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The Biblical Realities of Hell

edge

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As in the definitions listed above, the word Hell is used in scripture in two ways. First as the place or state where the souls of the unsaved who have died (first death - death of the body) and are under condemnation of God await in unseen silence, their coming judgment. These are souls separated from the body by death and neither speak, think, nor have conscious existence. In other words, they don't live again or have conscious existence until the judgment day. This is the state of the souls of unsaved men who have died. Consider Psalms, speaking of the dead.

Psalms 31:17

"Let me not be ashamed, O LORD; for I have called upon thee: let the wicked be ashamed, and let them be silent in the grave".
Believers who die go to be with the Lord and they rest not in giving Glory to God and singing praises to His name around the throne. But the unsaved who die have no voice, as they "live not" (do not have conscious existence) until they are raised to judgment at the second resurrection.

Psalms 115:17

"The dead praise not the LORD, neither any that go down into silence".
That is the destination of the souls of the unsaved. A place where they are unseen, and in silence. Contrast that with the souls of the believers when they leave their body in death, they don't go into this darkness of unseen silence, they immediately go to live and reign in the presence of Christ and praise Him for ever. This is just as Paul under inspiration of God declared,

2nd Corinthians 5:6-8

"Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:

(For we walk by faith, not by sight:)

We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord".
This is our eternal destination when our souls leave the body (absent from the body) in death. We go to be in the presence of the Lord. Death to the true believer is not a cause for sadness, but for joy. Again, as Paul so magnificently put it,

Philippians 1:21

"For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain".
Gain because we'll finally be at our destination with the Lord! While the souls of the unsaved don't live or have conscious existence being in silence, the souls of those raised in Christ go to Heaven to live with Him! This contrast is again gloriously illustrated in Revelations Chapter 20, where speaking of the souls of the believers who were martyred, it says they lived and reigned with Christ 1000 years. Then it contrasts that with the rest of those who died, saying,

Revelation 20:5 "But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection".
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People in here who are confused about hell, I think this makes it clear and it is what I have been saying about it.

So when Jesus said this generation shall not pass till you see me coming in the clouds is what is being reported by NDEs.

In Matthew it says: 34Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.


Be careful about what you think is total peace and nothingness, what you wish it to be, it doesn't last.


Edge runs and gets his sheild for those firey darts!:boxedin:
 
Actually, the OT has no hell. It has sheol -- the underworld -- where all the dead, including the righteous, go to.

It is a dark, unpleasant place (because it is below the earth and therefore cut off from the sun, and, by implication, from God: "the death shall not praise God / nor those who go down to sheol"), but it is not a place of punishment for sin.

The idea of hell as a place of punishment for the wicked specifically is much newer than that, due to the much later influence of the Persian religion or Zoroasterianism on the Jews who were exiled there.
 
Biblical reality - that's not like military intelligence or jumbo shrimp is it? Because I have been fooled before.
 
ebardos said:
Biblical reality - that's not like military intelligence or jumbo shrimp is it? Because I have been fooled before.
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Biblical reality is a self-contained reality.

Like the Harry Potter universe in the books.
 
Edge:
...so what?
I don't give a flying **** what the bible says about hell because I don't think much of anything in it, particularly the non history bits, are true. This just reads as a threat to me. But one as credible as someone trying to attack you on the street with a raspberry.
 
OK... no attacks but just questions.

1.
That is the destination of the souls of the unsaved. A place where they are unseen, and in silence. Contrast that with the souls of the believers when they leave their body in death, they don't go into this darkness of unseen silence, they immediately go to live and reign in the presence of Christ and praise Him for ever. This is just as Paul under inspiration of God declared,
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Why do believers get paradise and unbelievers get death?

Should a good and just Muslim be killed while a christian, who was not as good as the Muslim, live?

Does that not strike you as unfair.

2. How about those people who lived before Christianity and never heard of it?

3. How about a man who spent his life committing unspeakable atrocities but then repents and converts to Christ. Does he live while a Muslim or Hindu, who spent all his life doing good and being kind, dies?

4. Why does God want to be worshiped so badly that he needs to kill off those who don't?

5. Why can't God resurrect everyone who is worthy and not just Christians?
 
So what happened to all the people that lived before Christianity was invented?
 
So what?

The Bible is nothing more than a collected series of mythological stories, and Hell (such as it is) is nothing more than a fictious place that is very seldom mentioned in the Bible.

Therefore, it does not really matter to me what the Bible may (or may not) say about Hell.
 
I'm perfectly willing to believe its part of the bible. Although the OT quotes just say that the dead are dead, and the NT quote says that the believers will live again, nothing about punishment.

But what's the relevance of the christian after dead myths to me? I don't intend to die in glorious battle to get to valhalla either, yet in the norse myths that means I go to a pretty similar dark and lifeless place. And I have no children, so according to a large number of religions I will not live on as no descendants will remember me, which is their reality.

Just because it's written in the bible doesn't mean it's true, just like with any other work of fiction.
 
RobDegraves said:
OK... no attacks but just questions.

1. Why do believers get paradise and unbelievers get death?
Should a good and just Muslim be killed while a christian, who was not as good as the Muslim, live?

Does that not strike you as unfair.

2. How about those people who lived before Christianity and never heard of it?

3. How about a man who spent his life committing unspeakable atrocities but then repents and converts to Christ. Does he live while a Muslim or Hindu, who spent all his life doing good and being kind, dies?

4. Why does God want to be worshiped so badly that he needs to kill off those who don't?

5. Why can't God resurrect everyone who is worthy and not just Christians?
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1. I don’t think that is what happens. It would be unfair, because he said, so all should be saved, that is in the end to finally recognize who’s God and Christ or humility to know there is something bigger than us in control?

2. The same grace would apply in Gods presence, upon receiving the knowledge.

3. I would think not, as it states that many who think they are saved are really not even people who are Christians, God is god he will read your heart. It’s in Revelation I think.

4. I think this is more cultural rather than God we are talking about that in another thread.

5. Who says that he doesn’t, how do we know what his judgments are they haven’t happened yet, but yet everyone is resurrected, even those that sleep or are in darkness after death.

6. So the skeptics are in agreement that there is no after life, if this is the way you want to believe.
 
edge said:
6. So the skeptics are in agreement that there is no after life, if this is the way you want to believe.
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I have seen no evidence indicating the possibility of an afterlife. If you have any please present it. I have seen no evidence that the God of the Bible exists either. Furthermore, even if He did exist, I see no evidence that He deserves respect.

But as a true skeptic, I am willing to change my position if reliable evidence is presented.
 
6. So the skeptics are in agreement that there is no after life, if this is the way you want to believe.
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You know something? Not necessarily. I consider it exceedingly unlikely that an afterlife exists, but not utterly impossible.

What I do consider impossible, is that an all-loving God will condemn anyone to eternal suffering merely for the crime of not believing in him.

Or, rather, I consider it possible, but if so, such a God is so cruel and evil He simply doesn't deserve to be worshipped.

But again, I don't for a minute believe God, if He exists, would be so cruel.
 
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edge said:
6. So the skeptics are in agreement that there is no after life, if this is the way you want to believe.
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It is my understanding that all gods from all human religions exist entirely in the minds of the people who believe in them. That there is no physical or metaphysical being that corresponds to these beliefs.

There is still the possibility of a being no one has ever imagined or made a religion for. However, because of the absolute lack of any evidence, that possibility means nothing to me and I pass it off as useless. Therefore, the possibility of an afterlife is also useless to me.

If I were to believe in an omnipotent creator, it would be one that specifically and only created the physical laws that allowed the universe to exist and for life to have evolved naturally on this and likely other planets. And that if this being created an afterlife, the entrance requirements would heavily involve a curiosity about the workings of the universe as they are, and an attempt to further our species knowledge and technology.

I still pass that off as useless for all but philosophical banter.
 
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Skeptic said:
What I do consider impossible, is that an all-loving God will condemn anyone to eternal suffering merely for the crime of not believing in him.
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If there was a god, and he read the Bible...he wouldn't believe in himself, either.

So I shouldn't think it too much a sin for a mere human to reach the same conclusion.
 
A few more questions if you don't mind.

1. I don’t think that is what happens. It would be unfair, because he said, so all should be saved, that is in the end to finally recognize who’s God and Christ or humility to know there is something bigger than us in control?

2. The same grace would apply in Gods presence, upon receiving the knowledge.

3. I would think not, as it states that many who think they are saved are really not even people who are Christians, God is god he will read your heart. It’s in Revelation I think.

4. I think this is more cultural rather than God we are talking about that in another thread.

5. Who says that he doesn’t, how do we know what his judgments are they haven’t happened yet, but yet everyone is resurrected, even those that sleep or are in darkness after death.

6. So the skeptics are in agreement that there is no after life, if this is the way you want to believe.
Click to expand...


Let me summarize to see if I got this right.

Essentially in the end you are saying that everyone that has led a basically good life will be resurrected and find out that Jesus is God after all.

Am I right.

If so...


1. Why believe in any God?

You don't have any actual proof of God (s) and according to you it doesn't really matter what you believe but rather your acts. Ergo, belief is unnecessary.

2. What if you are wrong?

I am sure you believe with all your heart but in the end you have to admit that you could be wrong. This, by the way, is something that is true for all of us, those that believe and those that don't.

However...

What if God (s) are mutually exclusive, IE... believing in the wrong one gets you damned?

Someone who is atheist or agnostic can at least claim to have been neutral (ish) while someone worshiping the wrong God (s) is going to get it in the shorts.

3. Why bother with history?

If God is all powerful, why all this suffering and death, etc. Yes, I know we are supposed to have free will, but if God can see the future, and therefore the results of all our actions... why not skip to the end and avoid all the nasty bits in between. When someone is born, God should already know if he's good or bad... worth or unworthy. Ergo... paradise now would be appropriate.

Don't you think?
 
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