my post is the evidence they had at the time. Mihdhar and Hazmi were identified by the NSA to the CIA and FBI HQ in a phone call to the communications hub, in December 1999, for the east Africa Cole bombings and were identified as part of the al Qaeda terrorist organization at that time and then were known on January 4, 2001 to have taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing.
 
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The evidence I sited in my post is the evidence they had at the time. Mihdhar and Hazmi were identified by the NSA to the CIA and FBI HQ in a phone call to the communications hub, in December 1999, for the east Africa Cole bombings and were identified as part of the al Qaeda terrorists organization at that time and then were known on January 4, 2001 to have taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing.

The evidence against Mihdhar and Hazmi for their involvement in the Cole bombings is what I would like to see.
 
The evidence against Mihdhar and Hazmi for their involvement in the Cole bombings is what I would like to see.
This is the fact that the CIA had positively identified Walid bin-Attash on January 4, 2001 in a photo taken of him at the al Qaeda planning meeting in Kuala Lumpur, and knew that Mihdhar and Hazmi had also been at that same meeting. Walid bin Attash had been identified in October 2000 by FBI Agent Ali Soufan as the mastermind of the Cole bombing.

The CIA had desperately tried to keep this information secret from the FBI Cole bombing investigators, even committing numerous major Federal felonies to do so, and in the end allowed the attacks on 9/11 to take place rather than allow Bongardt to take part in any criminal investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi.
 
The evidence I sited in my post is the evidence they had at the time. Mihdhar and Hazmi were identified by the NSA to the CIA and FBI HQ in a phone call to the communications hub, in December 1999, for the east Africa Cole bombings and were identified as part of the al Qaeda terrorists organization at that time and then were known on January 4, 2001 to have taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing.
What was the plot? Who knew the plot? Anyone? No. only 19

You make up lies about 911.
 
...The CIA had desperately tried to keep this information secret from the FBI Cole bombing investigators, even committing numerous major Federal felonies to do so, and in the end allowed the attacks on 9/11 to take place rather than allow Bongardt to take part in any criminal investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi.
He said "evidence" NOT "unsupported bare assertions". :mad:
 
Since the CIA already knew that KSM was directing this attack and that his plan for this attack would involve flying several large commercial airliners that had been hijacked into the sides of the World Trade Center Towers, one can assume that the CIA meant thousands when they were referring to mass casualties. Over 15,000 people work in each tower of the World Trade Center Towers.

Wait, what? The Bojinka plot included a lot of different options and phases, the final one of which was flying planes into many buildings, not just the WTC. This info was from 1995, IIRC. Not exactly current intel. First, they were going to bomb the pope, then they were going to bomb airports, then they were going to crash a bomb-filled Cessna into CIA headquarters. Is this what you mean by "the CIA knew" that they were targeting the WTC with hijacked planes? Did any of the other parts of the Bojinka plot ever happen?
 
Wait, what? The Bojinka plot included a lot of different options and phases, the final one of which was flying planes into many buildings, not just the WTC. This info was from 1995, IIRC. Not exactly current intel. First, they were going to bomb the pope, then they were going to bomb airports, then they were going to crash a bomb-filled Cessna into CIA headquarters. Is this what you mean by "the CIA knew" that they were targeting the WTC with hijacked planes? Did any of the other parts of the Bojinka plot ever happen?
Yes Khalid Sheikh Mohammed had placed a small watch bomb under the seat on a plane to Hong Kong and it blew the leg off of a Japanese passenger.

The fact that the al Qaeda terrorists had attacked the World Trade Center Towers before, in 1993, was even more confirmation that the World Trade Center Towers were going to be attacked again since they missed destroying these towers in their first attack. This fact was obvious when the al Qaeda terrorists went after the USS Cole after missing the USS The Sullivans just 9 months earlier.

Corsi, Middleton, and Wilshire all knew that Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US on August 22, 2001, and hence all knew these al Qaeda terrorists were going to take part in a massive al Qaeda attack inside of the US, which both the CIA and FBI HQ had been getting warnings about since April 2001.

Corsi, Middleton, and Wilshire also knew that Mihdhar and Hazmi had taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing. Hence they knew when they refused to give FBI criminal Agent Steve Bongardt this information and then shut his investigation down, that they were committing major Federal felonies. This information on the fact that al Qaeda terrorists Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US went back to the CIA bin laden unit on August 22, 2001 and went to Richard Blee, head of bin Laden unit, Cofer Black his boss and George Tenet , Cofer Blacks’ boss and head of the CIA.

When these people either shut down Bongardt's investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi or allowed this investigation to be shut down, by CIA managers Blee, Black and Tenet they all knew that that this would allow the al Qaeda terrorists to murder thousands of Americans, in this attack. Yet they did this anyway and these actions were then covered over by the Joint Inquiry Committee and the 9/11 Commission but were actually detailed in the DOJ IG report. This report when combined with the Moussaoui trial documents, the account of FBI Agent Ali Soufan by Lawrence Wright, the book "State of Denial" by Bob Woodward and the article on Richard Blee in the January, 2007 issue of Harpers are conclusive proof that the highest CIA managers along with the FBI HQ agents and managers they had corrupted allowed this attack to take place, even when they all knew that this attack would allow the al Qaeda terrorists to murder thousands of Americans.
 
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Yes Khalid Sheikh Mohammed had placed a small watch bomb under the seat on a plane to Hong Kong and it blew the leg off of a Japanese passenger.

The fact that the al Qaeda terrorists had attacked the World Trade Center Towers before, in 1993, was even more confirmation that the World Trade Center Towers were going to be attacked again since they missed destroying these towers in their first attack. This fact was obvious when the al Qaeda terrorists went after the USS Cole after missing the USS The Sullivans just 9 months earlier.

Corsi, Middleton, and Wilshire all knew that Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US on August 22, 2001, and hence all knew these al Qaeda terrorists were going to take part in a massive al Qaeda attack inside of the US, which both the CIA and FBI HQ had been getting warnings about since April 2001.

Corsi, Middleton, and Wilshire also knew that Mihdhar and Hazmi had taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing. Hence they knew when they refused to give FBI criminal Agent Steve Bongardt this information and then shut his investigation down, that they were committing major Federal felonies. This information on the fact that al Qaeda terrorists Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US went back to the CIA bin laden unit on August 22, 2001 and went to Richard Blee, head of bin Laden unit, Cofer Black his boss and George Tenet , Cofer Blacks’ boss and head of the CIA.

When these people either shut down Bongardt's investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi or allowed this investigation to be shut down, by CIA managers Blee, Black and Tenet they all knew that that this would allow the al Qaeda terrorists to murder thousands of Americans, in this attack. Yet they did this anyway and these actions were then covered over by the Joint Inquiry Committee and the 9/11 Commission but were actually detailed in the DOJ IG report. This report when combined with the Moussaoui trial documents, the account of FBI Agent Ali Soufan by Lawrence Wright, the book "State of Denial" by Bob Woodward and the article on Richard Blee in the January, 2007 issue of Harpers are conclusive proof that the highest CIA managers along with the FBI HQ agents and managers they had corrupted allowed this attack to take place, even when they all knew that this attack would allow the al Qaeda terrorists to murder thousands of Americans.

Is this your inside job evidence, a repeat of your SPAM attack with failed conclusions? How do you make up this stuff?

Wow, you have a load of disjointed junk.
 
He said "evidence" NOT "unsupported bare assertions". :mad:


This information and the evidence is all in the DOJ IG report see pages 280-310. To get a complete picture, then combine this information with the account of Ali Soufan by Lawrence Wright, the book State of Denial by Bob Woodward, the Moussaoui trial documents and the article by Ken Silverstein in the January 2007 Harpers on Richard Blee.

See the information on January 4, 2001 in the DOJ IG report, just get the DOJ IG report off of the internet and search for January 4, 2001. This was when Walid bin Attash, mastermind of the Cole bombing, was positively identified by the CIA/FBI joint source from his photo take at Kuala Lumpur. The CIA already knew on January 4, 2000 that both Mihdhar and Hazmi had also been at this al Qaeda planning meeting.
 
This information and the evidence is all in the DOJ IG report see pages 280-310. To get a complete picture, then combine this information with the account of Ali Soufan by Lawrence Wright, the book State of Denial by Bob Woodward, the Moussaoui trial documents and the article by Ken Silverstein in the January 2007 Harpers on Richard Blee.

See the information on January 4, 2001 in the DOJ IG report, just get the DOJ IG report off of the internet and search for January 4, 2001. This was when Walid bin Attash, mastermind of the Cole bombing, was positively identified by the CIA/FBI joint source from his photo take at Kuala Lumpur. The CIA already knew on January 4, 2000 that both Mihdhar and Hazmi had also been at this al Qaeda planning meeting.

You don't understand what he meant by "unsupported bare assertions".

How does this support the inside job stuff?
 
Yes Khalid Sheikh Mohammed had placed a small watch bomb under the seat on a plane to Hong Kong and it blew the leg off of a Japanese passenger.
I wasn't aware of that. It didn't make his charge sheet. Have a link? My copy of Looming Tower is in storage.

OK, I'm trying to parse your logic. I asked if the Bojinka plot from 1995 was your evidence that, in September of 2001, "the CIA already knew that KSM was directing this attack and that his plan for this attack would involve flying several large commercial airliners that had been hijacked into the sides of the World Trade Center Towers." It appears that your answer to my question is "yes." Feel free to clarify if you can.

The fact that the al Qaeda terrorists had attacked the World Trade Center Towers before, in 1993, was even more confirmation that the World Trade Center Towers were going to be attacked again since they missed destroying these towers in their first attack. This fact was obvious when the al Qaeda terrorists went after the USS Cole after missing the USS The Sullivans just 9 months earlier.

Your paragraph above puzzles me. The fact that KSM would attack the World Trade Center again in 2001 was clear to you because they failed to bring those same towers down 8 years before. This was "obvious" because Al Qaeda went after the USS Cole just 9 months after they failed to hit a different ship, The Sullivans. What in the hell kind of logic is that?

I'll ignore the rest of your spiel; we've all seen it before. Your innuendo is built dot-connecting that has no foundation.
 
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I wasn't aware of that. It didn't make his charge sheet. Have a link? My copy of Looming Tower is in storage.

OK, I'm trying to parse your logic. I asked if the Bojinka plot from 1995 was your evidence that, in September of 2001, "the CIA already knew that KSM was directing this attack and that his plan for this attack would involve flying several large commercial airliners that had been hijacked into the sides of the World Trade Center Towers." It appears that your answer to my question is "yes." Feel free to clarify if you can.



Your paragraph above puzzles me. The fact that KSM would attack the World Trade Center again in 2001 was clear to you because they failed to bring those same towers down 8 years before. This was "obvious" because Al Qaeda went after the USS Cole just 9 months after they failed to hit a different ship, The Sullivans. What in the hell kind of logic is that?

I'll ignore the rest of your spiel; we've all seen it before. Your innuendo is built dot-connecting that has no foundation.

Wrong, on June 12, 2001, according the 9/11 Commission report, the CIA was told that the huge al Qaeda terrorist attack that they had been getting many warnings about was being directed by KSM, and that he was recruiting numerous al Qaeda terrorists to be sent into the US to link up with other al Qaeda terrorists already inside of the US in the summer of 2001 to carry out this attack. This account in the 9/11 Commission report does not go beyond this. These are the dots:

Dot #1. CIA is told on June 12, 2001, according toe the 9/11 Commission report, that KSM was directing the al Qaeda terrorist attack that the CIA had been getting numerous warnings about since April 2001.

Dot #2. The CIA already had KSM's Bojinka plot which indicated that KSM had devised a plan to hijack several large commercial airliners in the US, using al Qaeda terrorists inside of the US, and fly these planes into the World Trade Center Towers, the Pentagon, the US Capital build, and perhaps other buildings, including the CIA headquarters.

Dot #3. In the summer of 2001, the CIA already knew that al Qaeda terrorist Nawaf al-Hazmi was in the US. The CIA already knew that al Qaeda terrorist Khalid al-Mihdhar had a multi-entry visa for the US, and was Hazmis traveling companion.

Dot# 4. By connecting these very simple dots, the CIA could conclude that Khalid al-Mihdhar would enter the US,which hew did on July 4, 2001, join up with Nawaf al-Hazmi and take part in a al Qaeda terrorist attack using hijacked aircraft flown into the sides of the World Trade Center Towers, the Pentagon and the US Capital building.

HELLO, HELLO there are only four God Damn dots for the Christ sake. Are you telling me you cannot connect up these four God Damn dots?

To summarize, in the summer of 2001, the CIA clearly knew that Nawaf al-Hazmi was an al Qaeda terrorist already inside of the US, and that Khalid al-Mihdhar had a multi-entry visa for the US, had been Hazmi’s travel companion, and had been at Kuala Lumpur with Mihdhar planning the Cole bombing. So they clearly could have put the dots together and concluded that Mihdhar would enter the US, which he did on July 4, 2001, join up with Hazmi to take part in the attack they were being warned about, and even that al Qaeda terrorists Mihdhar and Hazmi were some of the al Qaeda terrorists that, the people KSM was recruiting and sending into the US, would link up with in the US. When Margaret Gillespie discovered both Mihdhar and Hazmi inside of the US on August 21, 2001, and this information went through out the CIA bin Laden unit on August 22, 2001, this confirmed to the CIA that these two al Qaeda terrorists, Mihdhar an Hazmi, were some of the terrorist that the al Qaeda terrorists that KSM was recruiting would link up with to carry out this massive al Qaeda terrorists attack.

And as to your quote:

“Your paragraph above puzzles me. The fact that KSM would attack the World Trade Center again in 2001 was clear to you because they failed to bring those same towers down 8 years before. This was "obvious" because Al Qaeda went after the USS Cole just 9 months after they failed to hit a different ship, The Sullivans. What in the hell kind of logic is that?”

I know it is hard for some people to connect the dots but I will try anyway.

When the al Qaeda terrorists went back after the USS Cole after first failing to destroy the USS The Sullivans, it showed that they, the al Qaeda terrorists never give up trying to destroy a target if they failed to destroy this target the first time. This is due to several simple reasons. First they had already done all of the research on this target. Second this target was right in their consciousness. If the had good reasons for going after this target in the first place, these reasons still existed. Third KSM had helped finance the attacks on the World Trade Center Tower in 1993, the attack that had failed to bring down these towers at that time even though this had been their goal in this attack. Fourth, Ramzi Yousef, KSM's cousin, after he was captured, and was flying over these towers in Manhattan told the FBI agent he was with “Next time we will not fail”. It is clear that the “we” here means that the al Qaeda terrorist organization since Yousef knew he was going to prison for a very long time. I don’t know how anyone can make it any clearer. The proof in this logic is that the al Qaeda terrorists then went back after the World Trade Center Towers. They did just what very simple logic and connecting these very few and simple dots would indicate they would do.

HELLO!

This logic was so pervasive at the time, that when Rudy Giuliani wanted to put the New York City emergency center in Building 7 at the World Trade Center prior to the attacks on 9/11, he was told that he should never do this since these building remained a continuing target for the al Qaeda terrorists. But he did it anyway.
 
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You have four dots AND the hindsight of exactly what picture the dots make. Your entire set of conclusions are based entirely on the fact that you know what the attack profile was.

You have guilt by association of mindhar and hamzi, basically that they were in the same city as another known terrorist at the time of a potential planning meeting.

You parse the many targets and plans in bojinka down to those which fit what you know would happen on Sept 11/01. One plan was to hijack several aircraft around the world and simply crash them, or crash them into targets of many western countries.

You assume that the CIA and FBI shoulda, coulda, woulda operated in a fashion that more characterizes the way they did POST-911.

You have convinced yourself that the WTC would be a target because having failed to hit one warship they tried again on another and succeeded. Actually that would point to a similar reasoning that since they failed to destroy the WTC they would target the Sears Tower or the TransAmerica building, or any of a half dozen large, well known office structures. However, you model your conclusions on the fact that you already know for certain what the targets were and seem completely incapable of separating what you know for certain from what the persons involved would have had to guess at.

I also assume you believe that Denver threw the Superbowl since they had all the info they needed on how Seattle was going to kick their butts!
 
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As far as the Denver Broncos go jaydee, I don't usually buy into conspiracy theories, but only an elaborate conspiracy can explain our poor performance last week!
 
Obviously that first hike sending the ball past a supposedly surprised Manning was a complete set up!:)
I thought they kidnapped Eli... then I saw Eli at the game, up in the boxes...

"they" did it, we need paloalto to solve how they did it

It can't be a bad game against the number one defense in the nation, it had to be an inside job; it had to be more than a bad game... or three or four forced turnovers.

I found out how they did it... A Clemson player made four tackles and forced a turn over... The CIA put a Clemson player on the wrong team...

My daughter says it was due to the coach's connection to UOP, her school, but it was my school; Clemson caused the inside job...
 
Yes Khalid Sheikh Mohammed had placed a small watch bomb under the seat on a plane to Hong Kong and it blew the leg off of a Japanese passenger.

The fact that the al Qaeda terrorists had attacked the World Trade Center Towers before, in 1993, was even more confirmation that the World Trade Center Towers were going to be attacked again since they missed destroying these towers in their first attack. This fact was obvious when the al Qaeda terrorists went after the USS Cole after missing the USS The Sullivans just 9 months earlier.

Corsi, Middleton, and Wilshire all knew that Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US on August 22, 2001, and hence all knew these al Qaeda terrorists were going to take part in a massive al Qaeda attack inside of the US, which both the CIA and FBI HQ had been getting warnings about since April 2001.

Corsi, Middleton, and Wilshire also knew that Mihdhar and Hazmi had taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing. Hence they knew when they refused to give FBI criminal Agent Steve Bongardt this information and then shut his investigation down, that they were committing major Federal felonies. This information on the fact that al Qaeda terrorists Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US went back to the CIA bin laden unit on August 22, 2001 and went to Richard Blee, head of bin Laden unit, Cofer Black his boss and George Tenet , Cofer Blacks’ boss and head of the CIA.

When these people either shut down Bongardt's investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi or allowed this investigation to be shut down, by CIA managers Blee, Black and Tenet they all knew that that this would allow the al Qaeda terrorists to murder thousands of Americans, in this attack. Yet they did this anyway and these actions were then covered over by the Joint Inquiry Committee and the 9/11 Commission but were actually detailed in the DOJ IG report. This report when combined with the Moussaoui trial documents, the account of FBI Agent Ali Soufan by Lawrence Wright, the book "State of Denial" by Bob Woodward and the article on Richard Blee in the January, 2007 issue of Harpers are conclusive proof that the highest CIA managers along with the FBI HQ agents and managers they had corrupted allowed this attack to take place, even when they all knew that this attack would allow the al Qaeda terrorists to murder thousands of Americans.

Do you ever provide proof of your assertions?
 

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