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The Dixie Chicks

jj said:
Well, how come we're not boycotting Willie Nelson? Johnny Cash? John Prine? Waylon Jennings? Kris Kristofferson (Django's Castle, Blame it on the stones...)...

How come we're only suposed to boycott the "chicks" who dare to have a brain in their heads?

I think we can all figure that 'un out.
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I'd say that the "we" who are "supposed" to boycot the Dixie Chicks do not include you.
 
Grammatron said:
Absolutely nothing :)

I just honestly can't see sexism playing a major roll in this.
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Why not? We're dealing with a group of people that are very, very conservative. Sexism, homophobia, and yes, even racism--they're pretty commonplace among country music fans*. The idea that women should be outspoken and political is not a popular one in this crowd.

I'm not saying every person who got pissed off did so explicitely because the Chicks are female, but I'm sure it played a role.



(*Ricky Skaggs, the country/bluegrass legend who sees himself as Bill Monroe's successor, still tells the "god didn't make Adam and Steve" joke every chance he gets. I suppose he thinks it's original and clever.)
 
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Regnad Kcin said:
Anyway, I'll cut to the chase.
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Jocko said:
About friggin' time.
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Your belligerence is perplexing.

Regnad Kcin said:
There have been numerous posts here suggesting that what the Chicks have done is economically driven, whether they kept their opinions to themselves, offered their opinions, or, I don't know, held no opinions whatsoever. This seems rather a cynical outlook, nevermind convenient; damn them, and damn the facts. Regardless. Now before you ask, I don't know the facts. But it's entirely possible one or more of the trio simply dislike one or more of the policies of the current administration.
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Jocko said:
So you condemn those who don't have facts that you can't even name. Sounds like a case of pot/kettle/black, but let's continue.
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And you're accusing me of condemming when I've done no such thing. Again, odd.

Regnad Kcin said:
What's curious to me, and in retrospect a better question for starting off the thread: Why the very big deal over the 2003 comment? I'll guess that it was due to some combination of its timing (tip of the hat to Tricky), the location (overseas), and the demographic and politics of the average country music fan, the latter including a bit of "traditional values" bias vis-a-vis sexual roles.
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Jocko said:
Ah, so you cannot conceive that the average country fan would have any other reason to tune out the Dixie Chicks than their perceived "assertiveness," instead of their "views in violent opposition to the views held by many if not most of their fans." I believe it's time to invoke Occam here, so why don't you explain WHY you think the obvious answer is incorrect.
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Where do you come by your debate techniques? Nowhere have I suggested I "cannot conceive that the average country fan would have any other reason..." Indeed, in the quote of mine directly above I allow for as much. I took issue with posters who suggest a nefarious profit-driven agenda to what the Chicks have done or are doing. Why not join me in asking those posters to supply this thread with a fact or two?

Jocko said:
Of course, this many mean you digging up some of those troublesome facts you admit not having, so I promise to be patient. For my part, I don't need to know the exact rate of acceleration due to gravity to know which way a brick drops.
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The facts I admit to not having are those regarding any agenda, hidden or apparent, on the part of the Chicks or their handlers.

Regnad Kcin said:
Also at work may be a subtle bit of psychological projection. Me, I notice I like a female singer a bit more if she is unmarried. It aids the illusion that she's singing to and for me personally. A relationship, a connection of sorts is in place. If that woman then gets hitched I sense in myself a touch of loss, even though the only thing gone is a silly little fantasy.
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Jocko said:
And it may be Ross Perot directing us through cranial implants from his mother ship orbiting the moon. So friggin' what? If you think your hypothetical is worth a whit, explain Madonna packing stadiums at the age of 135 with crow's feet and hip dysplasia. She's married with a growing stable of spawn - according to your "theory," she should have vanished long ago...
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I get the sense you argue for enjoyment. Please don't let me stop you.

Be that as it may, I'm speculating. The rationale as to why one little comment on the part of Natalie Maines three years ago prompted a huge public outcry (including death threats), and a significant commercial backlash which lasts to this day may be simple, or it may be complex. Expressing a sentiment about Mr. Bush doesn't begin to explain it all, considering such a position is hardly unique.

FYI, I have no canine in the chase, never having purchased the group's music or attended one of their shows. I started the thread because they are back in the news with the release of their first album since the incident, along with a feature story in Time.

Regnad Kcin said:
I suspect (again, admittedly a guess) this may be universal and for many the Chicks were at one time like their sisters or daughters or girlfriends. With the Bush comment, fans who disagreed felt personally bruised and betrayed, thus the reaction. Not to the remark so much, which was rather mild, but to their disappointment at investing affection and having it turn out to be misplaced.
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Jocko said:
Well, you've got a lot of guesses and suspicions and nothing substantive to back them up in the face of obvious contradictions, so I guess you expect me to weigh their value on ther own merit. I find them extremely thin. Want to change my mind? Fatten them up with a little more argument, a little less opnion.
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"Obvious contradictions?" It'll be interesting to see if you can find even one.

Regardless, changing your mind is not on my to-do list right at the moment. For one thing, it's not the easiest task rooting through your snarky comments in hopes of finding a truffle.
 
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Cleon said:
Why not? We're dealing with a group of people that are very, very conservative. Sexism, homophobia, and yes, even racism--they're pretty commonplace among country music fans*. The idea that women should be outspoken and political is not a popular one in this crowd.

I'm not saying every person who got pissed off did so explicitely because the Chicks are female, but I'm sure it played a role.



(*Ricky Skaggs, the country/bluegrass legend who sees himself as Bill Monroe's successor, still tells the "god didn't make Adam and Steve" joke every chance he gets. I suppose he thinks it's original and clever.)
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I understand all that and don't disagree. However, when I look at circumstances leading to the backlash sexism doesn't jumpto the top of the reasons for me.
 
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Regnad Kcin said:
Where do you come by your debate techniques? Nowhere have I suggested I "cannot conceive that the average country fan would have any other reason..." Indeed, in the quote of mine directly above I allow for as much. I took issue with posters who suggest a nefarious profit-driven agenda to what the Chicks have done or are doing. Why not join me in asking those posters to supply this thread with a fact or two?
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I think there's an error in translation. When you and I say, "sexism played a role," we mean "sexism played a role."

However, others seem to be seeing "sexism played a role" and taking it to mean "sexism was the one and only cause of the entire fiasco and everybody involved consciously hated girls who speak out."
 
Cleon said:
I think there's an error in translation. When you and I say, "sexism played a role," we mean "sexism played a role."

However, others seem to be seeing "sexism played a role" and taking it to mean "sexism was the one and only cause of the entire fiasco and everybody involved consciously hated girls who speak out."
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If you're naming it as a factor, I would take it to mean a more significant factor than just that some people who like country music also hold sexist attitudes.
 
hgc said:
Uh oh. Now they're really in trouble. They won't be appearing on The View, whose hosts make claims to launching their career.[FONT=Verdana,Sans-Serif][/FONT]
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I thought this was wonderful:
Dixie Chicks lead singer Natalie Maines' "new motto is, 'What would Bruce Springsteen do?' " says Robison.
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Now there's deep thought.
 
Regnad Kcin said:
Regardless, changing your mind is not on my to-do list right at the moment. For one thing, it's not the easiest task rooting through your snarky comments in hopes of finding a truffle.
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Tell you what: explain why Perot in orbit with a mind-control ray isn't a serious possibility and you'll be halfway to understanding. ;) There, is that softened and sterilized enough for you?
 
Dixie Chicks lead singer Natalie Maines' "new motto is, 'What would Bruce Springsteen do?' " says Robison
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Ah, here's what I was looking for. Thank you, luchog!

If you're listening to a rock star in order to get your information on who to vote for, you're a bigger moron than they are. Why are we rock stars? Because we're morons. We sleep all day, we play music at night; and very rarely do we sit around reading the Washington Journal." -- Alice Cooper
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BPSCG said:
Ah, here's what I was looking for. Thank you, luchog!
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When did Alice say this? He is an avid golfer now and is sober. I would be surprise if he didn't read such journals today.

(And half the Partridge Family is f***ed up. I've been spinning the wrong record albums backwards! Yes, I stole that 15-year-old joke)
 
this just in...They're on Howard Stern right now and we just learned none of them swallow, they don't get their periods at the same time and one of them (Natalie) is fully shaved.
 
HarryKeogh said:
this just in...They're on Howard Stern right now and we just learned none of them swallow, they don't get their periods at the same time and one of them (Natalie) is fully shaved.
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And that the lead singer doesn't wear underwear.

Oh yeah, they sing, too.

Michael
 
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