Cont: The Biden Presidency (3)

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dudalb said:
And Biden has a new crisis to deal with, thanks to that drone being shot down over internatinal waters. There has got to be some kind of response, and it can's just be "tsk tsk" to Russia. Even more sanctions on the way, I supsect.
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The Russians would never have dared under Trump!


:rolleyes:
 
What kind of response makes sense? And maybe I'm ignorant of the circumstances... was it a targeted attack on the drone, or was it an accident, started by a case of one side "counting coup" such as where aircraft that are adversarial, but not in direct conflict, prove their mettle by getting a missile lock or demonstrating a theoretical intercept? IIRC those used to be fairly common, and even an accident wouldn't necessarily be considered an act of war if direct hostilities were not ideal.

Not that it's really great for opposing powers to poke at each other in this way, but escalation is not always the best response to an incident. The dance continues--both sides exchange warnings not to push things too far, possibly exchange not-pologies, and note down important intel about each others' capabilities.

It's very different of course if we think that the intent was to destroy this drone. And I welcome correction by people that understand incidents like this better.
 
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gnome said:
What kind of response makes sense? And maybe I'm ignorant of the circumstances... was it a targeted attack on the drone, or was it an accident, started by a case of one side "counting coup" such as where aircraft that are adversarial, but not in direct conflict, prove their mettle by getting a missile lock or demonstrating a theoretical intercept? IIRC those used to be fairly common, and even an accident wouldn't necessarily be considered an act of war if direct hostilities were not ideal.

Not that it's really great for opposing powers to poke at each other in this way, but escalation is not always the best response to an incident. The dance continues--both sides exchange warnings not to push things too far, possibly exchange not-pologies, and note down important intel about each others' capabilities.

It's very different of course if we think that the intent was to destroy this drone. And I welcome correction by people that understand incidents like this better.
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From CBS News:

For more than half an hour Tuesday morning, two Russian jets made a total of 19 passes on the drone, popping up in front of it to blast it with their jet exhaust and trying to drench it with their fuel.

One of the jets approached from the rear, and U.S. officials believe the pilot meant to come up in front of the drone so it would fly into the fuel cloud — but pulled up too soon and clipped the drone's propeller, which is located in the back, Martin reports.

"Just bad piloting," one official said, according to Martin.

Russian intercepts over the Black Sea are common, Kirby said in Washington, but this one "is noteworthy because of how unsafe and unprofessional it was, indeed reckless that it was."
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See, that's a little vague. What usually happens in these "Intercepts"?

Honestly, this may be a case where the public isn't given all the information that goes into determining the response.
 
gnome said:
See, that's a little vague. What usually happens in these "Intercepts"?

Honestly, this may be a case where the public isn't given all the information that goes into determining the response.
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That's certainly a possibility.

Have you seen the video released showing the Russians doing what is described above?
 
Releasing the footage is already a response, as well as a temperature check of the will of the American people to escalate the conflict.
Russia directly attacking US military assets is crossing a line.
 
To poke back at Uvalde -

New report on Uvalde mass shooting exposes why law enforcement sat on their hands for over an hour

The Texas Tribune reports that very early on in law enforcement’s engagement with the Uvalde shooter, they were warning one another that he was in possession of “an AR.” In an interview with investigators after the mass murder, Uvalde Police Department Sgt. Donald Page said that once they realized the suspect was handling an AR rifle, “We had no choice but to wait and try to get something that had better coverage where we could actually stand up to him.”
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So... blame the rifle, eh? But of course, nothing can be done about rifle, because the well's been so poisoned by those with ill intent.
 
The hole in the "more cops" attitude has always been that in the school shooting context those cops have to be well trained and psychologically ready to engage on a near suicide mission on short notice.

These people do not grow on trees. The cops who get sent into these spots are being set up for failure.
 
Suddenly said:
The hole in the "more cops" attitude has always been that in the school shooting context those cops have to be well trained and psychologically ready to engage on a near suicide mission on short notice.

These people do not grow on trees. The cops who get sent into these spots are being set up for failure.
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So you are saying we need to find a technological solution to this problem.
 
An old term, 'cultural trap'. It use to define something that happened in a culture due to some historical reason and had become traditional. However the reason for it is gone and yet it remains and causes problems. An example before a strong judiciary system so dueling was seen as away to deal with problems between gentlemen. It persisted for hundreds of years until it was stamped out in the mid 19th century. The gentlemen of the period were very furious about its removal. In America fist fights use to be very common, and was considered the thing to do but it caused a lot of problems and started dying out in the 1960s. To many guns are a similar cultural problem, a deadly cultural trap.
 
Hans said:
An old term, 'cultural trap'. It use to define something that happened in a culture due to some historical reason and had become traditional. However the reason for it is gone and yet it remains and causes problems. An example before a strong judiciary system so dueling was seen as away to deal with problems between gentlemen. It persisted for hundreds of years until it was stamped out in the mid 19th century. The gentlemen of the period were very furious about its removal. In America fist fights use to be very common, and was considered the thing to do but it caused a lot of problems and started dying out in the 1960s. To many guns are a similar cultural problem, a deadly cultural trap.
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True. But it all boils down to the fact that, for many, the 'right' to own a gun...even guns designed for nothing more than killing as many people as quickly and easily as possible...is more important than people's lives. Even the lives of children. It's just a very sick sense of priorities.
 
Stacyhs said:
True. But it all boils down to the fact that, for many, the 'right' to own a gun...even guns designed for nothing more than killing as many people as quickly and easily as possible...is more important than people's lives. Even the lives of children. It's just a very sick sense of priorities.
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That's why it is a cultural trap it causes more problems than in solves and came into being back in history where it made sense - it doesn't make sense now.
 
Okay, Trump is indicted. The banking crisis seems to be under control. Inflation isn't great but it's not as bad. Russia is on the ropes and Ukraine will make real progress in the late spring and summer. It's time for Biden to appoint an heir apparent and say he won't seek a second term. He can announce and not look weak. Go out on a high note.
 
I am worried Biden will probably have a Mid East crisis to deal with between Iran getting aggresive in Syria and Israel in total chaos.
 
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