Unemployment

thaiboxerken said:
That's myth #1.
Click to expand...

Ok, so show me how it's a myth.

Myth #2
Click to expand...

Again why is this is a myth? What about all of the immigrants that show up and kick butt?

If you can't make it in the modern USA you are doing something wrong, period.

What percentages of businesses fail? I think the majority of new business ventures end in failure.
Click to expand...

Failure of business != personal failure. In fact I would expect that most people who got rich through starting businesses rode at least one into the ground at some point. It's called dusting yourself off, getting back on your feet and trying again.

Also just because a business goes bankrupt doesn't mean that at one point it wasn't profitable. In fact it could have been net profitable over it's lifetime and still go bankrupt at some point.

The only way to fail is to quit trying. Having a business go down in flames is just losing a battle, not the war.
 
NewtonTrino said:
If you can't make it in the modern USA you are doing something wrong, period.
Click to expand...

The only way to fail is to quit trying.
Click to expand...

Ah, the refreshing naivete of people who don't work in oncology. Everybody who lives is just one clump of cells gone funny, one squirt of chemicals in the wrong place at the wrong time, one little flick of DNA away from total ruin. All it takes is one bout of cancer, just one, even one you survive, to ruin you financially for the rest of your life. Successful businesses, homes, college funds, the ability to speak, all those things are just a diagnosis away from vanishing forever from your life. So please, speak of American dreams, talk about how it's just a matter of trying...while radiation sears your organs, you vomit from the sheer pain of breathing, and you watch every penny you ever earned or hoped to earn vanish into a sea of paperwork you don't have the concentration to read any more.

Failure and ruin are always possibilities, and every single person can be smitten out of the blue by things they cannot overcome. Luck alone won't bring you success, but lack of luck can bring you failure worse than you previously imagined. It's amazing how surprised people are when disaster strikes, it's not like it doesn't happen often to people all around us.
 
TragicMonkey said:
Ah, the refreshing naivete of people who don't work in oncology. Everybody who lives is just one clump of cells gone funny, one squirt of chemicals in the wrong place at the wrong time, one little flick of DNA away from total ruin. All it takes is one bout of cancer, just one, even one you survive, to ruin you financially for the rest of your life. Successful businesses, homes, college funds, the ability to speak, all those things are just a diagnosis away from vanishing forever from your life. So please, speak of American dreams, talk about how it's just a matter of trying...while radiation sears your organs, you vomit from the sheer pain of breathing, and you watch every penny you ever earned or hoped to earn vanish into a sea of paperwork you don't have the concentration to read any more.

Failure and ruin are always possibilities, and every single person can be smitten out of the blue by things they cannot overcome. Luck alone won't bring you success, but lack of luck can bring you failure worse than you previously imagined. It's amazing how surprised people are when disaster strikes, it's not like it doesn't happen often to people all around us.
Click to expand...

This may be the most cheerful post I've seen on JREF.
 
Is it just me, or does NewtonTrino's Horatio Alger BS sounds like the spiel from those financial planning/real estate con infomercials, complete with his own "guru?" (i.e. "I came to this country with a suitcase and a nickel, but after reading Dan Dastardly's 'How To Make Money The Dastardly Way,' I'm a millionaire!")
 
Last edited:
NewtonTrino said:
Ok, so show me how it's a myth.
Click to expand...

image0011.png

http://blog.criteriacorp.com/2010/11/05/twice-as-many-job-seekers-for-every-job/

• The ratio between the unemployment level and job openings level changes over time.
• When the recent recession began, the unemployed persons per job opening was 1.8. When the recession ended, there were 5.8 unemployed persons per job opening.
• The unemployed persons per job opening ratio has trended downward since the end of the recession and was 4.4 in October 2010.
Click to expand...
http://www.bls.gov/web/jolts/jlt_labstatgraphs.pdf
 
Last edited:
NewtonTrino said:
Ok, so show me how it's a myth.
Click to expand...

You are the one making the claims here. I'm simply doubting them by calling them myths. Feel free to prove your claims.

Oh, and how is everyone supposed to "make it" when there are less jobs than people?

What about all of the immigrants that show up and kick butt?
Click to expand...

What about all of the immigrants that show up and fail?

If you can't make it in the modern USA you are doing something wrong, period.
Click to expand...

Or you've fallen victim to circumstances beyond your own control.

Failure of business != personal failure. In fact I would expect that most people who got rich through starting businesses rode at least one into the ground at some point. It's called dusting yourself off, getting back on your feet and trying again.
Click to expand...

Can you prove this?

Also just because a business goes bankrupt doesn't mean that at one point it wasn't profitable. In fact it could have been net profitable over it's lifetime and still go bankrupt at some point.
Click to expand...

Most businesses fail before ever making a profit.

The only way to fail is to quit trying. Having a business go down in flames is just losing a battle, not the war.
Click to expand...

When does a person "quit trying" in your opinion? Is it when they collect unemployment benefits?

There are less jobs than people and most businesses fail before ever making profit. How do those two facts fit into your claims?
 
Last edited:
Oh, and how is everyone supposed to "make it" when there are less jobs than people?
Click to expand...

By creating more jobs.

What about all of the immigrants that show up and fail?
Click to expand...

Failure is not a permanent state.

Can you prove this?
Click to expand...

Only anecdotally. I've ridden a few into the ground myself btw. So has every other business owner that I personally know. It's just the way you learn.

Most businesses fail before ever making a profit.
Click to expand...

Sure because they are ill conceived and people are learning. Once you figure out what you are doing and are realistic the chances are much better.

When does a person "quit trying" in your opinion? Is it when they collect unemployment benefits?
Click to expand...

Nothing to do with unemployment, everything to do with what they are doing to help themselves. Failure is an attitude.

There are less jobs than people and most businesses fail before ever making profit. How do those two facts fit into your claims?
Click to expand...

They are irrelevant. Create a job for yourself by doing something new/better/faster.

Just because some percentage of new businesses fail doesn't mean people aren't making money.

What's your solution?

The bottom line is that people make choices in their lives. A lot of people make a lot of really dumb choices. You can't undo 25 years of bad choices instantly.

Want to get rich follow these simple steps:
1) Figure out what you enjoy.
2) Find a job working in that business.
3) Live well below your means and save money like crazy.
4) Once you know about the industry and have skills invest the money you've saved in yourself by putting yourself into the business you know (they paid you to get educated!)
5) If your business fails go back to step 1.
 
BTW the steps above are the "faster" way of getting rich.

You can still get rich working for others simply by living below your means and investing your excess money. It takes a lot longer but you will eventually get there. This is why a lot of old people have money. Young people tend to make money through starting businesses.
 
I posted elsewhere about the "just-world" fallacy. Newton, you're buying stock in it, wholesale.
 
Achán hiNidráne said:
Is it just me, or does NewtonTrino's Horatio Alger BS sounds like the spiel from those financial planning/real estate con infomercials, complete with his own "guru?" (i.e. "I came to this country with a suitcase and a nickel, but after reading Dan Dastardly's 'How To Make Money The Dastardly Way,' I'm a millionaire!")
Click to expand...

What was that Chinese (Vietnamese?) guys name? I can't think of it. But he always said he came here with nothing, now he has mansions and speedboats and hot chicks on his arms. I think he ended up in prison.
 
The Central Scrutinizer said:
What was that Chinese (Vietnamese?) guys name? I can't think of it. But he always said he came here with nothing, now he has mansions and speedboats and hot chicks on his arms. I think he ended up in prison.
Click to expand...

This guy? I remember watching his infomercial and smirking when I was growing up.

And yes, reading NewtonTrino's posts remind me of pitches from scam entrepreneurship and motivational seminar schemes like Amway, Landmark Education, John Beck's Free and Clear, etc.
 
slingblade said:
I posted elsewhere about the "just-world" fallacy. Newton, you're buying stock in it, wholesale.
Click to expand...

Hold on, when did I say the world was just?

All I'm saying is that anyone can become rich if that is their goal. If they don't know where to get started, shoot me an email. I'll personal mentor anyone who wants to become rich.
 
RPG Advocate said:
This guy? I remember watching his infomercial and smirking when I was growing up.

And yes, reading NewtonTrino's posts remind me of pitches from scam entrepreneurship and motivational seminar schemes like Amway, Landmark Education, John Beck's Free and Clear, etc.
Click to expand...

If you know anything about me or if you've read my posts you'll know that I'm an anti-Amway zealot. Amway is a scam. Landmark forum is basically another scam/cult etc. All scams.

Anyway I came to this country with a suitcase and clothes on my back and I'm just relaying my experience. What I'm getting told in return while being patted on the head is "Well your experience is atypical, you are so much more smart and capable than the average person, they could not possibly be as successful as you" etc. etc. You guys seem to have a really high opinion of your fellow man. I personally think most people make dumb decisions about money because they don't have any discipline.

As for people I do pimp I highly recommend people follow Dave Ramsey's financial advice if you are an average person. His advice? No debt except a small 15 year mortgage, save 15% towards retirement and have a cash emergency fund.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom