Terri Schiavo's (Flat?) EEG

Re: To Rouser2:

Originally posted by King of the Americas [/i]


>>*Execution...? You really believe Terri was 'executed'?

There are a few things in this life that I am absolutely certain of. I am certain that 2 plus 2 equals 4 (despite the new, newer math), that if you jump from a tall building, you are likely to go "splat," and the Terri Schiavo was the victim of a court ordred homicide, murder, execution.
 
Re: Re: To Rouser2:

Rouser2 said:
Originally posted by King of the Americas [/i]


>>*Execution...? You really believe Terri was 'executed'?

There are a few things in this life that I am absolutely certain of. I am certain that 2 plus 2 equals 4 (despite the new, newer math), that if you jump from a tall building, you are likely to go "splat," and the Terri Schiavo was the victim of a court ordred homicide, murder, execution.
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Prosecutor: How would you rank your certainty here compared with your certainty that there was a conspiracy to kill Kennedy?
Defense Attorney: Your Honor, I object...That question is not relevant
Prosecutor: Your Honor, with all due respect, we are trying to understand the witnesses ability to obtain, observe and understand evidence
Judge: Objection over ruled, the witness must answer the question
 
Re: Re: To Rouser2:

Rouser2 said:

that if you jump from a tall building, you are likely to go "splat,"
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More like "boing" (human bodies tend to bounce). Or maybe "crunch," considering the impact on bones.

But probably not "splat." We're not water balloons, y'know.
 
Re: Re: Re: To Rouser2:

Cleon said:
More like "boing" (human bodies tend to bounce). Or maybe "crunch," considering the impact on bones.

But probably not "splat." We're not water balloons, y'know.
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Mostly we are water balloons. There's a lot more water there than bones, that's for sure.

People who have heard human impact tend to report it as a "splat"
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: To Rouser2:

pgwenthold said:
Mostly we are water balloons. There's a lot more water there than bones, that's for sure.

People who have heard human impact tend to report it as a "splat"
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Really? I always thought it was more of a thud. Anyone got a sound file?

Or maybe we can do an experiment...
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: To Rouser2:

Cleon said:
Really? I always thought it was more of a thud. Anyone got a sound file?

Or maybe we can do an experiment...
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allready been done, (I hope as a thought experiment)

http://www.ncbs.res.in/~events/physbio_set3.html

dosen't give too much data on the actual sound a human makes but I'm sure you can use your immagination.



eddited to try and hide my dyslexia
 
Rouser2 does not reason. He/She merely bleats.

An infant recognizes that there is something wrong when it's laying in it's own filth. Therefore, it cries until something is done for it, because it cannot do for itself. (I'm a father of four. I know this.) If it's hungry, it cries, and when it's near it's mother, it roots for the appropriate appendage, seeking to feed itself. That's nature.

Terri Schiavo could not do that. The woman's husk was left to rot in its own filth, it could not recognize that it needed food, it did not recognize that it needed water. She was dead. What was left of Terri was a pathetic remnant of who she once was.

This debate is not about what was best for Terri. It's about when life begins and ends.

I'm not too certain about the beginning, but when it comes to the end, I'm damned sure. And Terri was gone fifteen years before her body was.
 
]Originally posted by Roadtoad [/i]

>>An infant recognizes that there is something wrong when it's laying in it's own filth. Therefore, it cries until something is done for it, because it cannot do for itself. (I'm a father of four. I know this.)

"During her menses she would indicate her discomfort
by saying "pay" and moving her arms toward her lower abdominal
area. Other ways that she would indicate that she was in pain included
pursing her lips, grimacing, thrashing in bed, curling her toes or
moving her legs around. She would let you know when she had a
bowel movement by flipping up the covers and pulling on her diaper
and scooted in bed on her bottom."

-- Nurse Carla Iyer (sworn affidavite)


>> If it's hungry, it cries, and when it's near it's mother, it roots for the appropriate appendage, seeking to feed itself. That's nature. Terri Schiavo could not do that.

>>"[Another CNA] and I frequently put orange juice or apple juice in her washcloth to give her something nice to taste, which made her happy. On three or four occasions I personally fed Terri small mouthfuls of Jello, which she was able to swallow and enjoyed immensely."
Law testified that the only reason she didn't attempt to feed Ms. Schiavo more frequently was "because I was so afraid of being caught by Michael.""

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2005/3/20/102601.shtml


>>I'm not too certain about the beginning, but when it comes to the end, I'm damned sure. And Terri was gone fifteen years before her body was.

According to representative studies, a clinical diagnosis of PVS by trained, board certified neurologists has an error somewhere between 37 and 75 pecent of the time. Damned sure, eh?
 
Rouser2 said:
]Originally posted by Roadtoad [/i]

>>An infant recognizes that there is something wrong when it's laying in it's own filth. Therefore, it cries until something is done for it, because it cannot do for itself. (I'm a father of four. I know this.)

"During her menses she would indicate her discomfort
by saying "pay" and moving her arms toward her lower abdominal
area. Other ways that she would indicate that she was in pain included
pursing her lips, grimacing, thrashing in bed, curling her toes or
moving her legs around. She would let you know when she had a
bowel movement by flipping up the covers and pulling on her diaper
and scooted in bed on her bottom."

-- Nurse Carla Iyer (sworn affidavite)


>> If it's hungry, it cries, and when it's near it's mother, it roots for the appropriate appendage, seeking to feed itself. That's nature. Terri Schiavo could not do that.

>>"[Another CNA] and I frequently put orange juice or apple juice in her washcloth to give her something nice to taste, which made her happy. On three or four occasions I personally fed Terri small mouthfuls of Jello, which she was able to swallow and enjoyed immensely."
Law testified that the only reason she didn't attempt to feed Ms. Schiavo more frequently was "because I was so afraid of being caught by Michael.""

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2005/3/20/102601.shtml


>>I'm not too certain about the beginning, but when it comes to the end, I'm damned sure. And Terri was gone fifteen years before her body was.

According to representative studies, a clinical diagnosis of PVS by trained, board certified neurologists has an error somewhere between 37 and 75 pecent of the time. Damned sure, eh?
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Is this the same Nurse Lyer that did not think five (ish) supposed attempted murders were worth informing the police about?

Her "memory" seems to work selectively - she "remembers" a lot of detail about this but can't recall how many times she had to treat her patient after a murder attempt. Which do you think would be more likely to stick in your mind?

And for her to be telling the truth, Terri's parents (along with everybody else involved in the case) must be lying. Yet you choose to continue to quote her as if she had any shred of credibility.
 
Jaggy Bunnet said:
Is this the same Nurse Lyer that did not think five (ish) supposed attempted murders were worth informing the police about?

Her "memory" seems to work selectively - she "remembers" a lot of detail about this but can't recall how many times she had to treat her patient after a murder attempt. Which do you think would be more likely to stick in your mind?

And for her to be telling the truth, Terri's parents (along with everybody else involved in the case) must be lying. Yet you choose to continue to quote her as if she had any shred of credibility.
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A heck of a lot more credible than you. Suspicion of possible insulin poisoning came only after more than one abnormal glucose reading. Could you remember how many venomous character assassinations you spewed forth even last week, much less fifteen years ago?????
 
Rouser,

Do you believe Terri's parents or Ms. Iyer? Or do you believe both are telling the whole truth?
 
Seems to me a nurse who would keep silent while a woman was being murdered, (if that truly was what was happening), is not only violating what she swore to when she became a nurse, but she's also demonstrating she's something of an opportunist.

If I were hiring a nurse or nursing staff, Nurse Iyer would not be on my short list. She's a genuine danger. If she saw something and waited until now to tell anyone, you have to wonder what she'd do if there were someone in different straits, someone who actually had something resembling a chance of survival.
 
Roadtoad said:
Seems to me a nurse who would keep silent while a woman was being murdered, (if that truly was what was happening), is not only violating what she swore to when she became a nurse, but she's also demonstrating she's something of an opportunist.

If I were hiring a nurse or nursing staff, Nurse Iyer would not be on my short list. She's a genuine danger. If she saw something and waited until now to tell anyone, you have to wonder what she'd do if there were someone in different straits, someone who actually had something resembling a chance of survival.
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The very day Nurse Iyer found empty insulin vials in the waste basket she reported her conserns to the nursing home and to the police. The police did nothing; the nursing home fired her. Gawd, you are just so mis-informed.
 
Rouser2 said:
The very day Nurse Iyer found empty insulin vials in the waste basket she reported her conserns to the nursing home and to the police. The police did nothing; the nursing home fired her. Gawd, you are just so mis-informed.
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And her proof of these allegations is?

Oh right....she SWORE IT IS TRUE! That is all.

This loser was so laughable that the Schindlers' (wisely) didn't use her in any trial. Then they only used her as a desperate tactic. Seems they pretty much didn't believer her until it was convenient. Not surprising, her story has more holes in than swiss cheese.
 
Rouser2 said:
The Courts of Appeal do not review facts, only process.
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You've repeated that several times in this thread. You're wrong. One form of appeal is the trial de novo, where the court of appeal pretends that the original trial never happened, reviews all the evidence presented in that trial, and draws its own conclusion from that evidence. Such an appeal was conducted in this case; a court of appeal reviewed the evidence and independently arrived at the same conclusion as the original trial.
 
To Rouser2:

I have deducted that you have based your stance on this Schiavo case on a set of 'beliefs', and that the 'facts' or truth of this instance escape you & your understanding of the matter.

Terri could NOT 'talk' with her parents, and she was unaware of her status or environment. Terri could and did NOTHING to stop her death. If she was as alive as you state, then SHE 'chose' to die by not asking for assistance, i.e. for "Waaa-ter", or for "Fooooo-d".

To murder or execute someone, it must be done by your 'direct action' to do so. Terri's FORCED feeding tube was removed, but this alone wouldn't and couldn't kill her. Because all that SHE had to do was motion toward her mouth while verbalizing ANYTHING, and she would have been assisted.

I know what you 'believe' the courts did, but what do you 'believe' Terri's last actions meant? Terri never communicated a willingness or a desire for eat or drink, even as she lay there starving & dehydrating to death. SURELY, someone of 'some' brain capacity would have done something to stop the process, IF they so wished!?!?

Basically sir, you can't have it both ways... IF Terri was as alive as you state, then she CHOSE this outcome. If she wasn't as the 'facts' & Science of the matter state, then what was done was the correct thing to do medically speaking. Sir, I urge you to leave your 'beliefs' where the facts of the matter begin...
 
Re: To Rouser2:

King of the Americas said:
I have deducted that you have based your stance on this Schiavo case on a set of 'beliefs', and that the 'facts' or truth of this instance escape you & your understanding of the matter.

Terri could NOT 'talk' with her parents, and she was unaware of her status or environment. Terri could and did NOTHING to stop her death. If she was as alive as you state, then SHE 'chose' to die by not asking for assistance, i.e. for "Waaa-ter", or for "Fooooo-d".

To murder or execute someone, it must be done by your 'direct action' to do so. Terri's FORCED feeding tube was removed, but this alone wouldn't and couldn't kill her. Because all that SHE had to do was motion toward her mouth while verbalizing ANYTHING, and she would have been assisted.

I know what you 'believe' the courts did, but what do you 'believe' Terri's last actions meant? Terri never communicated a willingness or a desire for eat or drink, even as she lay there starving & dehydrating to death. SURELY, someone of 'some' brain capacity would have done something to stop the process, IF they so wished!?!?

Basically sir, you can't have it both ways... IF Terri was as alive as you state, then she CHOSE this outcome. If she wasn't as the 'facts' & Science of the matter state, then what was done was the correct thing to do medically speaking. Sir, I urge you to leave your 'beliefs' where the facts of the matter begin...
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"Help me!" -- Terri Schiavo

http://www.terrisfight.org/documents/CIyerAffidavit090203.htm
 
Martin said:
You've repeated that several times in this thread. You're wrong. One form of appeal is the trial de novo, where the court of appeal pretends that the original trial never happened, reviews all the evidence presented in that trial, and draws its own conclusion from that evidence. Such an appeal was conducted in this case; a court of appeal reviewed the evidence and independently arrived at the same conclusion as the original trial.
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Source?
 
Re: Re: Re: To Rouser2:

Cleon said:
I love the way you keep quoting Iyer, as if she had some sort of credibility.

She doesn't.
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Oh, well thank your for that profound input. You are, perhaps, her confessor?
 
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