Cont: Trump’s Coup - Part 2

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EHocking said:
No, scissors kills a wizard.

Scissors cuts Paper
Paper covers Rock
Rock crushes Lizard
Lizard poisons Spock
Spock smashes Scissors
Scissors decapitates Lizard
Lizard eats Paper
Paper disproves Spock
Spock vaporizes Rock
(and as it always has) Rock crushes Scissors

(if you can believe anything Barry Kripke says)
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I have always objected to this scheme, presenting Spock as a phasering brute who writes discredited papers.

Rock Paper Scissors Lizard Scotty works better. Just change it to "Scotty disassembles scissors".
 
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Interesting read https://arcdigital.media/qanon-woke-up-the-real-deep-state-72bbfcb79488
He quotes David Frum "if you replaced “Deep State” with “rule of law,” you’d have a better understanding of Trumpist complaints."
Looting is bad, but it’s a problem for police and insurance companies. Trying to burn down a police station or courthouse is worse, but that too is a law enforcement problem, perhaps one requiring federal assistance. Storming the Capitol, forcefully hindering the execution of U.S. law, and trying to kill top elected officials is a national security problem.
What you did was on another level, and the reaction will be too.
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PhantomWolf said:
No, they weren't. They are Oath-Keepers, or at least the first two were based on their outfits (Both had an Oth-Keeper shirt on under their Tactical vest, and the first had an Oath-Keeper patch on his backpack) and so the likely bet is that the rest of the group is as well. One of the others had a triangle with the "Don't tread on me" snake emblem in it on his backpack. The leader also has a patch that says "I don't believe in anything, I'm just here for the violence." There are clear photos of the group that have been posted.
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I was misled by something I saw that misidentified them. It didn't seem to be the right gear for the feds, actually.
 
PhantomWolf said:
No, they weren't. They are Oath-Keepers, or at least the first two were based on their outfits (Both had an Oth-Keeper shirt on under their Tactical vest, and the first had an Oath-Keeper patch on his backpack) and so the likely bet is that the rest of the group is as well. One of the others had a triangle with the "Don't tread on me" snake emblem in it on his backpack. The leader also has a patch that says "I don't believe in anything, I'm just here for the violence." There are clear photos of the group that have been posted.
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Sadly, the highlighted doesn't preclude them being actual riot police on duty - based on some of the photos from the summer.
 
cosmicaug said:
It is my understanding that, traditionally, the Secret Service has not had much of a sense of humor abut such things.
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Harlan Ellison has told a story about the time that a disgruntled fan felt that he wasn't sufficiently grateful to her for "making him famous", so she called the Secret Service and claimed that he had threatened to kill the President. In that situation, with absolutely nothing to support the claim, they were required to go to his home and conduct an interview/investigation.
 
Meadmaker said:
Hard to say, but I note the Vice President didn't stick around to find out, which seems wise.


Even if it were meant as gallows humor, in every angry mob it always seems like there's a handful of people who don't get the joke.

ETA: But, to your point elsewhere, securing convictions on such evidence is difficult.
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Any of the right wing terrorists who stepped foot on Capitol grounds is already guilty of seditious conspiracy. The intent of those roaming the halls with weapons in search of government officials shouldn’t be difficult to prove beyond that starting point.
 
acbytesla said:
Maybe. I'm always a bit skeptical since I sold that kind of equipment for thirty years. I have read many exaggerations from so called authorities about the level of detail. It all depends on the setup. So much of the Capitol is stone and granite. It was probably a nightmare to set up to receive decent cell service. That is until the last 15 years and the advent of microcells. These are just like any other cell phone antenna except they run at very low power to limit their coverage. I am just not personally knowledgeable of the Capitol's cell service structure.

You combine this with video surveillance, social networks and the like and you very well maybe be able to do that.
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That was a couple of days ago, but the data miner in me says just get all the numbers connected to any tower within 1 km of the Capitol, then cross-reference them with where their usual area is. If they're from outside Washington and near the Capitol, it's highly likely they were rioters, so it gives you a massive and easy database to start from.

catsmate said:
I prefer 'putsch'. It seems appropriate....
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Ah, now I have it!

Putzch.
 
Vixen said:
I am not a politician or a public figure. The person carrying that gallows contraption will say in court, hey, nobody told me I couldn't. Note, usually on demonstrations people are instructed their back packs have to be transparent and they aren't allowed various poles and banners. Jake Angeli, self-styled idiot, has on his charge sheet he was carrying a spear (yes - a deadly weapon) with a US flag attached. Who allowed him to carry such an item? The people in charge of controlling the crowds (the FBI and the police) will be blamed for not even challenging it. I understand that this gallows thing has been seen at other demonstrations.

I went to a football match in which my team were playing another team about to be relegated. Their supporters had a 'funeral march' along the road leading up to the stadium carrying a coffin with the name of their team on it.

Is it really 'intent to hang the vice president' or is it 'gallows humour'?


I present my case, M'Lud.
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https://twitter.com/DonnieJrsChin/status/1348922343121412096

This guy could be some hot headed idiot who doesn't really mean it. i mean, people say things they don't mean when caught up in the heat of the moment, right?

Of course, he also went on to beat a police officer with a flag pole. I think it may have been the officer who died (and was also hit with a fire extinguisher) but I'm not sure.
 
The Atheist said:
That was a couple of days ago, but the data miner in me says just get all the numbers connected to any tower within 1 km of the Capitol, then cross-reference them with where their usual area is. If they're from outside Washington and near the Capitol, it's highly likely they were rioters, so it gives you a massive and easy database to start from.

Ah, now I have it!

Putzch.
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I assumed that they were already doing all that. I would definitely filter it first looking at out of state numbers. There has to be a whole bunch of data mining techniques that would help narrow the sample. Check the numbers to identities then search those identities to Social media posts would be a start.
 
Vixen said:
I am not a politician or a public figure. The person carrying that gallows contraption will say in court, hey, nobody told me I couldn't. Note, usually on demonstrations people are instructed their back packs have to be transparent and they aren't allowed various poles and banners. Jake Angeli, self-styled idiot, has on his charge sheet he was carrying a spear (yes - a deadly weapon) with a US flag attached. Who allowed him to carry such an item? The people in charge of controlling the crowds (the FBI and the police) will be blamed for not even challenging it. I understand that this gallows thing has been seen at other demonstrations.

I went to a football match in which my team were playing another team about to be relegated. Their supporters had a 'funeral march' along the road leading up to the stadium carrying a coffin with the name of their team on it.

Is it really 'intent to hang the vice president' or is it 'gallows humour'?


I present my case, M'Lud.
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"No, no, your honour, I wasn't robbing the bank, I was just waving a gun around in the bank yelling "this is a robbery", and either way, what about the BLM riots?!".
 
Safe-Keeper said:
"No, no, your honour, I wasn't robbing the bank, I was just waving a gun around in the bank yelling "this is a robbery", and either way, what about the BLM riots?!".
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The FBI guy at the press conference today (Stephen Sherwin?) couldn't even bring himself to call the police officer's death, 'murder', and referred to it coyly as 'his passing'.

I don't know about you but I thought the FBI were tough and told it like it is.

Defendant X is brought before the criminal courts.

JUDGE: Sherwin, you may present your case (for it is he).

SHERWIN: Well, Your Honor, Mr X, is charged with er, um, how can I put this delicately? The passing of a police officer.

JUDGE: What do you mean 'passing'? Passing as what? Imitating a police officer?

SHERWIN: Er, no, not quite, Your Honor.

JUDGE|: Passing by? He was passed by the police officer in Capitol Hill? Is that what you are claiming.

SHERWIN: The police officer PASSED AWAY!!! How much clearer do you want me to be? Murdered! Topped!
 
cosmicaug said:
https://twitter.com/DonnieJrsChin/status/1348922343121412096

This guy could be some hot headed idiot who doesn't really mean it. i mean, people say things they don't mean when caught up in the heat of the moment, right?

Of course, he also went on to beat a police officer with a flag pole. I think it may have been the officer who died (and was also hit with a fire extinguisher) but I'm not sure.
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In this case, you have definite video footage of this guy beating the cop on the steps (it isn't Officer Brian Sicknick on the steps). So you have enough probable cause to charge him with attempted murder.

Simply chanting 'hang Pence' isn't necessarily illegal.
 
Safe-Keeper said:
"No, no, your honour, I wasn't robbing the bank, I was just waving a gun around in the bank yelling "this is a robbery", and either way, what about the BLM riots?!".
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"Also, it wasn't me and I was totally justified in robbing the bank if I had been there!"
 
Vixen said:
In this case, you have definite video footage of this guy beating the cop on the steps (it isn't Officer Brian Sicknick on the steps). So you have enough probable cause to charge him with attempted murder.

Simply chanting 'hang Pence' isn't necessarily illegal.
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people were all over the country chanting hang pence that day. the ones that tried to make it happen are the ones they should focus on imo
 
Vixen said:
In this case, you have definite video footage of this guy beating the cop on the steps (it isn't Officer Brian Sicknick on the steps). So you have enough probable cause to charge him with attempted murder.

Simply chanting 'hang Pence' isn't necessarily illegal.
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That wasn't my point. Here's a guy who says he wants to carry out violence. Later, he actually goes on to carry out violence.

My point is that you are insistent in minimizing the severe harm potential of the mob involved in this event. Reading your comments, I get the impression that you think that it was not reasonable to believe that this mob would continue carrying out violent actions; or (less likely) that, even if it is obvious, in retrospect, that this would have been the case, it is something that no one could have foreseen during the time when it was actually happening. Either of these positions is absurd.

Not all mobs are equal. Not all mobs have the same stated & unstated intents. Not all mobs are announced in advance with people who are to form such a mob saying that they intend to do bad things. Not all mobs are the same size. Not all mobs are advancing toward congress in session after being prompted to "fight" by their religious cult leader.

In this case, we have one such mob saying that they wish to do a variety of violent things and also doing a variety of violent things. One would be reasonable in supposing that a high likelihood existed of this mob doing more violent things if put into a situation where doing said violent things was an option for them.

It's not that difficult.
 
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