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Trump's Coup d'état.

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Except that they didn't rush in to attempt to overturn the election. Yes, that is what they want in the end, but there is no mechanism to do such by invading the Capitol. They invaded in an attempt to make their voices heard so that an investigation would be held and the election legally overturned. It doesn't make what they did right, or any less a violent insurrection, but it was not and can't be a coup because they had nor have no ability to overturn the election or to usurp the powers of the Government.

Relax! It's just an attempted coup! And of course there is no mechanism! That's what makes it illegal! And the illegality is what makes it an attempted coup. This is not so hard to understand!

1) The President is the head of the Executive Branch, they aren't the entire Executive Branch.

Constitution of the US says: "The executive Power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America."

They are not "The Government," they are a part of the Government.

I ******* know that! I told you that, remember. ******* look at this:

There are three branches of government in the US: Legislative (that's Congress) Judiciary (The SCOTUS) and Executive (that is the presidency and Biden has been elected to that role).

Three ******* branches of government! See!

And look what you said instead:

The legitimate legislative government of the US is congress

Wrong! As I pointed out to you, it is one branch of goverment. The Executive is another branch.

2) Biden is the President-Elect, not the President. The President-Elect will not a part of the Government until 12:00pm on the 20th Jan, 2021.

I know!!!!! I ******* told you that! Remember???!?!??

There are three branches of government in the US: Legislative (that's Congress) Judiciary (The SCOTUS) and Executive (that is the presidency and Biden has been elected to that role).

This is the attempt to prevent a legitimate election and transfer of power. There is no way around this!
 
You downplayed it when you referred to what happened as “merely stopping a government from doing its business” as if a few Trump supporters were in the back the Senate Chamber with air horns.

Right wing terrorists stormed the U.S. Capitol. Police were attacked. Guns were drawn. Shots were fired. Elected officials had to be evacuated or barricaded themselves in their offices. The Capitol was occupied for several hours by a hostile force.

That’s a coup.

Relax! It is just an attempted coup.
 
A coup - by the definition you provided - doesn’t require those carrying it out to assume the power of the government, only to seize it.

The power of the government to conduct its business was seized by these right wing terrorists when they drove the government out and took control of the Capitol.

Invading Nancy Pelosi's office and sitting in her chair was surely akin to an intruder in the Queen's bedroom. A massive, massive security breach.
 
From Rebecca Solnit of the GUARDIAN 'Why I call it an attempted coup'

I call it a coup attempt because, though I assume it will not prevent the Biden presidency, it certainly intended to, and is part of a campaign to delegitimize and thereby weaken the incoming administration. It was a long time coming, building up for years with white rage, especially white male rage fueled by everyone from Trump himself to the National Rifle Association, Fox News and the various rightwing pundits, the Republican party, the various faces of white supremacy, and the far-right groups such as the Proud Boys. It is a rage against the fact that other people might be equal under the law, that women and people of color might also govern as power begins to be distributed more equally, the same rage that attempted to delegitimize a black president with birtherism and obstruction. It is a rage against equality.

Democracy is a set of agreements to make decisions together and respect the outcome whether you like them or not. The kind of violence we saw on Capitol Hill is authoritarian, a way to try to force other people to submit to the will of the perpetrators. This violence comes from the white men who were long the only people with power in this country imagining themselves as marginalized and oppressed outsiders because others might also have power and a voice. We saw these kind of men last summer, when they invaded the Michigan capital while carrying semiautomatic rifles and saw them again when a handful of them were arrested for a plot to kidnap Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer. We saw them in racist shootings from the Texas border to a Pennsylvania synagogue.
GUARDIAN

Trump in his rally rant went out of his way to dog whistle 'Barrack Hussein Obama', Michelle, Oprah.

Calculated to incite emotions and to obstruct the Senate from assembling to certify the election results.
 
You downplayed it when you referred to what happened as “merely stopping a government from doing its business” as if a few Trump supporters were in the back the Senate Chamber with air horns.

Rubbish, I have called it an insurrection from the start, including in the post you are referencing.

Right wing terrorists stormed the U.S. Capitol. Police were attacked. Guns were drawn. Shots were fired. Elected officials had to be evacuated or barricaded themselves in their offices. The Capitol was occupied for several hours by a hostile force.

None of these things make this a coup.

That’s a coup.

No, it's not, and the fact you think it shows you have never seen a real coup. Go talk to someone from Fiji or Thailand.
 
13 people arrested so far, according to Norwegian news.

Despite everything, I feel bad for them. They've been lied to and manipulated for four years to the point where they genuenly believed the election was stolen and the only way to save America was through force. Now they will likely go behind bars for a long, long time.

Don't get me wrong, this was a dark, dark day for the United States, and of course I want everyone who stormed Congress that day to be prosecuted and serve time. It's just that it's just as much a sad demonstration of how they live in their own parallel universe. Storming congress is something I'd expect to see discussed on some nutty conspiracy theorist web site - the kind inhabited by the "I just came back from the courthouse, it's closed on Saturdays" types we make fun of here, when we don't worry about what they might actually get up. It's not something you expect hundreds (at least) of people to actually do.

Then again, Trump's regime has been four years of "I didn't think this could actually happen", so I suppose an attempted coup by selfie-happy gravy seals is just par for the course.
 
Rubbish, I have called it an insurrection from the start, including in the post you are referencing.







None of these things make this a coup.







No, it's not, and the fact you think it shows you have never seen a real coup. Go talk to someone from Fiji or Thailand.
Two different coups might look very different and yet both be coups.
 
13 people arrested so far, according to Norwegian news.

Despite everything, I feel bad for them. They've been lied to and manipulated for four years to the point where they genuenly believed the election was stolen and the only way to save America was through force. Now they will likely go behind bars for a long, long time.

Don't get me wrong, this was a dark, dark day for the United States, and of course I want everyone who stormed Congress that day to be prosecuted and serve time. It's just that it's just as much a sad demonstration of how they live in their own parallel universe. Storming congress is something I'd expect to see discussed on some nutty conspiracy theorist web site - the kind inhabited by the "I just came back from the courthouse, it's closed on Saturdays" types we make fun of here, when we don't worry about what they might actually get up. It's not something you expect hundreds (at least) of people to actually do.

Then again, Trump's regime has been four years of "I didn't think this could actually happen", so I suppose an attempted coup by selfie-happy gravy seals is just par for the course.

Counter point: Nazi regalia.
 
What powers of the Government did they seize during that time? Do you really believe that merely being in the chamber allows them to conduct themselves with the powers of the Government?
Weak semantic gamesmanship. There is an attempted coup under way, led by Dear Leader.

Not every actor demonstrates every defining behavior. That obvious fact alone renders your last few posts as absurdities.

If you and other posters chose different words to describe these events, fine, whatever. But expending effort to argue against coup is flat out weird.
 
Relax! It's just an attempted coup! And of course there is no mechanism! That's what makes it illegal! And the illegality is what makes it an attempted coup. This is not so hard to understand!

There is no mechanism, legal or illegal, full stop. A small number of insurrectionist rioters storming the chamber and forcing Congress to suspend is not and can not be a coup, ever. You are getting upset and wound up for being called on using hyperbole, calm down, and be a skeptic of your own argument.

Constitution of the US says: "The executive Power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America."

Yes, he's the head of the Executive branch, he is not the US Government

I ******* know that! I told you that, remember. ******* look at this:

You need to chill. You seem to believe I needed you to tell me things I already knew.

Three ******* branches of government! See!

And look what you said instead:

Yes, do reread what I said, you seem to be missing a rather important word which shows that I was making the same argument that you are now screaming about.

Wrong! As I pointed out to you, it is one branch of goverment. The Executive is another branch.

You really need to read what I wrote and not what you like to think I wrote.

I know!!!!! I ******* told you that! Remember???!?!??

Again, you seem to believe that I needed you to tell me, and if you agree, then why argue as if you believe he is now President.

This is the attempt to prevent a legitimate election and transfer of power. There is no way around this!

Which still doesn't make it a coup, or even an attempted one.
 
Rubbish, I have called it an insurrection from the start, including in the post you are referencing.



None of these things make this a coup.



No, it's not, and the fact you think it shows you have never seen a real coup. Go talk to someone from Fiji or Thailand.


Did you manage to read up on Hilter's Beer Hall Putsch? That's how things start.

First you get the 'protestors' to storm the lawmaker's government chambers and prevent them from carrying out their services by the will of the people, by force and public disorder.

Next you stir up a civil war. You try to control the press. Trump wants to ban twitter from censoring him. His supporters today wilfully smashed up the photographic equipment of the mainstream press. Equipment that likely cost $'000's. Wanton vandalism.

All authorised by the outgoing President and the culprits given his blessing and called true Patriots.

So. What happens next? If there is a civil war with with anti-fa rising up against MAGA, looting rioting, some cops and some of the army pledging support for Trump and defecting to his side instead of the state? Civil wars are very very bloody. But they always start with civil disobedience and a charismatic leader. Watching Trump ranting away, it struck me he knows how to hypnotise his audience and plant suggestions in their head. And he cynically knows what he is doing.
 
Rubbish, I have called it an insurrection from the start, including in the post you are referencing.

I directly quoted you downplaying it. That you might not have done it in another post doesn’t change that.

None of these things make this a coup.

They do, actually. You even provided the definition as reference.

No, it's not, and the fact you think it shows you have never seen a real coup. Go talk to someone from Fiji or Thailand.

Oh right, because differing degrees of severity automatically make them two different things. :rolleyes:
 
Two different coups might look very different and yet both be coups.

Regardless of how they look, they all have one thing in common. Those conducting the coup attempt to place their own government into place, usurping the legitimate Government's power.

That did not happen today, it wasn't even attempted.

What did happen was that insurrectionists attempted and succeeding in disrupting the Government's business through violent actions.

That's bad, really bad. And yes their end goal is to have the election overturned, which is also bad. But the action was not to the level of a coup. Call it a riot, a rebellion, an insurrection, even sedition. All of those are fine and likely fit.

What it wasn't was an attempt to seize and replace the legitimate US Government, and saying it was is Hyperbole.
 
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