Truthers and the FDNY

[johnny karate]

It was the fire commader that stated PULL IT not Silverstein.

As stated and proven Chief Hayden was worried about debris if the building collapsed and fire jumping to other buildings.

But in this case when he stated PULL IT the firefighters had already long since been evacuated from the building, as stated by Chief Nigro (who became the fire commander).

So he could have only been talking about the building.

Please explain why no one, anywhere, ever, in any capacity to verify such information has gone public with the fact that WTC7 was demolished for safety reasons, and instead claims it collapsed due to fire and damage?

Why are they lying to us about it?

 

[Tweeter]

No the "pull it" refers to fire support and if you think otherwise it proves you are not an analyst but just a 911Truth liar, hearsay repeater, failed delusion weaver, no conclusion fraud, and you can't understand 911 given all the evidence you have to ignore and lie about.

C`mon, man. Anyone with two working brain cells knows the correct term is to
"pull out" if one where to leave the scene.

 

[Gavron]

So, Tweeter, it makes perfect sense to you that its ok to send in a team of demolition experts into a burning, multi story building...that firefighters cannot save...and rig it with explosives to bring it down in a controlled fashion?

Please, show us one interview with any of the demo team that did that. I'm curious why it normally takes WEEKS to rig a building to fall in a controlled fashion, but in this instance, they can do in right after a call.

 

[FineWine]

C`mon, man. Anyone with two working brain cells knows the correct term is to
"pull out" if one where to leave the scene.

I have over the past month read hundreds of posts on this forum destroying the myth that "pull it" has anything to do with demolition. It doesn't. The "it" is the contingent of men in and around the unstable building. But you already knew that.

 

[1337m4n]

Here's a question: if "pull it" really referred to a demolition command, then why would a "terrible loss of life" (remember Silverstein's full quote) have anything whatsoever to do with that command?

Truthers have no answer to this. None.

 

[RedIbis]

Here's a question: if "pull it" really referred to a demolition command, then why would a "terrible loss of life" (remember Silverstein's full quote) have anything whatsoever to do with that command?

Truthers have no answer to this. None.

Obviously he meant the fire crew, who must have been holding the building up, since once they made the decision to pull the building collapsed.

 

[1337m4n]

Obviously he meant the fire crew, who must have been holding the building up, since once they made the decision to pull the building collapsed.

So you do not have an answer to what a "terrible loss of life" would have to do with a demolition command.

 

[FineWine]

Obviously he meant the fire crew, who must have been holding the building up, since once they made the decision to pull the building collapsed.

Why do you say so many things that just aren't true? You have no idea how much time elapsed between the Silverstein's conversation with the fire chief and the eventual collapse of the building. All you know is that the fire department decided they couldn't contain the fires and some time later, the building fell.

 

[Grizzly Bear]

Looks to me like red's post was intended to have some element of humor to it... although, clearly doing nothing to address any of the questions, and nothing all that funny...

 

[johnny karate]

Obviously he meant the fire crew, who must have been holding the building up, since once they made the decision to pull the building collapsed.

I totally agree with this method of taking an isolated statement and holding it to a hard and fast interpretation, regardless of other possible interpretations or future clarifications.

Which is why when you said this:

I don't doubt for a second that these firefighters came to agree with the official explanations "after talking and finding out that it was the floors collapsing to where the plane had hit."

My point from the get-go was what these people said before people came to them and told them the source of these events.

I interpret it as you saying FDNY firefighters were coerced into silence and are now too afraid to tell The Truth. And of course keeping with your cracker jack method on investigation, I will stick with this interpretation regardless of any other possible interpretations, or any clarifications or denials you might make.

So based on this irrefutable logic, I have to ask you: Why do you despise firefighters? Do you think they are all gutless cowards, or is that a classification your reserve specifically for the FDNY?

 

[ULTIMA1]

No the "pull it" refers to fire support and if you think otherwise it proves you are not an analyst but just a 911Truth liar, hearsay repeater, failed delusion weaver, no conclusion fraud, and you can't understand 911 given all the evidence you have to ignore and lie about.

How could he have been talking about the fire fighters when they had already been evacuated from the building earlier in the day as proven by fire chiefs statements?

 

[RedIbis]

I totally agree with this method of taking an isolated statement and holding it to a hard and fast interpretation, regardless of other possible interpretations or future clarifications.

Shocking. Anyone reading your posts would never have thought such a thing.

 

[johnny karate]

Shocking. Anyone reading your posts would never have thought such a thing.

Well, you've shown me the light. Clearly, the only way we can ever know the details of a particular event is to take statements of those involved in that event immediately afterwards, and rigidly hold them to one specific interpretation, regardless of of how they might fit into the larger body of evidence or what those people tell us they actually meant by those statements. "No take-backs" as the saying goes.

Back on topic: You are on record as characterizing the firefighters of the FDNY as gutless cowards. Again I ask, is this something you feel is particular to the FDNY? If 9/11 had happened in Chicago, do you feel that fire department would have reacted any differently, or is it your opinion that all firefighters are gutless cowards?

 

[RedIbis]

Back on topic: You are on record as characterizing the firefighters of the FDNY as gutless cowards. Again I ask, is this something you feel is particular to the FDNY? If 9/11 had happened in Chicago, do you feel that fire department would have reacted any differently, or is it your opinion that all firefighters are gutless cowards?

How corny. Do you have a quote of me calling anyone n the FDNY a "gutless coward" or are you just making this nonsense up?

I notice you like to make these assertions and then post links to long threads, but you don't simply post the quotes. Gee, I can't imagine why.

 

[FineWine]

How corny. Do you have a quote of me calling anyone n the FDNY a "gutless coward" or are you just making this nonsense up?

I notice you like to make these assertions and then post links to long threads, but you don't simply post the quotes. Gee, I can't imagine why.

Okay, I will accept your word that you regard accusations of cowardice directed at the FDNY as "nonsense." So, what is your position? Did the fire department really determine that WTC 7 was liable to collapse, or were they part of a giant conspiracy? Was Larry Silverstein's conversation with the fire chief as harmless as it sounds, or was there something sinister about it?

 

[RedIbis]

Okay, I will accept your word that you regard accusations of cowardice directed at the FDNY as "nonsense." So, what is your position? Did the fire department really determine that WTC 7 was liable to collapse, or were they part of a giant conspiracy? Was Larry Silverstein's conversation with the fire chief as harmless as it sounds, or was there something sinister about it?

Thank you for being civil and asking straight forward questions. First, the FDNY is not a monolithic entity capable of thinking and acting as a singular unit. It is a group of people.

As has been described and supported by research many times in the past, word was passed from someone at the OEM to a fire captain on the scene that WTC 7 would collapse. If you study the testimonies of the firefighters the majority of them say that they had received word of the collapse.

As far as Larry's comments, they are nonsensical and sound to me like the off the cuff ramblings of someone who is being dishonest. A fire commander would not have to consult with the owner of a building to pull the fire crew from it. I think Larry is scrambling in front of a documentary film crew.

Ultimately, I wouldn't put too much value in Larry's comments. It's far more significant to see that the debunking tactic of saying that everyone on the scene knew the bldg would collapse is false.

 

[johnny karate]

How corny. Do you have a quote of me calling anyone n the FDNY a "gutless coward" or are you just making this nonsense up?

I quoted the statement in which you characterized the FDNY as gutless cowards earlier in this thread. It's about five posts up.

 

[FineWine]

Thank you for being civil and asking straight forward questions. First, the FDNY is not a monolithic entity capable of thinking and acting as a singular unit. It is a group of people.

As has been described and supported by research many times in the past, word was passed from someone at the OEM to a fire captain on the scene that WTC 7 would collapse. If you study the testimonies of the firefighters the majority of them say that they had received word of the collapse.

As far as Larry's comments, they are nonsensical and sound to me like the off the cuff ramblings of someone who is being dishonest. A fire commander would not have to consult with the owner of a building to pull the fire crew from it. I think Larry is scrambling in front of a documentary film crew.

Ultimately, I wouldn't put too much value in Larry's comments. It's far more significant to see that the debunking tactic of saying that everyone on the scene knew the bldg would collapse is false.

I assume we're talking about the same interview with Larry Silverstein. I don't understand what is nonsensical about his remarks. He says only that he was called by a fire chief who informed that him the department's operations were being halted because of the dangers to the men involved. Silverstein did nothing more than agree with that assessment. Unless you have some other conversation in mind, I can't figure out what you're driving at. Where can the dishonesty be? What is he being dishonest about? Nonsensical? Dishonest? What am I missing here?

 

[firecoins]

First, the FDNY is not a monolithic entity capable of thinking and acting as a singular unit. It is a group of people.

no ship. Don't have much experience with FDNY do you?

As has been described and supported by research many times in the past, word was passed from someone at the OEM to a fire captain on the scene that WTC 7 would collapse. If you study the testimonies of the firefighters the majority of them say that they had received word of the collapse.

. It's far more significant to see that the debunking tactic of saying that everyone on the scene knew the bldg would collapse is false.

who from OEM informed FDNY chiefs on the ground WTC 7 would collapse? It doesn't work like that. OEM takes what they are told by FDNY and makes decisions.

FDNY chiefs made the determination and informed OEM. Not the other way around. All emergency service members on the ground knew that building would collpase.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/oem/html/about/about.shtml

http://www.nyc.gov/html/oem/html/about/about.shtml
Established in 1996, the New York City Office of Emergency Management (OEM) plans and prepares for emergencies, educates the public about preparedness, coordinates emergency response and recovery, and collects and disseminates emergency information.

To accomplish this mission, OEM maintains a disciplined unit of emergency management personnel, including responders, planners, watch commanders, and administrative and support staff, to identify and respond to various hazards.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/oem/html/about/about.shtmlhttp://www.nyc.gov/html/oem/html/about/about.shtml

 

[johnny karate]

who from OEM informed FDNY chiefs on the ground WTC 7 would collapse? It doesn't work like that. OEM takes what they are told by FDNY and makes decisions.

Red is referring to FDNY Captain Currid who has stated he was informed of the impending collapse of WTC7 by someone in OEM. In RedIbis World, two first responders exchanging information during a chaotic event is indicative of a massive conspiracy.