Merged Strict biological definitions of male/female

[Paul2]

And, pray tell, what might that definition consist of? The problem is that there generally isn't, at least until Trump's EOs, any sort of definition for the sexes codified into law. That's how the "judges" in the Tickle vs. Giggle and Renee Richards cases I probably mentioned earlier "concluded" that Tickle & Richards, with their neovaginas, had changed sex.

Y'all might have some interest in this post of mine on Missouri's kick at that kitty:

Bastardizing Sex in Missouri

Good Intentions Paving Company

humanuseofhumanbeings.substack.com

That probably works for most cases -- and allows "Emily" to keep her "female" card ... -- though it kind of puts CAIS people into the male category, and it is inconsistent with Trump's EOs. But it ain't the strict biological definitions that are sort of essential to biology.


Methinks you're kind of begging the question: "an informal fallacy that occurs when an argument's premises assume the truth of the conclusion".

Begging the question - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

You're assuming a definition for the sexes which makes menopausees into females when that certainly isn't consistent with the standard biological definitions nor, probably, with Trump's EOs. It may not have much direct and deleterious effects -- at least right out of the chute. But it seems court cases often turn on the edge cases.

You missed the context of my post completely, and that will be the last comment I direct towards you on this thread until my next lapse in judgment.

 

[Steersman]

You missed the context of my post completely, and that will be the last comment I direct towards you on this thread until my next lapse in judgment.

Which "context" did you have in mind? Town? Country? Continent? Planet? Galaxy? Am I a mind reader?

I was under the impression that the "context" in question was -- originally, in the OP -- the strict biological definitions for the sexes and, "laterly", Trump's kick at that kitty, and what the social consequences of them are going to be.

You are, of course, welcome to your own rather idiosyncratic and quite unscientific definitions for the sexes by which menopausees get to qualify as "members of the female sex". But as long as those definitions are not matters of law, are not specified in legalese, so long will society have to deal with the often rather sticky consequences of not doing so.

 

[smartcooky]

You missed the context of my post completely....

Why are you even surprised by this?

 

[Myriad]

You missed the context of my post completely, and that will be the last comment I direct towards you on this thread until my next lapse in judgment.

For my part, I absolutely do regard government-endorsed documents, as well as medical records kept by licensed medical professionals who have examined and treated us, as direct evidence of my wife's correct sex classification in contradiction of Steersman's position. We aren't laboratory specimens or zoo exhibits, so why should the opinions or standards of "biologists" matter at all, let alone overrule the professionals and officials we actually interact with?

 

[d4m10n]

Looks like that policy isn't actually related to DSDs in any fashion at all. It seems rather like a sneaky way to force transgender stuff into policy by pretending that DSDs are in some fashion related to transgender identity stuff.

How does maintaining "confidentiality about a student's medical information" help sneak in transgender ideology?

Is it your genuine and honest opinion that some people with CAIS make a habit of going around and telling everyone they interact with about their medical condition?

I don't know if you've met anyone from Gen Z yet, but they actually tend to lead with anything that qualifies them as being a member of one of the oppressed groups which you can find on the progressive version of the pride flag. I presume this is because they are the only generation to have low-key adopted the progressive stack^WP as an ethos for use in everyday interactions. This is probably why so many of them are openly nonbinary compared to, say, Gen X—it is considered the absolute dregs of unfashionability to be a cishet straight person with none of the oppression markers.

 

[Emily's Cat]

Your link gives a "page not found error"

It's not my link, and it's still there.

 

[Emily's Cat]

How does maintaining "confidentiality about a student's medical information" help sneak in transgender ideology?

Oh come on, do better. You picked one item that isn't specifically about transgender ideology while eliding several that clearly are. Having a bullet for maintaining medical confidentiality is probably reasonable... but when you pair it with using 'inclusive' language, respecting gender identity, and promoting gender neutral language, and it's not like this is a well-hidden agenda.

I don't know if you've met anyone from Gen Z yet, but they actually tend to lead with anything that qualifies them as being a member of one of the oppressed groups which you can find on the progressive version of the pride flag. I presume this is because they are the only generation to have low-key adopted the progressive stack^WP as an ethos for use in everyday interactions. This is probably why so many of them are openly nonbinary compared to, say, Gen X—it is considered the absolute dregs of unfashionability to be a cishet straight person with none of the oppression markers.

True. They've really flipped things on their head, and are determined to judge everyone based on categorical labels rather than content of character.

Not-entirely-serious: I blame it on D&D and video games, where it's become SOP to develop a persona from scratch with no basis in reality, then use that class-and-skill based shorthand for a fictional character as a long-term persona while deeply invested in playing make-believe.

 

[Rolfe]

During the Sandie Peggie tribunal, her counsel described what Theodore "Beth" Upton is doing as "immersive role-play".

 

[smartcooky]

During the Sandie Peggie tribunal, her counsel described what Theodore "Beth" Upton is doing as "immersive role-play".

Sounds about right

 

[d4m10n]

You picked one item that isn't specifically about transgender ideology while eliding several that clearly are.

Your claim was that the "policy isn't actually related to DSDs in any fashion at all" (emphasis mine) so I only needed one item to falsify.

As to the gender neutral language, I think that's a good idea when you have intersex students who might well be wondering whether they ought to have been born unambiguously male or female.

 

[Rolfe]

People with DSD conditions (a) usually don't like the term intersex, and (b) are usually especially sensitive to any suggestion that they aren't male or female. They're likely to be offended by being referred to by "gender neutral" pronouns.

 

[d4m10n]

People with DSD conditions [are] likely to be offended by being referred to by "gender neutral" pronouns.

The guidance doesn't mention pronouns at all.

 

[Emily's Cat]

Your claim was that the "policy isn't actually related to DSDs in any fashion at all" (emphasis mine) so I only needed one item to falsify.

As to the gender neutral language, I think that's a good idea when you have intersex students who might well be wondering whether they ought to have been born unambiguously male or female.

Maintaining medical confidentiality should be applicable to all students all the time. The policy uses DSDs as a stalking horse for gender identity ideology.

 

[d4m10n]

The policy uses DSDs as a stalking horse for gender identity ideology.

Does it, though?

The central tenet of gender identity ideology is the idea that gender identity is more real or at least more important than biological sex, and I'm not seeing anything which would help us get there.