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UK - Election 2015

The Don said:
The Conservatives are proposing a change. By saying "English votes for English laws" they are proposing to create an English parliament within the national parliament.

If they are successful, it's an excellent move for them, it'll ensure that they "rule" England unless there is a large shift in English political allegiance and by keeping it in the Westminster parliament it reduces the likelihood of fringe right wing parties making some headway.
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I seriously wonder whether an English parliament would have an in-built Conservative majority or whether the electorate will re-calibrate and restore something like the long term balance have now. I am probably pro-Tory more than anything else, mainly through naked self-interest, but if you leave those guys in charge for too long they end up running out of puff and disintegrating into sleaze.

angrysoba said:
In fact, even though many people weren't interested in London's devolution from the UK, it was still pushed through anyway because those who turned out to vote voted the Right WayTM.
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What was the turn out? In the couldn't care less range? At least the London mayoral elections have thrown up some high profile characters - so far. Interest may wane once the supply of colourful characters dries up.
 
anglolawyer said:
Quite high as these things go, I suppose. Have the turnouts been higher in the elections themselves, do you know?
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Actually, it seems the mayoral elections have been higher than that initial vote. Presumably if the North East had had its own assembly with genuine powers then the turnout would also increase.
 
anglolawyer said:
Quite high as these things go, I suppose. Have the turnouts been higher in the elections themselves, do you know?
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Well, don't be too cynical. Some places managed an 11% turnout for the Police & Crime Commissioner's votes. Democracy in action.......
 
anglolawyer said:
I seriously wonder whether an English parliament would have an in-built Conservative majority or whether the electorate will re-calibrate and restore something like the long term balance have now.
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As far as I can see, the Conservatives are not proposing a separate English Parliament, just that Westminster would only allow English MPs to vote on English laws. You wouldn't be able to vote for one party to represent you at an English level and another at a UK level (unlike in Wales, Scotland or N.I.). That's the masterstroke the conservatives have played, it avoids the possibility of a protest vote at the national level.

It is possible that Labour could get a majority in England again (Blair managed it three times) but IMO no time soon.
 
The Don said:
As far as I can see, the Conservatives are not proposing a separate English Parliament, just that Westminster would only allow English MPs to vote on English laws. You wouldn't be able to vote for one party to represent you at an English level and another at a UK level (unlike in Wales, Scotland or N.I.). That's the masterstroke the conservatives have played, it avoids the possibility of a protest vote at the national level.

It is possible that Labour could get a majority in England again (Blair managed it three times) but IMO no time soon.
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Oh, I see. I wonder what would count as a purely English question then? Health, education, that type of thing?

Oh, I'll tell you what I am not in favour of - layer upon layer of superfluous tiers of government. I don't believe there is a big demand for local democracy in the UK anyway, not judging by the local election turnout anyway.
 
The Don said:
Manchester and Liverpool have more in common with each other than they have with London or Bath or Truro.
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For what it's worth, North Wales as far west as the Conway Valley has more in common with Liverpool than with South Wales, where the Welsh Assembly is. The local paper of choice, for instance, is the Liverpool Echo; that's where people look for Property, Motors and - most tellingly - Situations Vacant.

The Welsh Assembly is not held in high regard up there, and separatist sentiment is strong. An autonomous Liverpool Region could spark all sorts of trouble. :cool:
 
The Scottish seat projections are now looking ridiculous. Could this really happen?

SNP 57; Labour 1; Lib Dems 1.
 
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CapelDodger said:
That'll never happen in London. It has colourful characters like a sheep-pile has flies.
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Unfortunately, colourful characters have to pass through the filters of large party machines, which tend to homogenise the entire stream of "talent" into a colourless but malodorous pulp.
 
Craig B said:
The Scottish seat projections are now looking ridiculous. Could this really happen?

SNP 57; Labour 1; Lib Dems 1.
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Fieldwork a bit more out of date than usual, goodness knows what the current state of play is. I struggle to see that kind of wipeout, and more realistically expect 38-42ish, still an excellent return. The last few polls still have around 30% don't know, who I would expect to break more in favour of name recognition favouring the incumbent. However, a chunk of the DKs probably won't vote at all.

The bookies seemingly have the SNP's over/under at 49.5.
 
Craig B said:
The Scottish seat projections are now looking ridiculous. Could this really happen?

SNP 57; Labour 1; Lib Dems 1.
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It's going to be fun handling this over the next 5 years. Upsetting the Nationalists, as we see here all the time, is impossible to avoid. Indeed, they seem to enjoy being offended, and look for offence wherever they can find it. If the Scots Nats really do end up being pretty much the sole representatives from Scotland in Westminster then it will be trivially easy for them to manufacture something to fall out over, get their supporters whipped up into a lather, and threaten this, that and god-knows-what if they don't get their own way..........and before you know it there will be another independence referendum, whether sanctioned by Westminster or not. And remember, of course, that the Nats only have to get lucky once. 50.1% to 49.9% in their favour at the 7th or 17th time of trying is all they need.
 
MikeG said:
Unfortunately, colourful characters have to pass through the filters of large party machines, which tend to homogenise the entire stream of "talent" into a colourless but malodorous pulp.
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That hardly describes "Uncle Ken" Livingstone or Bullingdon Boris. Anyway, the old machine politics is dead and gone - hadn't you heard? :cool:
 
CapelDodger said:
That hardly describes "Uncle Ken" Livingstone or Bullingdon Boris. Anyway, the old machine politics is dead and gone - hadn't you heard? :cool:
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They are the exception which proves the rule. I'm pretty certain that Ken Livingstone wasn't his party's choice for the position, and he actually ran as an independent at least once.
 
MikeG said:
It's going to be fun handling this over the next 5 years. Upsetting the Nationalists, as we see here all the time, is impossible to avoid. Indeed, they seem to enjoy being offended, and look for offence wherever they can find it. If the Scots Nats really do end up being pretty much the sole representatives from Scotland in Westminster then it will be trivially easy for them to manufacture something to fall out over, get their supporters whipped up into a lather, and threaten this, that and god-knows-what if they don't get their own way..........and before you know it there will be another independence referendum, whether sanctioned by Westminster or not. And remember, of course, that the Nats only have to get lucky once. 50.1% to 49.9% in their favour at the 7th or 17th time of trying is all they need.
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It could be fun referring back to this post over the next five years. Not to say ten, twenty, whatever. You have given hostage to fortune.

My own hostage is that there won't be another referendum for at least ten years, if ever.
 
CapelDodger said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayor_of_London

The current mayoralty is a new institution, held only by Ken Livingstone and Boris Johnson. They are the rule.
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You misunderstand me. My point is that all politicians have to get party approval, whatever their chosen path (be it Westminster, Europe, mayoralties, local councils, P&C Commissioners, whatever). The only couple of colourful characters who have slipped through the net in the last couple of decades are Boris and Ken.
 
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