The stupid explodes: obesity now a disability

No, CICO is still applied, but the genetics are about differential difficulty of managing it. That can include alleles that influence impulse control, for example.

My opinion is that if you survey a person with BMI=30 and compare to a person with BMI=20 and ask them what their weight management strategy is, both would say "I don't have one. I eat when I'm hungry, stop when I'm done the meal."

I want to circle back to this, because I couldn't find the previous research I read but luckily a new article came out.

Researchers from the University’s Department of Oncology and Metabolism analysed 462 scientific studies and found appetite ratings failed to correspond with energy intake – the number of calories consumed – in the majority of studies.

Linky.

I would argue most people eat when they're hungry, and when they're not. But stopping at a certain portion they've decided is a meal is probably more correct than saying they stop when satiated or full.
 
I would argue most people eat when they're hungry, and when they're not.

Yes, I guess what I was getting at, is that BMI is not a predictor of how a person decides it's time to eat. I expect the clock is the number one trigger.

There's also some semantics about 'hunger' versus 'appetite triggered'. Some studies make the distinction. The suggestion being that a cheeseburger commercial doesn't make you hungry, but it may trigger appetite. So, I should have probably said that people of all sizes seem to eat when their appetite is stimulated; not necessarily when they're specifically 'hungry'. They're making the same 'choices'.



But stopping at a certain portion they've decided is a meal is probably more correct than saying they stop when satiated or full.

Yes, this is the case, there are studies that show a person will finish a meal when the plate is empty, with no strong correlation with the amount of food on it. The classic example is Wansink's 'refillable soup bowl' experiment (Link: [Bottomless bowls: why visual cues of portion size may influence intake.]), which had a tube at the bottom of the bowl constantly adding more soup. Generally, people decided they were done when the experimenters stopped filling the bowl.

The point, though, is that BMI is not a predictor of who's paying more attention to how much they eat. If anything, I would guess that people with higher BMIs are more likely to be making an effort to watch their calorie intake than people with lower BMIs, all things being equal.
 
I actually think that worrying about diet is one of the things that can lead to over eating.

When you try to control your food intake you have to think about food a lot. And thinking about food makes you want to eat. Further, you may find yourself limiting your meal to something less than what makes you satiated. After an hour or so you'll start snacking on other, generally less healthy, foods, and will probably end up eating more than you would have if you'd just had a reasonably sized meal.

Instead, people who try to eat healthy food but are more relaxed about their diets may end up eating less than those who try too hard to control food intake.

That's just my own experience, though.
 
That really doesn't make sense..

Sure it does. Be mindful that weight is not usually the result of any actual effort or attention. It's usually just where somebody finds him/herself due to a lack of attention.

People with low BMIs are less likely to have weight as something on their mind. Whereas, people with higher BMIs are motivated to lose the weight and therefore more likely to be using a strategy to do so, one of which is monitoring calorie intake. To put this another way: calorie counting is dieting, thin people don't need to diet, ergo thin people are less likely to be calorie counting. All things being equal, meaning there will be outliers such as anorexics who are simultaneously thin and calorie obsessed.

The point being that BMI is not a measure of attention or effort directed to weight management. This is the disconnect I'm trying to get people to wrap their heads around. We can't look at somebody and determine the amount of weight management effort by their BMI.

Calorie counting is positively associated with weight loss and dieting. So if you know a person lost weight this year, or at least attempted to while dieting, they are more likely to have been calorie counting than somebody who didn't, regardless of current BMI.


I'll see if I can locate some examples, but the research that directly relates to this is called 'adherence to self monitoring'. I recall that BMI is positively correlated with all types of self monitoring behaviors, which include calorie counting, weighing oneself, keeping a food journal, &c. The corollary is that when people lose weight they stop self-monitoring, which is a strong candidate cause for yo-yo. Successful maintenance is rare because thin people pay less attention to their weight management. Less motivation probably.

There's a revival in interest in studying self-monitoring behavior with the emergence of fitness bands. If nothing else, Marketing departments want to know whether demographics can predict usage, and whether results affect usage. Turns out low BMI people have less interest in self monitoring products, and also use them for a shorter time. (most apps have a dropoff curve, something like 10% usage after a month - this is not unique for health apps).

Something else that surprised me: higher BMI subjects are less likely to use what skeptics would call 'quackery' techniques for weight management. That is to say, for example, that they are more likely to be calorie counters versus fad dieters. I haven't seen any good research to explain this, but my theory is that higher BMI people have more dieting experience and have learned through trial and error that calorie counting has better results. eg: [Differences in Health-Related Behaviors and Body Mass Index Risk Categories in African American Women in College]
 
I actually think that worrying about diet is one of the things that can lead to over eating.

When you try to control your food intake you have to think about food a lot. And thinking about food makes you want to eat. Further, you may find yourself limiting your meal to something less than what makes you satiated. After an hour or so you'll start snacking on other, generally less healthy, foods, and will probably end up eating more than you would have if you'd just had a reasonably sized meal.

Instead, people who try to eat healthy food but are more relaxed about their diets may end up eating less than those who try too hard to control food intake.

That's just my own experience, though.

Hunger is certainly a concern with dieting that comes in the form of simple food restriction, if it comes without any consideration for satiety strategies. (this is why I always include Volumetrics as a good starting diet strategy versus something drastic like halving portions) And there is an argument that too much attention to food could be pathological in its own right (eg: [orthorexia]).

However, there is an established correlation between attention to food (including thinking about meal planning, and right down to attention during the meal itself) and success in dieting. Just the act of turning on the TV, radio, or having a conversation at the table while eating is demonstrated to increase calorie consumption by double digit percentages. It's a nonfiction book, but [Mindless Eating] is a good lay primer on the relationship between inattention to food and obesity.
 
Apropos local news...


['Body shaming' ad draws scorn for Victoria laser clinic]

Two points of interest:
  • the complainant is a fitness instructor - she's sharing my concern that this type of attitude only demoralizes and frustrates efforts to lose weight. counterproductive, but profitable for a specific business that preys on people with self image challenges
  • the complainant's name is Bracegirdle
 
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Eh, I really don't see the problem. I think you have to reach or add in something of your own to say that promoting their product is in and of itself discouraging other fat loss methods. I also don't see why targeting issues people care about, even it it was purely cosmetic, is harmful. The idea that it is shaming anyone is silly, it is the people themselves who know these terms, apply them to themselves, and what to change them, and add whatever emotion weight they have.

I would be more concerned with if the product if efficacious, what the long term prospective results are, and if there are relevant mental conditions and how those are affected.

Basically, everything but the "muffin top" wording.
 

True, but genetic fallacy aside, what about her argument itself? Could her closeness to the situation actually represent expertise as well as bias? do you consider it relevant that her opinion is backed up by scientific evidence?

I've been pretty open about my potential conflict of interest: as somebody who managed sports facilities, I have lived with constant pressure to portray exercise as a key publicly promoted weight management tool. But I refused to do it, on account of the evidence shows it's not true. If I'm able to be somewhat objective, maybe Bracegirdle can too.
 
True, but genetic fallacy aside, what about her argument itself? Could her closeness to the situation actually represent expertise as well as bias? do you consider it relevant that her opinion is backed up by scientific evidence?
Our mission is to cultivate sacred feminine energy and awaken Shakti in all beings.

Yeah - not seeing much science, lots of testimonials, but not much science from her.
I've been pretty open about my potential conflict of interest: as somebody who managed sports facilities, I have lived with constant pressure to portray exercise as a key publicly promoted weight management tool. But I refused to do it, on account of the evidence shows it's not true. If I'm able to be somewhat objective, maybe Bracegirdle can too.
She's way too woo for that.

I'm sticking with opportunistic entrepreneurship.
 
Obesity is in someplace seen as a disability. I have heard in some studies that obesity could cause some other complications, like diabetes, that may affect the function of work. On the other side, there are some health conditions that could bring in effect obesity situation.
I think that a person should decide what weight is confort but I think if that weight is affecting negatively that person, it should be talked and take care.
I also do not think that this should be a disability if the person is doing the job he/she sign up for.
 

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