Cont: The Biden Presidency (3)

Status
Not open for further replies.
acbytesla said:
The problem with your argument is it ignores that you never bashed Trump for his massive dishonesty in any thread. But now, with Biden, all of a sudden you developed principles.

Biden's mental faculties are still there. I don't pretend.
Click to expand...

Ehh. I've long been sympathetic to the claim that Biden's mental abilities have declined over time. It's just that current Biden's mental capabilities are still far, far above what Trump's were in Trump's prime (which Trump is not at now) and are seemingly still quite adequate for the job.

To poke at a couple related things, though... when it comes to Biden's public speaking, it may be worth remembering his lifelong issue with stuttering. He's largely managed to overcome it, but that's a kind of problem that tends not to disappear entirely. Poking elsewhere, at last check, right-wing media is rife with deceptively altered video and audio of Biden as they try to create/reinforce their anti-Biden narratives.

On the lying front, it's pretty well a given that Biden has lied in the past and that he's stated false information. He's human, after all. He's also overwhelmingly more trustworthy than Trump ever was, too. That's not saying much, though. On average, politicians are dramatically more trustworthy than Trump ever was.

Random said:
I believe it.

It's pretty clear to me that Hunter was running a "Rainmaker Scam" using his father's name. Tell people that he can get the ear of the Vice-President for some cash bribes, then pocket the cash without telling his dad. If things go the way the client wants, Hunter takes the credit. If they don't, Hunter makes excuses. Lather, rinse, repeat.

This is why the GOP can find all sorts of secondhand information that Joe Biden was taking bribes (because Hunter was saying he did), but they can't find any evidence of Joe Biden actually getting any bribe money (because Hunter left him out of the loop).
Click to expand...

Questionable - Last I heard, in the e-mails available, Hunter Biden repeatedly made it clear that Joe Biden would not be involved. It's pretty well a given that various entities wanted to get on Joe Biden's good side through Hunter, of course, but evidence is lacking that they actually gained benefit from Joe with their efforts.

As for the GOP "finding" stuff? By the look of it, it's more the GOP "fabricating" stuff. Badly. Well, that and grasping for straws using exceedingly flimsy pretexts, as usual. It's not like their actually intended audience is well known for applying actual scrutiny to their claims. Starting with a conclusion and seizing onto anything that seems to get one there isn't smart or honest, but it is all too common.
 
Last edited:
Random said:
I believe it.

It's pretty clear to me that Hunter was running a "Rainmaker Scam" using his father's name. Tell people that he can get the ear of the Vice-President for some cash bribes, then pocket the cash without telling his dad. If things go the way the client wants, Hunter takes the credit. If they don't, Hunter makes excuses. Lather, rinse, repeat.

This is why the GOP can find all sorts of secondhand information that Joe Biden was taking bribes (because Hunter was saying he did), but they can't find any evidence of Joe Biden actually getting any bribe money (because Hunter left him out of the loop).
Click to expand...

The republitraitors are "finding" secondhand information about "Biden corruption" in the same way that Julius Streicher "found" second hand information about "jews raping good aryan women and eating babies".
 
Stacyhs said:
Now that is some fine counter argument filled with supporting evidence there!
Click to expand...

Biden's mental fitness was asserted without evidence. You're only pretending to be objective.

But his decline is obvious. Look at that clip from the 1980's I posted earlier where he's lying about his academic credentials, he's got no problem speaking. Now he does. He stumbles over words, he gets lost in the middle of sentences, he can't recall really basic stuff... "you know, the thing". The campaign had to pull out the excuse of his history of stuttering to try to excuse it, and that history may well be real, but he never had to make that excuse before, not in 2016, not in 2012, and not back in 1984. He's regressed. And he can't keep up a normal presidential schedule, he doesn't have the mental energy for it. His handlers have to limit his exposure.

All the signs of age-related mental decline are there, and they are obvious. Yet they are denied for political reasons.
 
Ziggurat said:
Biden's mental fitness was asserted without evidence. You're only pretending to be objective.

But his decline is obvious. Look at that clip from the 1980's I posted earlier where he's lying about his academic credentials, he's got no problem speaking. Now he does. He stumbles over words, he gets lost in the middle of sentences, he can't recall really basic stuff... "you know, the thing". The campaign had to pull out the excuse of his history of stuttering to try to excuse it, and that history may well be real, but he never had to make that excuse before, not in 2016, not in 2012, and not back in 1984. He's regressed. And he can't keep up a normal presidential schedule, he doesn't have the mental energy for it. His handlers have to limit his exposure.

All the signs of age-related mental decline are there, and they are obvious. Yet they are denied for political reasons.
Click to expand...

You so funny.

:D. And desperate. Why not present the many speeches Where Biden is almost perfect?

You're cherry picking. I can show you twenty year olds stumbling while talking.
 
acbytesla said:
You so funny.

:D. And desperate. Why not present the many speeches Where Biden is almost perfect?
Click to expand...

You mean from years ago? The answer should be obvious.

You're cherry picking. I can show you twenty year olds stumbling while talking.
Click to expand...

I'm sure. Some people are really bad at public speaking.

But Biden didn't used to be. Now he is. That's a decline.
 
In the world of the reactionary, everything is subjective: truth, lies, wrong, right, peace, violence, law, crime -- and, most sublimely, evidence vs fantasy. What he wishes to be true is true, and he can dismiss even the most mathematical certainty as his opponent's myth.

This philosophy is summarized in the reactionary's customary concluding argument, "Ah shuttup! You donno NUTHEN!"
 
Ziggurat said:
Biden's mental fitness was asserted without evidence. You're only pretending to be objective.

But his decline is obvious. Look at that clip from the 1980's I posted earlier where he's lying about his academic credentials, he's got no problem speaking. Now he does. He stumbles over words, he gets lost in the middle of sentences, he can't recall really basic stuff... "you know, the thing". The campaign had to pull out the excuse of his history of stuttering to try to excuse it, and that history may well be real, but he never had to make that excuse before, not in 2016, not in 2012, and not back in 1984. He's regressed. And he can't keep up a normal presidential schedule, he doesn't have the mental energy for it. His handlers have to limit his exposure.

All the signs of age-related mental decline are there, and they are obvious. Yet they are denied for political reasons.
Click to expand...

Is this the same as we were told that Hillary Clinton was on her last legs, was completely unhealthy and wouldn't survive a term in office because of her terrible health, that her handlers were trying to cover-up? Because it sounds pretty much exactly the same to me.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/clintons-health-continues-to-spur-controversy-and-conspiracy

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/20...s-health-scare-9-unanswered-questions-n646551

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/19/us/politics/hillary-clinton-health.html

ETA: Just to note I am not saying Biden is in perfect health, not saying he hasn't seen any decline in cognitive ability, he's an old man in an incredibly stressful job, I would be surprised if it wasn't taking a toll on him. I am calling out the doomsday approach to a change in his overall health.
 
Last edited:
sackett said:
In the world of the reactionary, everything is subjective: truth, lies, wrong, right, peace, violence, law, crime -- and, most sublimely, evidence vs fantasy. What he wishes to be true is true, and he can dismiss even the most mathematical certainty as his opponent's myth.

This philosophy is summarized in the reactionary's customary concluding argument, "Ah shuttup! You donno NUTHEN!"
Click to expand...

It would probably be a bit easier to counter these right wing freaks if the opposing leadership weren't also waist deep in the muck of corruption themselves.

I don't really buy this whole accusation that Biden was intervening to help his fail-son Hunter, but it's pretty obvious that a politician's son getting a lucrative do-nothing job in Ukraine was run-of-the-mill corruption that even the most casual observer of politics and foreign affairs will quickly sniff out.

At the very least, those funneling money to Hunter thought that there were corrupt reasons to do so, which isn't exactly the most inspiring thing ever. Even if it turned out not to have actually payed off in any way, the intention of giving the VP's worthless son huge piles of money is quite clear.

When we have a right wing in this country that is openly embracing flagrant corruption as a virtue, it would be nice to have a contrasting party that tried harder to avoid even the appearance of impropriety, but good luck getting the Democratic party to adopt such a mindset.
 
Last edited:
TurkeysGhost said:
It would probably be a bit easier to counter these right wing freaks if the opposing leadership weren't also waist deep in the muck of corruption themselves.

I don't really buy this whole accusation that Biden was intervening to help his fail-son Hunter, but it's pretty obvious that a politician's son getting a lucrative do-nothing job in Ukraine was run-of-the-mill corruption that even the most casual observer of politics and foreign affairs will quickly sniff out.

At the very least, those funneling money to Hunter thought that there were corrupt reasons to do so, which isn't exactly the most inspiring thing ever. Even if it turned out not to have actually payed off in any way, the intention of giving the VP's worthless son huge piles of money is quite clear.

When we have a right wing in this country that is openly embracing flagrant corruption as a virtue, it would be nice to have a contrasting party that tried harder to avoid even the appearance of impropriety, but good luck getting the Democratic party to adopt such a mindset.
Click to expand...

But Hunter Biden isn't really a member of the Democratic party.

But it should be noted that there isn’t even a shred of credible evidence that the President did anything wrong. He hasn't obstructed the investigation into his son and he has said he wouldn't pardon his son.

What else do you want?
 
Ziggurat said:
...

I'm sure. Some people are really bad at public speaking.

But Biden didn't used to be. Now he is. That's a decline.
Click to expand...

Where do you get this from? :boggled:

People with dementia could not give any speech at all. The fact an 80 yr old has declined from a couple decades ago is meaningless.
 
acbytesla said:
But it should be noted that there isn’t even a shred of credible evidence that the President did anything wrong. He hasn't obstructed the investigation into his son
Click to expand...

No need. He's got proxies to do that for him.
 
Thank you

acbytesla said:
But Hunter Biden isn't really a member of the Democratic party.

But it should be noted that there isn’t even a shred of credible evidence that the President did anything wrong. He hasn't obstructed the investigation into his son and he has said he wouldn't pardon his son.

What else do you want?
Click to expand...

for replying to TG's post. I confess that I felt not even capable of answering with QED! and aren't we all glad?

Oh but I am weary of the same old cow flop.
 
Ziggurat said:
Biden's mental fitness was asserted without evidence. You're only pretending to be objective.

But his decline is obvious. Look at that clip from the 1980's I posted earlier where he's lying about his academic credentials, he's got no problem speaking. Now he does. He stumbles over words, he gets lost in the middle of sentences, he can't recall really basic stuff... "you know, the thing".
Click to expand...


So one video from 1986 where he doesn't stutter is proof of his mental decline now? I guess a current video of him where he doesn't stutter must be proof that his cognitive health is normal?

My husband and I like to watch Jeopardy. We've noticed that we often can't find a word or name but we know the answer. We can describe the person, say what movies they were in, what books they wrote, what they did, etc. but we just can't find the name. If we pause the show and give ourselves just a bit longer, the name or word pops into our head. We do the same with words we want to use; we know there's a specific word to describe what we want to express, but again, it eludes us until we just stop thinking about it for a few seconds or minutes and then it suddenly comes to us. Neither of us has any form of dementia. We are a just in our 60's and this kind of 'forgetfulness' is normal and natural. As Kenneth Langa, Cyrus Sturgis Professor of Medicine at the University of Michigan Medical School, said:

"There is a range of cognitive decline or changes that can happen as someone ages, and nearly everyone has some slowing of brain function with aging, Langa noted. Increasing difficulty in finding words or remembering names is also nearly universal, he said.
Click to expand...


Ziggurat said:
The campaign had to pull out the excuse of his history of stuttering to try to excuse it, and that history may well be real, but he never had to make that excuse before, not in 2016, not in 2012, and not back in 1984. He's regressed.
Click to expand...

Have you considered that they didn't need to mention his stutter because Biden wasn't being attacked then by the GOP as he was during the 2020 campaign due to the facts he was not the nominee or president then? In 2008 and 2012, it was Obama, not Biden they went after with their ludicrous "birther", etc. nonsense. In 2016, it was clear threat HRC they targeted with "Benghazi", "her emails!", etc.

Ziggurat said:
And he can't keep up a normal presidential schedule, he doesn't have the mental energy for it. His handlers have to limit his exposure.
Click to expand...

That link is paywalled. But I found FOX's covering of the NYT story:

"The reporter surmised that Biden’s few interactions with the media is evidence that "his political strategists want to protect him from the unscripted exchanges that have often resulted in missteps and criticism."

I see. A reporter's 'surmised'. Do you know what two synonyms for 'surmise' are? They're "CONJECTURE" and "GUESS".

This article was about Biden holding far less news conferences than Trump or Obama. True, he doesn't hold as many, but what he does is hold more impromptu 'question and answer' sessions with the press than either previous POTUS:

The one measure where Biden has outpaced the men who came before him is in informal question and answer sessions – of which he has done 216 compared with 120 for Trump and just 46 for Obama.
Some of these discrepancies are explained away by quirks of each president. Trump liked to do news conferences with a foreign leader in tow (the lion’s share of his news conferences in his first year were of the joint nature) while Obama felt at ease conducting sit-down conversations with reporters.

Biden is less quick on his feet but also less formal, meaning that it’s not all that surprising that he prefers impromptu question-and-answer situations with reporters as opposed to scheduled press appearances. That is also a remnant of the decades he spent on Capitol Hill, where most interactions with reporters are both informal and quick.
Click to expand...

Ziggurat said:
All the signs of age-related mental decline are there, and they are obvious. Yet they are denied for political reasons.
Click to expand...

Your 'obvious signs' are the product of right-wing rhetoric and a political tactic of attempting to compare normal aging memory decline with incapacitating dementia/senility. Do a google search and you'll find plenty of this crap coming from right-wing, Trump supporting sites. That's some company to keep.:rolleyes:


Brit Hume:“I don’t think there’s any doubt (Joe) Biden’s senile.”

D.Trump: “[Biden] is not going to be running the government. He’s just going to be in a home someplace.”

Eric Trump: “[Biden] doesn’t have the mental capacity to be commander-in-chief of this country.”

What Biden and almost everyone over 60 have is minor memory loss.

Normal aging brings subtle changes in your ability to think and remember. Most older adults will notice these symptoms from time to time:

a slower pace of thinking
some difficulty paying attention
some difficulty holding information in the mind while multitasking
some difficulty finding words and remembering names
Our cognitive abilities tend to peak around age 30 and decline slowly after that.
Click to expand...
 
Ziggurat said:
No need. He's got proxies to do that for him.
Click to expand...

What proxies? WTF are you talking about other than debunked GOP conspiracy nonsense?

I keep hearing Republicans talking about Hunter Biden and failing and failing and failing to produce any evidence that Hunter did anything more than maybe leverage who his father is and very little of that. And the only crimes they seem to have against Hunter is a failure to pay his taxes and a firearm possession charge. It should be noted that Bill Barr's justice department investigated Hunter Biden and decided there was nothing there.

This reminds me so much of Hillary Clinton's emails. The GOP doesn't care about anything other than trying to cloud the corruption of their own party.
 
acbytesla said:
But Hunter Biden isn't really a member of the Democratic party.

But it should be noted that there isn’t even a shred of credible evidence that the President did anything wrong. He hasn't obstructed the investigation into his son and he has said he wouldn't pardon his son.

What else do you want?
Click to expand...

My "appearance of impropriety" is more to do with Joe Biden. Hunter is his immediate family member and seems to be cashing in on the proximity to power. It's not like he has any marketable qualities of his own to justify such a cushy job.

The whole thing stinks like ****.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom