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The Unobtainable Condition

Paulhoff said:
The real problem, Communism has nothing to do with gods, and that is how our government is suppost to be too.

Paul

:) :) :)
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Not to the general public. Establishing an Us vs. Them (or rather U.S. vs Everyone Else) is never easier than dividing the line along hellbound, godless atheists and morally-straight, good guys who pray every Sunday.
 
aggle-rithm said:
In another thread Wolfman spoke of the Raelian belief that if we build an embassy for them, aliens will come and give us eternal life. That got me thinking of other times when a group or movement said, "If we can only accomplish 'blah', then we will obtain 'bleh'", where "blah" is something that will probably never be accomplished, thus guaranteeing that the existence of "bleh", the ultimate revelation or prize, will never actually be tested.
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How about, "If only we could devise/you would only agree to... a Proper Test of my paranormal skills, I would be vindicated."

Not exactly a group unless you want to count paranormal claimants as a group...
 
kuroyume0161 said:
True, but about the same as the Raelians. For a more concrete example, we can use Mark 16:17-18:

And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; they will be able to handle snakes with safety, and if they drink anything poisonous, it won't hurt them. They will be able to place their hands on the sick, and they will be healed.

In this case, one supposes that no one has believed enough or invoked his name properly since there is no evidence that such things every happened or are possible. :)
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Never say never.

Snake handling or serpent handling is a religious ritual in a small number of Pentecostal churches in the U.S., usually characterized as rural and Holiness.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snake_handling


They also drink poison.
 
tsig said:
Never say never.

Snake handling or serpent handling is a religious ritual in a small number of Pentecostal churches in the U.S., usually characterized as rural and Holiness.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snake_handling


They also drink poison.
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While true, it is not evidential. We also have lots of faith healers performing laying of hands and supposedly curing the sick. But is it for real or something else? Handling snakes is just a matter of practice and caution (even veteran snake handlers 'occasionally' get bitten). Drinking poison, I'd have to know what it is, how much, and what they do afterward. :)
 
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kuroyume0161 said:
While true, it is not evidential. We also have lots of faith healers performing laying of hands and supposedly curing the sick. But is it for real or something else? Handling snakes is just a matter of practice and caution (even veteran snake handlers 'occasionally' get bitten). Drinking poison, I'd have to know what it is, how much, and what they do afterward. :)
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There's THAT one again!! If I knew how to link to all the posts I've ever done about the Church of God in Christ With Signs Following, I would. They do drink arsenic as well as handling snakes; I've seen it done on film. Blowtorches and sticking forks in electric sockets are also occasionally involved (this never has seemed very Biblical to me...) Some people have definitely been bitten by snakes. I don't know about the arsenic. However, it's possible to consume very small amounts without being harmed.

Now, speaking of "if x would only happen, then y could occur..." one example I read a few days ago basically consisted of the argument that if aliens would only visit earth right now, we'd be able to test the supposition that a specific situation would be enough to scare them off and give up on the idea of colonizing the human race. Apparently, this would consist of everyone connected with Jersey Shore, because the aliens would be terrified that they'd be infected with malignant stupidity and would take off at warp speed. ;)
 
There’s a whole slew of LDS prophecies that failed outright, but were later rendered conditional. Smith, when confronted with the prophecy of selling his BoM copyright to Canada made the awesome claim that some revelations come from God, some from men and some from the devil.

Not certain what good a prophet of God is if he can’t sort out which voices in his head have a classical music soundtrack and which have Bauhaus.
 
I am reminded of the joke:

"Why do you keep snapping your fingers?"

"Because it keeps the lions away."

"But there are no lions in this country."

"See? It works!"
 
It seems like the trump card of all unobtainable conditions is the "proper amount of faith". Since it is impossible to prove or disprove what is going on "deep within your soul" it is easy to claim that whoever didn't get their prayer answered or died of snakebite or whatever were not truly faithful and had hidden doubts.
 
Weak Kitten said:
It seems like the trump card of all unobtainable conditions is the "proper amount of faith". Since it is impossible to prove or disprove what is going on "deep within your soul" it is easy to claim that whoever didn't get their prayer answered or died of snakebite or whatever were not truly faithful and had hidden doubts.
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Or didn't get the children they desperately wanted, or the guy/girl of their dreams, or the job, etc. ad nauseum. The requirements of faith are apparently much more demanding for some.
 
Maia said:
I don't know about the arsenic. However, it's possible to consume very small amounts without being harmed.
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Well, I've spent the last several years building up an immunity to iocane powder....
 
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