• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Moderated Using wrong pronouns= violence??

This thread is about whether or not intentionally using other than preferred pronouns might constitute violence, and issues closely related to that topic. Discussions of more general trans issues belongs elsewhere
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: sarge
 
NYC is not (currently) attending CU Boulder, and your assertion is grossly misleading.

https://gothamist.com/news/no-nyc-d...fine-for-any-incorrect-use-of-gender-pronouns

It's almost as if bad-faith actors are trying to smear the rather modest requests by trans people for fair treatment, like not being discriminated against in housing or employment, as ridiculous overreaches of censorious tyrants.

Reminds me of how Jordan Peterson, back when enlightened centrists were still pretending he wasn't a crank, was telling everyone that similar such laws in Canada would mean the fascist jackboots would be dragging you off to prison for similar such offenses.
 
Last edited:
Last edited:
Ah, that’s more helpful. I looked up the guidelines themselves, but couldn’t find anything about them applying to schools in different cities in other states that were more than half-way across the country.

You introduced it, so….

Do you find anything in the NYC law troubling? Are you specifically opposed to laws or policies against intentionally using derogatory terms?

On a personal level, I consider it an intentionally obnoxious act to use other than preferred pronouns (when they are known). I can see no reason to do so except an intent to offend.

I am concerned about laws prohibiting the practice in private activities however. I’m of mixed feelings about it. I have no 1st amendment concerns about banning certain speach in public spaces. I hold that there can be no constitutionally sound law against saying virtually anything you wish on private property that is not a public accommodation.
 
You introduced it, so….

Do you find anything in the NYC law troubling? Are you specifically opposed to laws or policies against intentionally using derogatory terms?
Not especially. Protecting the rights of minorities are important and laws are one way of doing that.
 
it's addressing the way private companies official duties while operating essential services. these are not private activities.
 
BUT, let's do a quick sanity check here.

What we're talking about is a school policy meant to prevent harassment of minority students, faculty, and visitors on campus. It is, in no way, absolutist and distinguishes between accidental misgendering and malicious harassment. It should be obvious, but they are writing it out to avoid an Air Buddy* situation.

The one, single, solitary use of the word "violence" has a clear context and plenty of people have provided appropriate and widely used definitions for non-physical violence. At this point, suggesting that CU Boulder meant otherwise is merely stubbornness or bad-faith arguments.

It does not stifle academic discussion about preferred pronouns, since those can be had in the abstract without misgendering anyone. So, the OP can still take their Gender Studies courses and not worry about expressing their opinions about preferred pronouns getting them kicked out of school. (Getting kicked out for failing courses, like Gender Studies, is a separate matter.)




* Where the movie happens because there is no explicit rule that a dog can't play basketball.
 
1. People ask nicely for basic levels of hell not even politeness but "please don't go out of your way and put actual effort into treating us poorly for literally no reason."
2. Bigots and "Nobody can tell me what to do" try hards. "Make me."
3. Someone "makes them."
4. "OMG! Now they are making me! It's a terrible injustice! It's the worst injustice ever!"
 
Yes there's only 12 cis gender straight white men left in the whole world and we all expect to be rounded up and put into camps by next week.
 
Why is calling someone a "he" instead of a "she" an act of violence, but calling someone a "jerk" is not?
 
Why is calling someone a "he" instead of a "she" an act of violence, but calling someone a "jerk" is not?

No. Nobody is going to take your "Duurrr... durrr I'm gonna pretend not to know the difference between an insult and a hate slur, durr durr explain it to me while I pretend not to get it durr durr" routine bait.

Noody is going to murder you because you're a jerk. Stop pretending to not get it.

You don't have to hide being a jerk from the world because you're afraid someone will kill you over it.
 
No. Nobody is going to take your "Duurrr... durrr I'm gonna pretend not to know the difference between an insult and a hate slur, durr durr explain it to me while I pretend not to get it durr durr" routine bait.

Noody is going to murder you because you're a jerk. Stop pretending to not get it.

You don't have to hide being a jerk from the world because you're afraid someone will kill you over it.

People are murdered for all sorts of silly reasons all the time. Being a jerk, being silly, being trans.

I don't see why calling somebody the wrong pronoun is an act of violence but calling somebody a jerk is not. Please explain the difference.
 
Why is calling someone a "he" instead of a "she" an act of violence, but calling someone a "jerk" is not?
It might be. As with all things, it depends on the context.

Also, the misgendering is only an act of violence depending on the context. Accidents happen and the OP article recognizes that.
 
Transgender persons are NOT "minorities".

Full stop.

They aren't necessarily ethnic minorities, but they are a minority demographic.

The problem isn't that calling them a minority is wrong, it's that it's not particularly useful. A white gay man is an ethnic majority but a sexuality minority. A straight white female furry is an ethnic and sexual majority but a fetish minority. And so on. Everyone's a minority in some way or other.
 

Back
Top Bottom