The "Right" programs on sex.

[thaiboxerken]

Texas study finds little impact on sexual behavior

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6894568/

It's interesting that the abstinence-only folks have no freaking clue about sex. I mean, wow, a program that tells kids "don't have sex" doesn't really get kids to stop having sex is news? Sex education, however, has helped bring down the number of teenage pregnancies and STD's.

"Other programs that focus on the social norms and expectations appear to be more successful, he said."

The social norms... such as having sex, perhaps?

Speaking of STD's....

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7232643/

"Teens who pledge to remain virgins until marriage are more likely to take chances with other kinds of sex that increase the risk of sexually transmitted diseases, a study of 12,000 adolescents suggests."

These kids are also less likely to use condoms when they do have sex. Probably because they weren't educated about condoms.

 

[TragicMonkey]

"Teens who pledge to remain virgins until marriage are more likely to take chances with other kinds of sex that increase the risk of sexually transmitted diseases, a study of 12,000 adolescents suggests."

These kids are also less likely to use condoms when they do have sex. Probably because they weren't educated about condoms.

Or because, in an effort to persuade them of the dangers of intercourse, their parents and educators stressed the fallibility of condoms and therefore made them seem pointless.

Which seems, to my monkey mind, like attempting to dissuade someone from driving by saying their seat belts won't protect them from vehicular death.

 

[thaiboxerken]

Nice observation, monkey. I never thought of that aspect of it.

 

[crimresearch]

Re: Re: The "Right" programs on sex.

Or because, in an effort to persuade them of the dangers of intercourse, their parents and educators stressed the fallibility of condoms and therefore made them seem pointless.

Which seems, to my monkey mind, like attempting to dissuade someone from driving by saying their seat belts won't protect them from vehicular death.

Or like trying to dissuade anyone on the topic of gun ownership by saying that a gun might not be able to help them in certain circumstances.

 

[TragicMonkey]

Re: Re: Re: The "Right" programs on sex.

Or like trying to dissuade anyone on the topic of gun ownership by saying that a gun might not be able to help them in certain circumstances.

I don't think the analogy is apt. A condom can prevent the transmission of some disease, which means its absence is sometimes bad. Its presence, however, can either help you or not, but cannot harm you. Unless you choke on it. Or unless your mom finds a used one in your room. In which case, you'd better hope she doesn't have a gun.

 

[crimresearch]

They are specious arguments based on a similar fallacy...
namely the boogie man of possible failure in hypothetical future situations.

'Don't fight back against a rapist, you might make him mad, and he will really hurt you, better to do everything he says without resistance' is another such.

It is totemism..the evil gun, or the licentious condom, or the oppressive seat belt, or the undemure resistance is forecast to make things worse, so getting rid of it will keep you safe.

 

[thaiboxerken]

So, did you want to talk about abstinence-only programs, or guns? Please don't hijack my thread.

 

[crimresearch]

The logic behind abstinence only programs seems based on magical thinking about human behavior.


Better?

 

[thaiboxerken]

I think it's more based on the religious right's fantasy that teenagers keep their promises, if they sign a pledge. It's also based on the christian belief that pre-marital sex is a sin.

 

[TragicMonkey]

I think it's more based on the religious right's fantasy that teenagers keep their promises, if they sign a pledge. It's also based on the christian belief that pre-marital sex is a sin.

There's also the religious right's firm belief that indoctrination at early ages is effective. That's why they make such a fuss over things like prayer in schools, the Pledge, abstinence-only education, Just Say No, etc. They think that if they can hammer something into a young person's head, it'll stay there.

This is directly contradictory to what I've observed of human experience, but I'm just a monkey.

 

[Mycroft]

Re: Re: Re: Re: The "Right" programs on sex.

I don't think the analogy is apt. A condom can prevent the transmission of some disease, which means its absence is sometimes bad. Its presence, however, can either help you or not, but cannot harm you. Unless you choke on it. Or unless your mom finds a used one in your room. In which case, you'd better hope she doesn't have a gun.

Oh, it can harm you. If you've ever had the experience of getting a wrapper that just wouldn't open and had a woman cool down while you fumbled with the light...

 

[crimresearch]

There's also the religious right's firm belief that indoctrination at early ages is effective. That's why they make such a fuss over things like prayer in schools, the Pledge, abstinence-only education, Just Say No, etc. They think that if they can hammer something into a young person's head, it'll stay there.

This is directly contradictory to what I've observed of human experience, but I'm just a monkey.

Which contrary nature requires the RR to keep their heads firmly in the sand about the allure of the taboo, lest they wind up admitting that they are making 'S-E-X' into even more of an attraction.

 

[TragicMonkey]

Which contrary nature requires the RR to keep their heads firmly in the sand about the allure of the taboo, lest they wind up admitting that they are making 'S-E-X' into even more of an attraction.

An attitude guaranteed to make their kids go wild, when they eventually er, go wild. I've never had the joy of being a 25 year old strict Baptist virgin's first, but I've seen the marks on the ceilings of bedrooms of people who were.

 

[thaiboxerken]

I've never had the joy of being a 25 year old strict Baptist virgin's first, but I've seen the marks on the ceilings of bedrooms of people who were.

Did it look like they slaughtered a deer in there?

 

[RandFan]

Abstinence only programs have no scientific evidence what so ever that they work. There is some evidence however that programs that include the advantages of abstinence can impact the incidents of sexual contact but there seems to be some contradiction in the incidents of disease.

I think letting teens know that they can wait until they are ready is not a bad thing. Many girls are pressured into sexual activity when they are not ready emotionally and are more likely to make poor decisions about birth control.

And please don't accuse me of anything. My kids new about birth control long before the schools addressed it.

 

[kimiko]

I think letting teens know that they can wait until they are ready is not a bad thing. Many girls are pressured into sexual activity when they are not ready emotionally and are more likely to make poor decisions about birth control.

Attitudes are poorly shaped by educational campaigns and making a dent in peer pressure is unlikely. The single most important factor in whether a young person delays sex is the input of their parents. I'd post a reference but it's late and I'm lazy. Transmitting factual information in sex ed is effective though.

Currently, 11 girls in the senior class of the small town nearest me are pregnant, 10%. A little sex ed wouldn't have hurt them a bit.

 

[thaiboxerken]

Sex education does encourage abstinence.

 

[KelvinG]

Abstinence only programs have no scientific evidence what so ever that they work. There is some evidence however that programs that include the advantages of abstinence can impact the incidents of sexual contact but there seems to be some contradiction in the incidents of disease.

I think letting teens know that they can wait until they are ready is not a bad thing. Many girls are pressured into sexual activity when they are not ready emotionally and are more likely to make poor decisions about birth control.

And please don't accuse me of anything. My kids new about birth control long before the schools addressed it.

I think you're bang on. I have no problem with including abstinence as an option. There is nothing wrong with spreading the message that's it's OK not to have sex. (although I'm not sure how many will actually listen)
But, abstinence only programs are just plain stupid. It's denial, plain and simple.