Was Jonathan Kay bought off by a Neo-Con Think Tank?

[Nick Terry]

NOT.

It ridicules Holocaust revisionism and hides the true intent/reference of "zionist big lies" which is the treatment of Palestinians by Israel.

I'm going to try and say this slowly, Clayton.

A Google search for 'zionist big lies' immediately throws up hits to videos made by noted anti-Zionist, cosnspiracy minded sites like prothink, videos which are quite clearly made by real Holocaust revisionists. It also throws up links to blogs which from their title are quite clearly written by real Holocaust revisionists.

None of this is spin doctoring, or the product of a malign algorithm. It's the product of the same google algorithm which dictates that sites with more links to them get higher results.

 

[Clayton Moore]

I'm going to try and say this slowly, Clayton.

A Google search for 'zionist big lies' immediately throws up hits to videos made by noted anti-Zionist, cosnspiracy minded sites like prothink, videos which are quite clearly made by real Holocaust revisionists. It also throws up links to blogs which from their title are quite clearly written by real Holocaust revisionists.

None of this is spin doctoring, or the product of a malign algorithm. It's the product of the same google algorithm which dictates that sites with more links to them get higher results.

Did you write the code?

 

[Nick Terry]

As a German I totally can not stand listening to debates like this, but I've heard Barrett say in other shows that he remained totally unconvinced by the arguments of that guy. On principle I'm opposed to the laws we have about questioning history, as ridiculous as those questions may be - after all this is not an event that happened a decade of illegal wars triggered by it ago, but far more than half a century of relative peace and investigations from all sides involved - but free speech is either total or doesn't exist.

Barrett is the kind of guy who gets emails from listeners who identify themselves as Nazis and turn around inviting them on his show which he titles "Am I not kind enough to Hitler?" That floor-wiping was hilarious.

If Barrett said as I think you implied, that he was not convinced by Roberto Muehlenkamp from Holocaust Controversies, then this does rather place him back on the fence, at the very least. I am of course not surprised since Barrett's audience and milieu expose him very directly to Holocaust denial and it would require quite a change of heart for him to abandon people he has very clearly promoted in the past. I regard Barrett as a fellow-traveller of the deniers in the classic sense of the term.

 

[Childlike Empress]

If Barrett said as I think you implied, that he was not convinced by Roberto Muehlenkamp from Holocaust Controversies, then this does rather place him back on the fence, at the very least. I am of course not surprised since Barrett's audience and milieu expose him very directly to Holocaust denial and it would require quite a change of heart for him to abandon people he has very clearly promoted in the past. I regard Barrett as a fellow-traveller of the deniers in the classic sense of the term.

Sorry, i've just a minute ago while you posted edited my post to specify that I meant the Dalton guy. Sloppy wording on my part.

 

[Nick Terry]

Did you write the code?

I don't need to write code to see what is as plain as day, that pro-revisionist sites are in no way excluded from google searches.

Unless you're arguing that those particular revisionist sites are fake revisionist sites, I really don't see what your problem is.

 

[Nick Terry]

Sorry, i've just a minute ago while you posted edited my post to specify that I meant the Dalton guy. Sloppy wording on my part.

Ah, thanks, sorry for the confusion.

Yes, there was a bit of a 'who lost China?' vibe going around the denier community after that debate, since Dalton was meant to wipe the floor with his opponents and clearly didn't do so.

Are you saying that Barrett has backed away from denial in the past 1-2 years?

 

[Justin39640]

As a German I totally can not stand listening to debates like this, but I've heard Barrett say in other shows that he remained totally unconvinced by the arguments of that guy. On principle I'm opposed to the laws we have about questioning history, as ridiculous as those questions may be - after all this is not an event that happened a decade of illegal wars triggered by it ago, but far more than half a century of relative peace and investigations from all sides involved - but free speech is either total or doesn't exist.

Barrett is the kind of guy who gets emails from listeners who identify themselves as Nazis and turn around inviting them on his show which he titles "Am I not kind enough to Hitler?" That floor-wiping was hilarious.

How can anyone take that kook seriously?

IDK how anyone can say diesel emissions aren't harmful. That's *********** retarded. It sounds like he's talking about engines today which have low sulfur fuels, EECs, and after 2007 in the US, soot filters and full emission controls. When a diesel is fully loaded with a mechanical pump, it will pump out unburnt fuel in that characteristic black plume of smoke (that you don't see all too often these days).

Even with a modern diesel I wouldn't want to be locked in a room with one running. They use exhaust systems in repair shops for a reason! That's also why I would never sell a customer a diesel machine that was going to run primarily indoors. I'd sell them a LPG or battery powered machine. Again, for very good reasons.

Also from Wiki:

Mortality from diesel soot exposure in 2001 was at least 14,400 out of the German population of 82 million, according to the official report 2352 of the Umweltbundesamt Berlin (Federal Environmental Agency of Germany).

 

[Justin39640]

Did you write the code?

I like turtles...

 

[000063]

NOT.

It ridicules Holocaust revisionism and hides the true intent/reference of "zionist big lies" which is the treatment of Palestinians by Israel.

You're not actually addressing anything about the algorithm, which is, after all, just a computer program. Most of their results are determined by what is on the site and how many sites link to them and in what manner.

Here's Yahoo.

And Excite.

Notice the Holocaust denial and 9/11 Truther websites in the results, including several Barrett references? Clearly, it's used to refer to more than just Israeli-Palestine relations, meaning that you are categorically wrong.

But please, continue trying to split hairs and No True Scotsman over an argument you've already lost. You have so much practice at it.

 

[Nick Terry]

How can anyone take that kook seriously?

IDK how anyone can say diesel emissions aren't harmful. That's *********** retarded. It sounds like he's talking about engines today which have low sulfur fuels, EECs, and after 2007 in the US, soot filters and full emission controls. When a diesel is fully loaded with a mechanical pump, it will pump out unburnt fuel in that characteristic black plume of smoke (that you don't see all too often these days).

Even with a modern diesel I wouldn't want to be locked in a room with one running. They use exhaust systems in repair shops for a reason! That's also why I would never sell a customer a diesel machine that was going to run primarily indoors. I'd sell them and LPG or battery powered machine. Again, for very good reasons.

Also from Wiki:

The even more retarded thing is that Dalton is tilting at a windmill since the best evidence indicates gasoline-fuelled engines were used, something which has been argued for quite a number of years now, but in common with other deniers he won't change the record. See pages 317-329 of the PDF linked in my sig for more.

 

[Childlike Empress]

Ah, thanks, sorry for the confusion.

Entirely my fault.

Yes, there was a bit of a 'who lost China?' vibe going around the denier community after that debate, since Dalton was meant to wipe the floor with his opponents and clearly didn't do so.

Are you saying that Barrett has backed away from denial in the past 1-2 years?

I only recently have developed a habit of selectivly listening to his shows. In that time it was clear to me that he does not buy into the arguments of holocaust denial at all. You have to come up with evidence other than that single ambiguous quote he denies having written to make me believe that he somehow changed his mind.

 

[000063]

Did you write the code?

Irrelevant. The basics are proven by experiment. People have figured out how to "game" Google in order to increase their prominence in the results, both for financial gain and personal amusement.

And once again, you attempt to focus on a minor detail instead of addressing the main point, which you know you can't refute. Just keep the ball in the air, Clayton, try to run out the clock.

 

[Clayton Moore]

I don't need to write code to see what is as plain as day, that pro-revisionist sites are in no way excluded from google searches.

Unless you're arguing that those particular revisionist sites are fake revisionist sites, I really don't see what your problem is.

Duh, double duh. My point was that the algorithm buried the point of the true intent/reference of "zionist big lies" which is the treatment of Palestinians by Israel.

 

[Childlike Empress]

Please remember that this is not a thread about holocaust denial. And before somebody asks - the Barrett quote in #44 is Finkelstein, not Zündel.

 

[fourtoe]

Barrett hosted an on-air debate between Holocaust denier Thomas Dalton and two members of Holocaust Controversies blog

http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.co.uk/2010/04/interviews-on-american-freedom-radio.html#more

not sure if the links are still up but maybe the recording is still there.

More background here
http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.co.uk/2010/04/invitation-to-mr-thomas-dalton.html#more

The debate was held not to have gone terribly well for Dalton.

Thank you for posting this. The audio is still up but it is very crappy. Lots of hiccups/glitches are heard throughout and an hour in (at least for me) the file stops playing--you have to restart the file and ffwd to after the hour mark to hear the rest and it cuts out like 20 minutes later.

Dalton sounds insane. His claim that there is no physical evidence is the most atrocious claim I've ever heard. I'm an archaeologist/anthropologist who specializes in warfare and mass graves are frequently discussed in the literature. I've never been able to pull the "I'm an expert here..." card before...

ETA: okay no more Holocaust Denial, but for the record, listening to the link that Nick posted has convinced me even more that Kevin is one BUT he is definitely aware that blatantly saying so will make him look even more ridiculous.

 

[dafydd]

Please remember that this is not a thread about holocaust denial. And before somebody asks - the Barrett quote in #44 is Finkelstein, not Zündel.

What is your answer to the question in the title of the thread? Yes or no?

 

[000063]

Duh, double duh. My point was that the algorithm buried the point of the true intent/reference of "zionist big lies" which is the treatment of Palestinians by Israel.

No True Scotsman? I thought you were better than th-PFFFT!

Couldn't keep a straight face.

 

[carlitos]

Just found the Kevin Barrett quote I was looking for at Gravy's site. Since CE is unaware of these anti-semitic 'codes' I'll remind him that the suffix "-ster" is a common one, notably used in "bankster."

"If you are not aware that you're covering up for that traitor and mass murderer and yes insurance fraudster Silverstein, you'll figure it out when you're beside him on the scaffold. I'll be saving this email as evidence for your trial."
– Kevin Barrett, "Scholar For 9/11 Truth" and failed Muslim

 

[twinstead]

Yup. We'll all rue the day that we covered up for that filthy Jew Silverstein