Toddler Dies After Mistaking Gun For Realistic Wii Controller

[GreyICE]

We've already got mandatory child-safety locks on poisons.
Do we have those on guns?

You're suggesting that guns should be treated similarly, right?

Are you asking if guns have a safety? Really?

 

[rwguinn]

Seems the "gun-haters" have problems with preconceptions.
Nobody has advocated keeping loaded guns within reach of anybody, especially kids, but by dismissing offhand all references on how to be safe, they reaffirm their preconceived notions.

 

[Cavemonster]

Are you asking if guns have a safety? Really?

No, I'm asking if guns have CHILD SAFETY LOCKS.

The caps on bleach are required to be designed in a way that a small child cannot open.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child-resistant_packaging

The regulations are based on protocols of performance tests of packages with actual children, to determine if the packages can be opened.

Are all gun safety's tested and shown that children cannot release them?
If not, then guns are less regulated for child safety than bleach.

 

[GreyICE]

No, I'm asking if guns have CHILD SAFETY LOCKS.

The caps on bleach are required to be designed in a way that a small child cannot open.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child-resistant_packaging

Are all gun safety's tested and shown that children cannot release them?
If not, then guns are less regulated for child safety than bleach.

Integral safety locks are designed specifically to be 'child-proof' as well as all other forms of idiot proofing, and is thus are at least equal to child resistant packaging. If not a lot better.

Normal safety switches require a fair amount of force to 'click' and are as 'child resistant' as any package of bleach.

So for a gun to be a hazard to a child, it must be left in reach of them, must be loaded, must not have an integral safety lock, and must have the regular safety also disabled (or leave the child enough time to figure out what the little protrusion on the side does, which is hardly immediately obvious or even very easy to discern the workings of without education).

Which is a tad analogous to leaving a bottle of bleach on the floor with the top open, a situation you'd hardly blame Clorox for.

 

[Cavemonster]

Integral safety locks are designed specifically to be 'child-proof' as well as all other forms of idiot proofing, and is thus are at least equal to child resistant packaging. If not a lot better.

Normal safety switches require a fair amount of force to 'click' and are as 'child resistant' as any package of bleach.

So for a gun to be a hazard to a child, it must be left in reach of them, must be loaded, must not have an integral safety lock, and must have the regular safety also disabled (or leave the child enough time to figure out what the little protrusion on the side does, which is hardly immediately obvious or even very easy to discern the workings of without education).

Which is a tad analogous to leaving a bottle of bleach on the floor with the top open, a situation you'd hardly blame Clorox for.

But integral locks are not required, in fact, unless I missed a law in the last few years, no kind of safety is legally required on handguns.
http://www.gunguys.com/?p=1243

You state without reference that gun safety locks require more force than a child can provide. On the wiki page I linked, it specifies the organization that specifically tests and approves child-proof caps, which generally require not just extra force, but at least two dissimilar actions.

What agency tests gun safeties to make sure children can't disengage them? What is their method of testing and their standard?

 

[GreyICE]

But integral locks are not required, in fact, unless I missed a law in the last few years, no kind of safety is legally required on handguns.
http://www.gunguys.com/?p=1243

You state without reference that gun safety locks require more force than a child can provide. On the wiki page I linked, it specifies the organization that specifically tests and approves child-proof caps, which generally require not just extra force, but at least two dissimilar actions.

What agency tests gun safeties to make sure children can't disengage them? What is their method of testing and their standard?

The vast majority of modern handguns come with safeties. Offhand, the only exception I can think of is perfect replicas, and those are frequently display items.

Other than those, safeties are near-universal among handguns. So suggesting some large block of 'safety free' handguns exist is a tad disingenuous.

As far as testing, they are extensively tested. The California DOJ has established stringent standards, and most manufactures self-test their safeties to far exceed those standards. Safeties are generally designed to be incredibly resistant to accidental discharge from drop, impact, partial trigger presses, heat, cold, etc.

Once again, you seem to be insisting on the standards that a bottle of open bleach placed on the floor be harmless to children.

 

[Bill Thompson]

We are stupid animals.

 

[Cavemonster]

The vast majority of modern handguns come with safeties. Offhand, the only exception I can think of is perfect replicas, and those are frequently display items.

Other than those, safeties are near-universal among handguns. So suggesting some large block of 'safety free' handguns exist is a tad disingenuous.

As far as testing, they are extensively tested. The California DOJ has established stringent standards, and most manufactures self-test their safeties to far exceed those standards. Safeties are generally designed to be incredibly resistant to accidental discharge from drop, impact, partial trigger presses, heat, cold, etc.

Once again, you seem to be insisting on the standards that a bottle of open bleach placed on the floor be harmless to children.

Okay, so they are neither designed nor tested to be difficult for children to disengage, and they are not legally mandated.

That's less regulation than draino.

You tried to make a point about comparable regulation of intended features. My point is that household chemicals are subject to more child safety regulations than guns.

 

[GreyICE]

Okay, so they are neither designed nor tested to be difficult for children to disengage, and they are not legally mandated.

That's less regulation than draino.

You tried to make a point about comparable regulation of intended features. My point is that household chemicals are subject to more child safety regulations than guns.

Guns are actually tested for a wide variety of safety features. As you have again ignored.

But yes, continue onwards, brave crusader I'll be here when you'll be honest.

 

[Cavemonster]

Guns are actually tested for a wide variety of safety features. As you have again ignored.

But yes, continue onwards, brave crusader I'll be here when you'll be honest.

Yes, wide variety of safety features.

But not the one I asked for.

 

[Bill Thompson]

Dudes, the framers of the constitution of the united states, were all high. They were high on the idea of democracy. Everone counts. Everyone deserves respect. Blah blah blah. They did not have any patience to listen to anyone tell them that human beings are stupid animals and most of them cannot handle having firearms around. People back then had this stupid idea that human beings deserved liberty and they could handle liberty. What a mound of dung!

 

[GreyICE]

Yes, wide variety of safety features.

But not the one I asked for.

One might note that they, for the most part, include and surpass the ones you asked for. Impact resistance and moisture resistance ensures that no matter what the kid does banging it around or spills on it, it will not go off.

Safeties ensure that trigger pulls will not fire the gun.

It takes multiple actions to discharge the weapon, the same way it takes multiple actions to open a safety can.

The gun described in the OP was designed in 1902. Its a vintage revolver, and even if its a replica, would likely have no modern safety features whatsoever. Replica and vintage weapons are more dangerous than typical weaponry, and designed to mostly be display pieces.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.38_Special

It is unsurprising that century-old technology is much more dangerous than modern stuff.

It is a pure neglect case, simply and completely. It's like getting mad at tractor manufacturers because some kid hopped on a 1902 tractor and lost his leg to exposed gears.

 

[Ladewig]

edited to remove snarkiness

. . . . . . . . . . .
and now nothing is left.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Dudes, the framers of the constitution of the united states, were all high. They were high on the idea of democracy. Everone counts**. Everyone deserves respect.

** some exceptions may apply for those who are not white male property owners and the like. But really what has anyone who was not a white male property owner ever done that was significant enough to care about anyway?

 

[sgtbaker]

Dudes, the framers of the constitution of the united states, were all high. They were high on the idea of democracy. Everone counts. Everyone deserves respect. Blah blah blah. They did not have any patience to listen to anyone tell them that human beings are stupid animals and most of them cannot handle having firearms around. People back then had this stupid idea that human beings deserved liberty and they could handle liberty. What a mound of dung!

Or maybe they were counting on Darwin to thin out the stupid ones. In the case of the story from the OP, the wrong person was shot. Now wouldn't it have been a tale if the child picked up the gun and used the skills he learned from the game to kill his parents? That would almost be justice if only it were possible for the child to grow up with the emotional scars that would come from an incident like that.

 

[EGarrett]

You will kindly excuse me, Mr. Thread Cop, but to me the issue is precisely about the Wii Controller, and toy guns in general. Unfortunately the pro-gun people around here have turned it into another pro-gun thread, but that was not my thought.

Which would result in more dead children...every child receiving a Wii-gun controller, WITHOUT access to a real firearm, or every child receiving a live, loaded firearm, WITHOUT having seen a Wii gun controller?