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Vegans rely on faith, kill their child

Eos of the Eons

Mad Scientist
Eos of the Eons
Joined
Jul 23, 2003
Messages
13,749
Caleb died on March 29 last year from bronchopneumonia associated with anemia and brain damage caused by a deficiency of vitamin B12, found in animal foods including fish, milk and eggs.

Prosecutors said the couple were vegans who did not eat meat, fish or dairy products. They believed that their son could be treated with prayer, herbs and vegetables.
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They are so ignorant that they don't understand what kind of vegan food you have to eat to get adequate nutrition.


Reminds me of that father that only allowed his wife to nurse his 8 month old, requiring her to only drink soy milk. The baby died as they prayed over him.

http://www.sweenytod.com/rno/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=136

Oh, and that chiro that had his kid on a soy milk diet as an infant. That baby died too. That made me really look into what chiros really are. I couldn't believe how he didn't know that was a bad idea.

ugh.
 
Can someone explain to me the background to why these religions advocate a vegan diet? Seventh Day Adventists, no?
I always thought that God put beasts on Earth for man to eat. Boy, keeping up with religions is not easy.

Simon
 
How did this get in the computer section????

do de do do

Was supposed to be in the religious section! Can somebody please move it?
 
AWPrime said:
That and he put man as well on earth for beast to eat. ;)
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That's not true. In the Garden of Eden all the creatures even the dinosaurs were vegetarians. I read that somewhere.
 
Kiwi Kid said:
Can someone explain to me the background to why these religions advocate a vegan diet?
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A lot of vegetarian stuff is viewed in a quasi-religious way. I'm sure their Adventism "lunacy" didn't make them think herbs were effective. No, that's straight old vegetarian "lunacy".
 
Jeez, this gets annoying running into this problem again and again on these threads:

The title says "VEGAN", not "VEGETARIAN" folks.

There is an important differance. If you don't know what it is, I suggest you google both.


That said, people who try to put their babies on vegan diets are as crazy as people who try to put their cats on vegetarian diets. Except crazier. There is a concept known as in financial circles as "due diligence", and 'getting your kid to the age of 18 alive' certainly comes under it.

Prison time and mandatory hysterectomy/vasectomy for those two, if I was Emperor of the World. Good thing for them that I'm not.
 
On a similar note, I had a college religion professor who openly discussed the fact that her "10 month old daughter is a vegetarian." Poor kid. This is not too suprising, though, because this lady studied Marian apparitions for her doctoral degree. While spending time with a Mexican family that experienced Marian apparitions, she believed every word they said. So much for an emprical doctoral dissertation.

Tony

:p
 
I had a friend when I was about 13, who fell off a tractor and died (apparently--you'll see). His parents, of course, put him in bed and prayed over him. His brother and sister continued to go to school, and didn't mention their brother's situation.

When the medical examiner got a chance to look at the body, the cause of death could not be determined, as the body had decomposed enough that some things could not be examined (at least this is what we were told, and what was in the paper. It could also have been a lazy M.E., I don't know.)

His parents now suffered doubly; they had lost their son, and they were thoroughly convinced that it was because their faith was insufficient. Had they been more devout, they thought, their son would still be alive.

I always thought that was particularly loathesome about healing through prayer--when it doesn't work, you blame the victims. Or the relatives of the victims. I always felt sorry for the parents in this situation.

I don't feel terribly sorry for the parents in the OP, though. Maybe it is small of me, but I hope they have the decency to feel guilty the rest of their lives.
 
bignickel said:
Jeez, this gets annoying running into this problem again and again on these threads:

The title says "VEGAN", not "VEGETARIAN" folks.

There is an important differance. If you don't know what it is, I suggest you google both.
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That maybe so. However, don't pull a Grenard here. If you know the difference, explain it. Don't merely point to Google (like Grenard did).
nono.gif

;)
 
These people are doubly dumb...

Man, these people are dumb for two reasons...

1) There is no vegetable or fruit that contains B12, period. Go look it up. You must take a multi-vitamin or fortified foods to get it. And guess where that B12 comes from.... meat! There is no way to be truly vegan and get all the necessary nutrients. You must at least eat some cheese or eggs.

I will say this again, because not many people realize the truth of this statement:

There is no way to be completely untainted by meat or meat by-products and still get vitamin B12. Period. Being a strict ideological Vegan is not possible. Vegans are stupid if they try to follow their ideology because of the fuzzy creatures... they still die to give you B12. Mostly processed animal liver.

2) Thinking they can solve the problem by any means other than giving the child vitamin supplements.

For the philosophical minded:

When is the parent's right to raise their child as they see fit no longer valid? The quick answer is when the child's health is in danger... but fat kids are never taken away from parents. Who could decide such a thing? I mean, there are obvious cases, but exactly where is this somewhat fuzzy line between OK and not OK?
 
Re: These people are doubly dumb...

Gestahl said:
Man, these people are dumb for two reasons...

1) There is no vegetable or fruit that contains B12, period. Go look it up.
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I looked it up.

Tofu and yeast extracts contain some B12, although I am not a qualified nutritionist, and individuals should research carefully the amounts and reliability of these sources. Probably a good idea to take supplements and eat fortified cereal.

Pedantically speaking, I suppose these products could be considered to contain animal products in the form of bacteria??
 
Re: These people are doubly dumb...

Gestahl said:
Man, these people are dumb for two reasons...

1) There is no vegetable or fruit that contains B12, period. Go look it up. You must take a multi-vitamin or fortified foods to get it. And guess where that B12 comes from.... meat! There is no way to be truly vegan and get all the necessary nutrients. You must at least eat some cheese or eggs.
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Bacteria will do of course it helps if you extract the b12 first (UK Vegan Society recomeds using bacteria extracts for b12)
 
Re: Re: These people are doubly dumb...

phildonnia said:

Pedantically speaking, I suppose these products could be considered to contain animal products in the form of bacteria??
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bacteria are further from animals than plants.
 
Re: Re: Re: These people are doubly dumb...

geni said:
bacteria are further from animals than plants.
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Baccy-hater! Your kind perpetuates cruelty to the living beings that are our friends, the bacteria!

Although, come to think of it, our bacteria friends have killed more human beings than the entire animal kingdom put together.
 
CFLarsen said:
That maybe so. However, don't pull a Grenard here. If you know the difference, explain it. Don't merely point to Google (like Grenard did).
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Vegetarian: I won't eat anything that requires the death of an animal (theoretically, placentas are OK) / Eww! Placentas are gross! I just don't eat meat.
Vegan: I won't eat ANYTHING that comes from or is derived from an animal. (how about those coffee beans that that S. American animal eats and then excretes, and then they make a coffee out of? I've never asked a vegan)
Vegetarian: What? No cheese on your pizza? No ice cream?
Vegan: None!
Vegetarian: You people suck.
Vegan: Animal Enslaver!
Vegetarian: Fanatic!
Omnivore: You both suck.
Vegan: Let's get him!
Vegetarian: He's throwing Skittles at us! Run away, run away!



* I overdid a rowing machine a few years back, and pulled a Grenard. I found it extremely difficult to stand up while going to the bathroom, in that you have to 'lean forward' a bit. I had to brace myself against the wall with one of my hands to accomplish said task. TMI?
 
Re: Re: These people are doubly dumb...

phildonnia said:

Tofu and yeast extracts contain some B12, although I am not a qualified nutritionist, and individuals should research carefully the amounts and reliability of these sources. Probably a good idea to take supplements and eat fortified cereal.
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http://www.vrg.org/nutrition/b12.htm

A number of reliable vegan food sources for vitamin B12 are known. One brand of nutritional yeast, Red Star T-6635+, has been tested and shown to contain active vitamin B12. This brand of yeast is often labeled as Vegetarian Support Formula with or without T-6635+ in parentheses following this new name. It is a reliable source of vitamin B12. Nutritional yeast, Saccharomyces cerevisiae, is a food yeast, grown on a molasses solution, which comes as yellow flakes or powder. It has a cheesy taste. Nutritional yeast is different from brewer's yeast or torula yeast. It can often be used by those sensitive to other yeasts.
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(What's an RD compared to an MD? Dunno. Hopefully not a homeopath...)

Also:
http://www.all-creatures.org/health/b12.html
How is the B12 in supplements obtained?

It is produced by bacterial culture and is acceptable to vegans.
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http://www.pamrotella.com/health/b12.html

All of the Vitamin B12 in the world ultimately comes from bacteria. Neither plants nor animals can synthesize it. But plants can be contaminated with B12 when they come in contact with soil bacteria that produce it. Animal foods are rich in B12 only because animals eat foods that are contaminated with it or because bacteria living in an animal's intestines make it.
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THAT said, let's reiterate the first post in the thread: these 2 doofusses that this poor kid had to call parents didn't give the kid ANY suppliments for B12, even though they knew that it's a VITAMIN, and that they weren't giving the kid anything that had B12 in it.

They were relying on prayer to magically produce co-enzymes in the kid's body.

Here's your interesting philosophical question: at what point does religion become indistinguishable from a mental disease?
 
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