UNCLE!!!

[mgidm86]

For my entire adult life I’ve been a “Registered Republican”.

Overall I think I’m socially liberal, or even libertarian, but fiscally conservative. In any case I’ve called myself a Republican, and generally voted Republican or abstained in the Presidential election as I did in 2008 and 2016.

But enough is enough! I’m done.

It’s been building for a long time, but this recent budget was the final straw. But I’ve been increasingly disgusted with Republicans at least since the 2016 Presidential Primary. The selection of Trump is a major, but hardly isolated cause of my disgust.

Today, I went so far as to call my local voting board to change my affiliation to Independent. Turns out Georgia does not register voters by party affiliation - you declare which primary ballot you want at the time of voting. I was probably thinking of my prior state of residence, Florida.

I’m not thrilled with the current state of the Democratic Party either. But I more and more often find myself on “their side” of issues. If there are more disgruntled Republicans like me out there, the Democrats can only benefit from the overall disillusionment of sensible Republicans at the sordid mess their party has become. Hopefully a viable third party can emerge from this chaos and offer more palatable options than we’ve been presented with recently.

Thanks for listening - I just needed to vent.

I think both sides are terrible, probably the worst I've ever seen here. I'm still trying to come to grips with the fact that grown adults can think and behave as they do. I've never registered with either party and never will.

Viable third party won't happen. Just my prediction.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Another possibility of GOP definition: Helping the poor = communism.

Apparently. Corporate welfare, invisible. Social safety network, leeches, every one of them.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

Well, corporations are beholden to God, or at least his Invisible Market Hand.

 

[Darat]

Are there any communist societies? I know some claim to be, but the big one is China and they have a lot of billionaires for a purportedly communist country.

No. Communism is like all ideologies simply too simple a model of the real world to actually work as described. There is simply no one size fits all ideology that could work. All societies of any size are a mixture of many different ideas.

 

[mikado]

Apparently. Corporate welfare, invisible. Social safety network, leeches, every one of them.

Am doing song firget that evil socialised medicine
I am off to the doctor tomorrow, I hope I survive

 

[SezMe]

The GOP is the worst thing ever. Except for Communism. The Left's implicit support of communism, along with their support of any policy that might advance communism, is the only thing keeping me from switching sides. That and all the leftist douchebags I've met on this board.

I'd like an example or two of a "Left" (also, please define the "left') policy that supports communism.

Am I one of those douche bags?

 

[The Don]

I don't think that's a fair assessment at all. Fast Eddie B has been a staunch and in my view very earnest critic of Trump and Trump's support inside the GOP the entire time. He's not been afraid to call out the GOP for it's failings.

Honestly for as disappointed as I've been in many Republicans and their supporters recently, I am sad that reasonable conservatives don't have a party really, not anymore. It doesn't do good things for either party, nor for the country to have one party to force out all the people who are reasonable and won't pretend they aren't.

I'm not sure that's the case. The Democratic Party seems to have drifted so far to the right that they're not unlike the so-called "reasonable" conservatives. For sure the GOP claims that the Democratic Party is full of communists and socialists, but IMO when the evidence for those claims (if it's ever forthcoming) is examined, it tends to come up short.

The current Democratic Party is socially moderate (at least by comparison to the GOP) and fiscally conservative (to the extent that they acknowledge that taxes have to rise to pay for the inevitable increases in spending that come from having an ageing population with increasing expectations - as opposed to lowering taxes).

I'm not clear on what major planks of the current Democratic Party platform (as opposed to the FOXNews version of it) a moderate Republican has a major beef with .

 

[thaiboxerken]

I've got a feeling that anyone left of Tea Party is a leftist douche bag......

 

[SezMe]

In any case I’ve called myself a Republican, and generally voted Republican or abstained in the Presidential election as I did in 2008 and 2016.

Let me say that although we are likely to disagree on many political topics, I enjoy your posts. So I'm interested in why you abstained in 2008. Wasn't McCain sufficiently conservative? Or maybe you couldn't bring yourself to vote for Palin as veep?

 

[thaiboxerken]

I'm not sure that's the case. The Democratic Party seems to have drifted so far to the right that they're not unlike the so-called "reasonable" conservatives.

I agree. This is the reason why Democrats were very moderate in governing when they controlled all three houses for 6 months.

If the Republican party dissolves, I think one of the factions within the Democratic party would split off to fill the void, and that new party would be very similar to the GOP prior to Reagan.

 

[Aridas]

I don't think that's a fair assessment at all. Fast Eddie B has been a staunch and in my view very earnest critic of Trump and Trump's support inside the GOP the entire time. He's not been afraid to call out the GOP for it's failings.

Honestly for as disappointed as I've been in many Republicans and their supporters recently, I am sad that reasonable conservatives don't have a party really, not anymore. It doesn't do good things for either party, nor for the country to have one party to force out all the people who are reasonable and won't pretend they aren't.

As much as I disagree with many things and positions that conservatives hold, I think that conservatives bring a necessary check to some of the more inane liberal ideas. Unfortunately, the current Republican Party is an abomination that has fallen far, far away from reasonability, though, after many, many small steps down. Also unfortunately, it's actually worse than forcing out the people who are reasonable, though. With those like Limbaugh and Fox News as long-term major players for them, it seems like they've actually reduced the number of people who are reasonable in the first place, or rather, tried to effectively redefine what constitutes reasonable.

I doubt it. Perhaps universal health care = communism?

Nah. Universal health care = Nazism. A little more seriously, that's one of the big reasons why Nazism isn't as well associated with the right as a number of people would like to claim it is.

Another possibility of GOP definition: Helping the poor = communism.

According to a Tea Party friend of mine, public libraries are communism.

No. Communism is like all ideologies simply too simple a model of the real world to actually work as described. There is simply no one size fits all ideology that could work. All societies of any size are a mixture of many different ideas.

Meh? This seems a bit off, but I'm not going to nitpick it. Communism is potentially viable in very small communities, where social bonds are strong enough to handle the necessary things. It increasingly falls apart as the community grows and the social bonds become less direct, though, making it non-viable for the success of any large-scale populations.

I'd like an example or two of a "Left" (also, please define the "left') policy that supports communism.

Am I one of those douche bags?

Communism is generally considered to be on the extreme left. The large majority of leftist policies are very much not communist in nature, though.

 

[catsmate]

For my entire adult life I’ve been a “Registered Republican”.

Overall I think I’m socially liberal, or even libertarian, but fiscally conservative. In any case I’ve called myself a Republican, and generally voted Republican or abstained in the Presidential election as I did in 2008 and 2016.

But enough is enough! I’m done.

It’s been building for a long time, but this recent budget was the final straw. But I’ve been increasingly disgusted with Republicans at least since the 2016 Presidential Primary. The selection of Trump is a major, but hardly isolated cause of my disgust.

Today, I went so far as to call my local voting board to change my affiliation to Independent. Turns out Georgia does not register voters by party affiliation - you declare which primary ballot you want at the time of voting. I was probably thinking of my prior state of residence, Florida.

I’m not thrilled with the current state of the Democratic Party either. But I more and more often find myself on “their side” of issues. If there are more disgruntled Republicans like me out there, the Democrats can only benefit from the overall disillusionment of sensible Republicans at the sordid mess their party has become. Hopefully a viable third party can emerge from this chaos and offer more palatable options than we’ve been presented with recently.

Thanks for listening - I just needed to vent.

And so it begins....

Welcome to the club. Of course, it happened a good deal earlier for me.

My natural inclination was, and still is, what used to be called a "liberal Republican", or maybe "progressive Republican." Social (mostly) liberal, strongly fiscal conservative. Fiscal conservatism went out the window with Reagan. All decrying "tax-and-spend" Democrats, while running up massive deficits to give money back to those who needed it least. And around the same time, they brought the racist southern Democrats over en-masse. No fiscal conservatism, no social progressivism. Screw them.

As for libertarianism, the concept appeals to me. But every actual avowed libertarian I've ever come into contact with has been a loon.

ETA: There's no party registration in this state. We used to have wide-open primaries, in which you could vote for anyone in either party. The party bosses HATED that and filed suit. Then we had a sort of "pick-a-party" system. The voters hated that. Now it's open with candidates running for the two spots on the GE ballot. They are identified as "Prefers Republican Party". That can, and has, cause both GE candidates to be from the same party.

Rockefeller Republican.

There you go.

Indeed.

<drivel snip>

Are you planning to post an actually point sometime?

 

[applecorped]

Are you planning to post an actually point sometime?

 

[Fast Eddie B]

So, you're finally catching on to what the rest of the world already knew in November 2016...

In my defense, I’ve been pretty consistently vocal in my disdain for Trump since the Republican primaries began. I was at first hoping the party would disavow him at the convention, then that they somehow function as a party in spite of their president being a horrible choice.

Trump never let me down because I never had any illusions about him.

Edited to add: I see tyr_13 came to my defense. Thanks.

 

[Fast Eddie B]

So I'm interested in why you abstained in 2008. Wasn't McCain sufficiently conservative? Or maybe you couldn't bring yourself to vote for Palin as veep?

First, I recall that when Palin was nominated, I found the choice refreshing. Of course, at that time I knew zero about her. I think it took about a week of reporting to realize what a bad choice she was.

McCain lost me when he said he would be fine with us staying in Iraq for 100 years, if necessary. I was in favor of a rapid exit to cut our losses.

Obama lost me because I felt he had no understanding of economics. But I got goosebumps when he was inaugurated and was glad he had won. I think his presidency was decidedly a mixed bag, but that discussion would be a hijack of this thread - I’d be glad to discuss it elsewhere.

 

[Ethan Thane Athen]

The GOP is the worst thing ever. Except for Communism. The Left's implicit support of communism, along with their support of any policy that might advance communism, is the only thing keeping me from switching sides. That and all the leftist douchebags I've met on this board.

Your Democrats are roughly equivalent to our right wing (Conservative party - at least in its more sensible incarnations) - I don't think you have to worry about them being in any way 'communist'.

 

[uke2se]

Nah. Universal health care = Nazism. A little more seriously, that's one of the big reasons why Nazism isn't as well associated with the right as a number of people would like to claim it is.

I'd like for you to find any political scientist or acredited historian that arranges Nazism anywhere but on the extreme right of the political scale.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Do you believe we would be better off in a communist society?

Yes we wouldn't want to live in a s^%hole like Norway, those wonderful capitalistic African countries are much better.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Your Democrats are roughly equivalent to our right wing (Conservative party - at least in its more sensible incarnations) - I don't think you have to worry about them being in any way 'communist'.

It is easy when one doesn't know a thing about communism. I can't think of any major industry that the left has advocated nationalizing other than some of the health insurance market.

I see no candidates even suggesting nationalizing GM even though we had to bail them out.

At least they are clear that fascism wasn't so bad. Makes the current republican platforms make more sense.

 

[Cayvmann]

An admitted socialist couldn't even win the Democratic Party Primary And you believe this nonsense?

Wow!

Well, you see he said 'implicit' which means they don't say it outright. You have to know what to look for... (BS)

Anyway, many tyrants have been supported by republicans, I guess that means they implicitly (actually explicitly) support tyranny and fascism.