Split Thread VisionFromFeeling's missing organ test

[VisionFromFeeling]

Everybody, someone I know spoke with a contractor and found out that he has had an organ removed. I didn't let my friend tell me what that organ is, and suggested that I contact the contractor and explain the investigation I am doing and ask him whether I could try to see which organ it is.

I know it won't be a perfect test, especially since my friend knows what that organ is and for all you know he could have told me. But I will let you know what happens and how it went. It will have credibility issues I know, but at least if I fail to detect it I will let you know and you should all be happy about that. I mean, you would love it if I come here and said that I failed.

At least what this does is add to my claim and experience.

[info]Split from: http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150447[/info]

 

[Empress]

Everybody, someone I know spoke with a contractor and found out that he has had an organ removed. I didn't let my friend tell me what that organ is, and suggested that I contact the contractor and explain the investigation I am doing and ask him whether I could try to see which organ it is.

I know it won't be a perfect test, especially since my friend knows what that organ is and for all you know he could have told me. But I will let you know what happens and how it went. It will have credibility issues I know, but at least if I fail to detect it I will let you know and you should all be happy about that. I mean, you would love it if I come here and said that I failed.

At least what this does is add to my claim and experience.

Yes, it will have credibility issues, just like you have credibility issues. It's a bad test in the first place, for all sorts of reasons. But even besides the obvious issues, we can predict from experience that if you guess wrong, you'll post-dict a "hit".

"I knew it!! I knew it, I just thought logically he couldn't be that active if he was missing a lung! I got it right, I just didn't believe myself, so I went with a missing gallbladder!!"

Are you genuinely submitting that, after the pains so many have taken to explain to you, you still do not understand why a preposterous "test" like this is worse than no test at all? REALLY?

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

Everybody, someone I know spoke with a contractor and found out that he has had an organ removed. I didn't let my friend tell me what that organ is, and suggested that I contact the contractor and explain the investigation I am doing and ask him whether I could try to see which organ it is.

I know it won't be a perfect test, especially since my friend knows what that organ is and for all you know he could have told me. But I will let you know what happens and how it went. It will have credibility issues I know, but at least if I fail to detect it I will let you know and you should all be happy about that. I mean, you would love it if I come here and said that I failed.

At least what this does is add to my claim and experience.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, a poorly designed test is not better than no test.

What you're setting up for is another anecdote, really. First, how many organs can a person live without? (Spleen, kidney*, lung---any others?) So your pool of choices is not very great. Some of them (a lung) can be ruled out in a matter of minutes just talking with the person. You've admitted that there's no stopping information leakage (and it doesn't have to be just stuff you're consciously aware of--that is, it's not simply a question of whether or not you're lying, although you've demonstrated a credibility gap already). And then there's cold reading techniques (where you chat with the person and get them to supply information while they think you were the one who gave it).

Even if you report a failure in this case, it's not useful. We've got no numbers or anything. It's just an anecdote. It'd be like having a headache, taking tylenol and then noting that the headache didn't go away. Would you conclude from that anecdote that tylenol isn't effective on headaches?

Conversely, if it works, it could be like having a headache, applying Head-on and noting that the headache went away some time after that. Would you conclude from that anecdote that Head-on is effective on headaches?

At any rate, your x-ray vision claim is simple enough to test for real. You just don't seem interested in taking that test.

ETA: *And I suspect we can rule out kidney because I would assume the reason this came up in conversation with your friend was that you were talking about the kidney test.

 

[LightinDarkness]

Everybody, someone I know spoke with a contractor and found out that he has had an organ removed. I didn't let my friend tell me what that organ is, and suggested that I contact the contractor and explain the investigation I am doing and ask him whether I could try to see which organ it is.

I know it won't be a perfect test, especially since my friend knows what that organ is and for all you know he could have told me. But I will let you know what happens and how it went. It will have credibility issues I know, but at least if I fail to detect it I will let you know and you should all be happy about that. I mean, you would love it if I come here and said that I failed.

At least what this does is add to my claim and experience.

No, this does not add to your claim. I can't believe anyone could be beyond their first semester in college and not recognize why this "test" is not a test and provides no support for anything regardless of the result. There are innumerable ways you could guess a missing organ as its already been pointed out, and even if you truly were using your xray superpowers 1 hit proves absolutely nothing.

This is how you operate though. You find little anecdotes and claim to be successful, and then put a barrier in place for every kind of real test of your claimed superpowers.

 

[Ashles]

Everybody, someone I know spoke with a contractor and found out that he has had an organ removed. I didn't let my friend tell me what that organ is, and suggested that I contact the contractor and explain the investigation I am doing and ask him whether I could try to see which organ it is.

I know it won't be a perfect test, especially since my friend knows what that organ is and for all you know he could have told me. But I will let you know what happens and how it went. It will have credibility issues I know, but at least if I fail to detect it I will let you know and you should all be happy about that. I mean, you would love it if I come here and said that I failed.

At least what this does is add to my claim and experience.

No it doesn't.

Why are you interested in going ahead with this test? It is not a kidney detection test which you have repeatedly stated is your strongest claim and the only test you are interested in trying? You have ignored every other suggestion for a different test and even complained when different tests were suggested.
Why has that changed?

If we had suggested a test of people with an unnamed organ missing you would have ignored it or said it was not your main claim so you weren't doing it.
Why is it okay when you are testing someone a friend knows? It is a test as pointless as any of your other anecdotes. I assume it won't be controlled, won't be videoed, no skeptics will be present, and they won't be invited to come on these boards to present their version.
Is their any aspect of such a test we can actually verify as having happened? How would we be able distinguish this from a completely made up story?
Because your current tactic of simply restating things as being true in the total absence of evidence isn't really working.

By the way - this needs to be a seperate thread as it appears entirely different from anything resembling a Kidney Detection Protocol.

And entirely different from anything resemblng a test that will tell anyone anything new about this claim.

When your time is a tight as you claim I don't understand why you would introduce a new random test of no benefit and no credibility.
We thought you wanted to ignore any other testing except the kidney detection.

If that isn't the case you know there are several other far better tests we have suggested, some of which would take very little time.

 

[Audible Click]

I and other posters did suggest looking for tonsils or a missing appendix but VfF said "no" because the kidney claim is her main claim. Now I'm confused, is she ditching the kidney claim and willing to test other organs/things?

 

[Giggywig]

I and other posters did suggest looking for tonsils or a missing appendix but VfF said "no" because the kidney claim is her main claim. Now I'm confused, is she ditching the kidney claim and willing to test other organs/things?

Not if a skeptical organization sets it up. But if it's a friend and there are no controls, well then she's all for it!

 

[Jeff Corey]

...By the way - this needs to be a seperate thread as it appears entirely different from anything resembling a Kidney Detection Protocol....

Yes, because back in post 1040 we got this:

Mod WarningTo all participants - this thread is about VisionFromFeeling's kidney detection test. I suggest reaquainting yourself with the opening post if in doubt.

Further breaches of Rule 11 in this thread will not be tolerated. Punitive action may include suspension and even banning from the Forum.

If you cannot post on-topic then do not post.


I find it ironic that the OPer was the one to ignore this.

 

[tsig]

Yes, because back in post 1040 we got this:

Mod WarningTo all participants - this thread is about VisionFromFeeling's kidney detection test. I suggest reaquainting yourself with the opening post if in doubt.

Further breaches of Rule 11 in this thread will not be tolerated. Punitive action may include suspension and even banning from the Forum.

If you cannot post on-topic then do not post.


I find it ironic that the OPer was the one to ignore this.

Yes

 

[shandyjan]

How many organs can we have removed and live? So what if you guess wrong? So what if you guess right? Guessing games have no place here.

 

[Uncayimmy]

Everybody, someone I know spoke with a contractor and found out that he has had an organ removed. I didn't let my friend tell me what that organ is, and suggested that I contact the contractor and explain the investigation I am doing and ask him whether I could try to see which organ it is.

I know it won't be a perfect test, especially since my friend knows what that organ is and for all you know he could have told me. But I will let you know what happens and how it went. It will have credibility issues I know, but at least if I fail to detect it I will let you know and you should all be happy about that. I mean, you would love it if I come here and said that I failed.

At least what this does is add to my claim and experience.

Let's see, how many organs can one have safely removed? I'll try to go from the top down.

Thyroid
Tonsils
Lung
Spleen
Gallbladder
Kidney
Colon
Appendix
Bladder

Can anyone else think of any others? I don't have much expertise in anatomy.

It's sad that at this point in time you actually believe such a "test" is even remotely worthwhile. First off, you have refused to take any other test besides the kidney test. It's a slap in our faces for you to even bring this up. Second, it's anecdotal, so it won't mean a damn thing to anyone besides yourself, and you, Anita, don't need convincing.

Third, even if you guess correctly, it's not much of a feat when you already know the person is missing an organ, and the list of organs is a short list. A little Googling could provide you with information to help make an educated guess based on appearance and demographics. If you fail, the only thing you will say is, "Well, I never said I could detect missing gallbladders, so this doesn't falsify my claim."

Yawn...

 

[TheSkepticCanuck]

Let's see, how many organs can one have safely removed? I'll try to go from the top down.

Thyroid
Tonsils
Lung
Spleen
Gallbladder
Kidney
Colon
Appendix
Bladder

Can anyone else think of any others? I don't have much expertise in anatomy.

The pancreas could be added to this list, I believe. Life without one would not be fun, but it would be possible. I suspect someone will correct me if I am wrong.

 

[Giggywig]

I don't know if the friend of a friend was female but you can add uterus to the list. And you can add male genitalia as well.

 

[Jonquill]

How about eyeballs? It would be funny if VFF couldn't vibrationally see them

 

[NoZed Avenger]

My money is on gallbladder.



I mean, my psychic powers enable me to see the gallbladder is missing.

 

[Sean84]

How about she actually does something that she says she can do for once. Kidneys, drugs, cereal, feet, it's all the same. The vision claim is always the same, the differences exist solely within the excuses.

 

[Ashles]

Thank you mods for splitting this off as a distinct claim.

So Anita...

Can you describe ANY controls for this experiment you have decided to carry out?

Also why are you conducting this test instead of other, simpler tests such as the Crushed Pill test.

Do you agree this new test is not your strongest ability?

 

[Farencue]

Somebody is missing 2 organs or 2 people are missing one organ.
I am not sure where Anita got these organs from but I, along with Ashles, have received an organ in a box.
So I have deduced that this thread could not be about those particular missing organs that have now been found.
I think I am starting to understand this sciency business of finding missing organs - it is not so sooper secret after all

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

Let's be clear, what Anita is proposing here is nothing like an actual test. No matter what she reports, it will be meaningless.

My prediction: she will report no success in an attempt to regain some credibility. It will turn out that the missing organ is something small (or otherwise unusual) and that's why she couldn't detect it, but come to think of it, she did see a dark spot blah blah blah. So even though she'll report a failure, she'll spin it as successful functioning of her x-ray vision though she failed to name the missing organ because of some other factor (other than the fact that her claim is bogus).

 

[Uncayimmy]

The pancreas could be added to this list, I believe. Life without one would not be fun, but it would be possible. I suspect someone will correct me if I am wrong.

Yes, that's correct. I was looking at a diagram of the human body and working my way through the list. I looked up pancreas removal and read about it, but for some reason I didn't write it down.

I really did see it. Really. I did!

Apparently having your pancreas removed makes you diabetic. That's gotta suck.