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Ed The Miracles Continue ...

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calebprime said:
Hey Scorpion,

a bit off-topic. But you just said you knew the Koran to some extent.

Are there sections that impress you for their psychological insight, depth of feeling, originality, wisdom, or poetry?

This is just to speed up my own dive into the Koran.

I suspect that it is not to my taste, but I want to make sure.

Can you, if so inclined, give me some sections to check out?
Click to expand...

Not much of the Quran impresses me, see my thread,' what the Quran really says'

According to Muslims the Arabic Quran is more poetic than the English translations, but I cannot read Arabic, I recommend using more than one translation for comparison because you cannot take any individual translation literally. I mainly use the Pickthall and Yusuf Ali translations but I refer to many others if there is some dispute.

I recommend people new to the Quran to read it backwards, from surah 114 because the Quran is largely compiled by length of surah and the longest ones are at the front. If you try reading through surah 2 you will probably find it hard going. But reading the short surah from the back is easier.

The first surah from the back that is of interest is surah 111 in which Muhammad condemns his own aunt and uncle for not believing in him.

The Quran is very repetitive and you will find the same verses practically word for word scattered through it.

I suggest you download a copy of the Quran that is all on one page then you can scroll through it quickly. I have a Yusuf Ali translation on a single text page but I cannot remember where I got it from. You will have to search the web.

I also suggest you use a search engine to look up words in the Quran so you can read on a specific subject. The following is the Yusuf Ali version


http://search-the-quran.com/

Here is a link to forty translations for comparison.


https://themuslimtimes.info/2012/02...us-translations-of-the-holy-quran-in-english/
 
Scorpion said:
Not much of the Quran impresses me, see my thread,' what the Quran really says'

According to Muslims the Arabic Quran is more poetic than the English translations, but I cannot read Arabic, I recommend using more than one translation for comparison because you cannot take any individual translation literally. I mainly use the Pickthall and Yusuf Ali translations but I refer to many others if there is some dispute.

I recommend people new to the Quran to read it backwards, from surah 114 because the Quran is largely compiled by length of surah and the longest ones are at the front. If you try reading through surah 2 you will probably find it hard going. But reading the short surah from the back is easier.

The first surah from the back that is of interest is surah 111 in which Muhammad condemns his own aunt and uncle for not believing in him.

The Quran is very repetitive and you will find the same verses practically word for word scattered through it.

I suggest you download a copy of the Quran that is all on one page then you can scroll through it quickly. I have a Yusuf Ali translation on a single text page but I cannot remember where I got it from. You will have to search the web.

I also suggest you use a search engine to look up words in the Quran so you can read on a specific subject. The following is the Yusuf Ali version


http://search-the-quran.com/

Here is a link to forty translations for comparison.


https://themuslimtimes.info/2012/02...us-translations-of-the-holy-quran-in-english/
Click to expand...

Whatever, but still a dearth of miracles. Where are these miracles?
 
abaddon said:
Whatever, but still a dearth of miracles. Where are these miracles?
Click to expand...

Muhammad excuses the fact he cannot do miracles several times in the Quran, and he also excuses not being able to show people his angel.
 
Scorpion said:
Quran 5.33
The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter
Click to expand...

Again there is self defense and retaliation.

My Turkish article about the verse:

http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com.tr/2012/12/maide-33te-istenen-nefsi-mudafa-ve.html

****



The assailants killed the Muslims, pulled them out of their vatas, or cut crossing them.

In the past, other spiritualist pagans, such as Pharaoh, did the same.

20:69 "Cast down what is in your right hand; it will consume what they have made. They have only made the work of a magician, and the magician will not succeed no matter what he does."

20:70 So the magicians went down in prostration. They said, "We acknowledge the Lord of Aaron and Moses."

20:71 He said, "Have you acknowledged him before taking my permission? He is surely your great one who has taught you magic. So, I will cut off your hands and feet from alternate sides, and I will crucify you on the trunks of the palm trees, and you will come to know which of us is greater in retribution and more lasting!"

*****

The Christian writer Texe Marrs talks about the reasons for the Egyptian Pharaoh's obsession to bring legs and arms crossed:

İn ancient Egypt, the mark of "X" and the symbol of cross-bones in the symbol of an X was very prominent in religious contexts. You can find the X on the walls of a number of ancient Egyptians temples and pyramids... It is the sign of Osiris, the great sun God..

The ancient pharaohs, when they were buried, had the legs crossed in the form of "X" as a sign of devotion to Osiris.''

Codex Magica (Texe Marrs)

These ancient Egyptian figures demonstrate how prevalent was Osiris' sacred sign, "X."




The mummy of Rameses the Great (1279-1213 B.C.) was found in this cedarwood sarcophagus. This pharaoh is thought by Egyptologists to be the ruler who enslaved the Israelites and forced them to build cities.



Painting from the Tomb of Rameses I, Valley of the Kings, West Thebes, in Egypt.



******

The tradition of keeping the arms and legs in the X position can also be seen in other pagan practices around the world.

In short, crossing is about self defense and retaliation to attacker pagans (Who cuts the Muslims in X shape).
 
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Scorpion said:
Not that I give a damn because I am not a bible scholar. (I know the Quran better than the bible).
But as I understand it Jesus the man was supposed to be born of an immaculate conception, making God his father, making him part of the trinity.
I think its a bit of a stretch to hold Jesus responsible for the flood.
In any case in my view the old testament is Jewish myths that almost certainly never happened.
Click to expand...

Denying the Trinity? That would have got you burned alive at one time.

Also it's very convenient to ignore the bits of the bible you don't agree with.
 
Emre_1974tr said:
Again there is self defense and retaliation.

My Turkish article about the verse:

http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com.tr/2012/12/maide-33te-istenen-nefsi-mudafa-ve.html

****
Click to expand...
No. just no.


Emre_1974tr said:
The assailants killed the Muslims, pulled them out of their vatas, or cut crossing them.

In the past, other spiritualist pagans, such as Pharaoh, did the same.

20:69 "Cast down what is in your right hand; it will consume what they have made. They have only made the work of a magician, and the magician will not succeed no matter what he does."

20:70 So the magicians went down in prostration. They said, "We acknowledge the Lord of Aaron and Moses."

20:71 He said, "Have you acknowledged him before taking my permission? He is surely your great one who has taught you magic. So, I will cut off your hands and feet from alternate sides, and I will crucify you on the trunks of the palm trees, and you will come to know which of us is greater in retribution and more lasting!"

*****

The Christian writer Texe Marrs talks about the reasons for the Egyptian Pharaoh's obsession to bring legs and arms crossed:

İn ancient Egypt, the mark of "X" and the symbol of cross-bones in the symbol of an X was very prominent in religious contexts. You can find the X on the walls of a number of ancient Egyptians temples and pyramids... It is the sign of Osiris, the great sun God..

The ancient pharaohs, when they were buried, had the legs crossed in the form of "X" as a sign of devotion to Osiris.''

Codex Magica (Texe Marrs)

These ancient Egyptian figures demonstrate how prevalent was Osiris' sacred sign, "X."

[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_164495a05f82af2d3d.jpg[/qimg]


The mummy of Rameses the Great (1279-1213 B.C.) was found in this cedarwood sarcophagus. This pharaoh is thought by Egyptologists to be the ruler who enslaved the Israelites and forced them to build cities.

[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_164495a05f891dcfc7.jpg[/qimg]

Painting from the Tomb of Rameses I, Valley of the Kings, West Thebes, in Egypt.

[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_164495a05f933216b3.jpg[/qimg]

******

The tradition of keeping the arms and legs in the X position can also be seen in other pagan practices around the world.
Click to expand...

Holy crap. Have you no shame at all? You are willing to hijack the religious crankery of others as your own? Across various millenia? Long before Mo and his sick god Allah? That level of lie does not give you pause?
 
Scorpion is a Christian missioner.

They have different masks and identities on each forum.

They show themselves as members of other religions.
 
Emre_1974tr said:
Scorpion is a Christian missioner.

They have different masks and identities on each forum.

They show themselves as members of other religions.
Click to expand...
Scorpion is no such thing and if you were even vaguely paying attention, you would know that Scorpion is getting roasted in a different thread.

And that does not detract from your nonsense. You are deflecting and proud of it. You thread is titled "The Miracles continue" but you have yet to present any miracle at all. Furthermore, you have denied what the risible book actually says which makes you an apostate, and we all know the violent end the book mandates for that.

The bottom line seems to be that we know more than you do about the crankery you seem to espouse, And you do not like that much.

Why?
 
Emre_1974tr said:
Again there is self defense and retaliation.

My Turkish article about the verse:

http://emre1974tr.blogspot.com.tr/2012/12/maide-33te-istenen-nefsi-mudafa-ve.html

****



The assailants killed the Muslims, pulled them out of their vatas, or cut crossing them.

In the past, other spiritualist pagans, such as Pharaoh, did the same.

20:69 "Cast down what is in your right hand; it will consume what they have made. They have only made the work of a magician, and the magician will not succeed no matter what he does."

20:70 So the magicians went down in prostration. They said, "We acknowledge the Lord of Aaron and Moses."

20:71 He said, "Have you acknowledged him before taking my permission? He is surely your great one who has taught you magic. So, I will cut off your hands and feet from alternate sides, and I will crucify you on the trunks of the palm trees, and you will come to know which of us is greater in retribution and more lasting!"

*****

The Christian writer Texe Marrs talks about the reasons for the Egyptian Pharaoh's obsession to bring legs and arms crossed:

İn ancient Egypt, the mark of "X" and the symbol of cross-bones in the symbol of an X was very prominent in religious contexts. You can find the X on the walls of a number of ancient Egyptians temples and pyramids... It is the sign of Osiris, the great sun God..

The ancient pharaohs, when they were buried, had the legs crossed in the form of "X" as a sign of devotion to Osiris.''

Codex Magica (Texe Marrs)

These ancient Egyptian figures demonstrate how prevalent was Osiris' sacred sign, "X."

[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_164495a05f82af2d3d.jpg[/qimg]


The mummy of Rameses the Great (1279-1213 B.C.) was found in this cedarwood sarcophagus. This pharaoh is thought by Egyptologists to be the ruler who enslaved the Israelites and forced them to build cities.

[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_164495a05f891dcfc7.jpg[/qimg]

Painting from the Tomb of Rameses I, Valley of the Kings, West Thebes, in Egypt.

[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_164495a05f933216b3.jpg[/qimg]

******

The tradition of keeping the arms and legs in the X position can also be seen in other pagan practices around the world.

In short, crossing is about self defense and retaliation to attacker pagans (Who cuts the Muslims in X shape).
Click to expand...

The Quran describes the real face of the cross.
 
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Obviously not on-thread, but I'm breathlessly waiting for citations showing Jesus was at an event (the flood) which never happened.
 
Ok if Jews were Muslims, then Jesus makes even less sense than he already does and the Quran should not praise him as a prophet, but denounce him as a false prophet and leader of a heretical and blasphemous cult. But it doesn't for the same reason Christianity appropriated pagan practices and holidays, to make the religion more appealing to practicioners of those other religions to make conversion -forced or otherwise- more appealing.
 
The real life story of Jesus too is only in the Qur'an.

Things are different from what you have been taught.
 
Peregrinus said:
Obviously not on-thread, but I'm breathlessly waiting for citations showing Jesus was at an event (the flood) which never happened.
Click to expand...

Time to start breathing. Feast your eyes on this steaming pile of poppycock:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pre-existence_of_Christ
wiki said:
The Christological doctrine of pre-existence maintains that Christ's personal existence is that of an external Subject within the oneness of God, and hence cannot be derived from the history of human beings and their world. His personal being did not originate when his visible human history began. He did not come into existence as a new person around 5 BC. He exists personally as the eternal Son of God. To adopt tensed language from Nicaea I ("there never was [a time] when he was not" – DzH 126)[15] and state that Christ "always existed" could easily be misleading. Through sharing in the divine attribute of eternity he exists timelessly, given that eternity is in itself timeless. Even the classical definition of eternity left by Boethius, "interminabilis vitae tota simul et perfecta possessio" (the all-at-once, complete, and perfect possession of endless life) (Consolatio Philosophiae, 5. 6), could misrepresent matters. "All-at-once" (simul) positively and "endless" (interminabilis) negatively recall time and temporal duration. Eternity and eternal life, however, are not to be reduced to any such temporal duration. The eternal "now" of the divine existence means perfect union and simplicity in unchangeable fullness of life, with no parts and with no relations of before and after, no having-been and no going-to-be.[13]...
Click to expand...
 
Emre_1974tr said:
The real life story of Jesus too is only in the Qur'an.

Things are different from what you have been taught.
Click to expand...
I can play that game too.

The real life story of Abraham is only in the Torah. The real life story of Jesus is only in the Bible.

Things are different from what you have been taught.

See how unsupported assertions get us nowhere? I have no reason to believe you, and you have no evidence to make me want to believe you.

Seriously, the Quran is only evidence that an Arabic desert dweller decided to co-opt existing religions in an area hundreds of years ago and modify them to give himself power and status, often times by force. Muslims, like many followers of other religions, cant even agree amongst themselves what the "true" version of their religion is, and you expect people at a skeptics site to believe you? Go convert your brothers in faith before even attempting to convert other belief systems.
 
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Emre_1974tr said:
In the meantime, there is no separate messenger named Joshua, he is also the Prophet Jesus. I am also writing an article on this topic.

*****

Continue with miracles.

22- And We send the fecundating winds…
(15- Hijr, 22)

http://www.quranmiracles.com/2011/03/fecundating-winds/


6- Have We not made the earth habitable?
(78- The Event, 6)
7- And the mountains as pegs?
(78- The Event, 7)

http://www.quranmiracles.com/2011/03/mountains-as-pegs/
Click to expand...
Those are not miracles and even at that your book makes stupid errors.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk
 
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