#spanishrevolution

WildCat said:
When individuals and corporations are convinced that all the breaks and contracts will go to the politically connected, and the laws written for their benefit, they do not participate in the economy becaause they figure the system is rigged against them. Businesses are not started, existing businesses don't bid for contracts, corruption isn't even reported. The economic damage from corruption is many, many times the cost of the actual corruption.
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....but they still have the issue of this huge property bubble to to deal with regardless.
 
In the political front it's all quiet, except for the President Zapatero choosing a successor, but this is related to the sound defeat of the governing party, PSOE, in the recent autonomic and municipal elections. There are some asking for the removal of the camps, but so far nothing's been done except in Barcelona and Lleida.

The camps are back in Barcelona, keeping a relatively low-profile, making efforts to keep the square clean and safe. There are neighbourhood assemblies gathering in Madrid, Barcelona, and areas of other cities. There's LOTS of talk on the streets, anybody can grab a megaphone and say what's on their mind, and this should be chaotic but it isn't really. The public reacts with hand gestures to the speaker, to signal agreement, disagreement, that they should speak louder, or that they should give their turn to someone else. Lawyers get together to write forms and petitions and to counsel people in case of police actions or on how to avoid being on the wrong side of the law. Some of the manifests are being translated to Braille. There's LOTS of stuff going on. The strangest thing is that there's no particular leader or spokesman, faces and voices change every 2-3 days, and it feels strange and a bit unreal.
 
All these protests making their way through the middle east, Africa, and Europe somehow seem to be fomented in one way or another
 
INRM said:
All these protests making their way through the middle east, Africa, and Europe somehow seem to be fomented in one way or another
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It's those International Jews causing trouble again.
 
Eddie Dane said:
I can understand their anger .. snip
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I get their frustration, but don't find
.. A lot of righteous indignation, loud noise and littering.
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To be much more useful that getting the police a lot of overtime pay.

Hmm, overtime pay for cops might drive up government debt. :p Looks like you and I have an accord. :cool:
 
The Don said:
Even if the corruption is eliminated, or reduced to manageable proportions, the Spanish economy is left with a stagnant construction industry and eye watering levels of debt.
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WildCat said:
When individuals and corporations are convinced that all the breaks and contracts will go to the politically connected, and the laws written for their benefit, they do not participate in the economy becaause they figure the system is rigged against them. Businesses are not started, existing businesses don't bid for contracts, corruption isn't even reported. The economic damage from corruption is many, many times the cost of the actual corruption.
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DC said:
companies will then work on better political connection and participate in the economy.
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I agree with all 3 posts. This is happening today... unfortunately the companies are establishing better political connections in other countries. As an example: The incentive for US companies to cooperate with the US Congress is very little, they just move their cost structure to countries that will provide the benefits for them. It also gets them closer to emerging markets and cheaper labor.
 
Out of Greece and Spain are coming videos of the usual agents provocateurs at the demonstrations. Here in Barcelona, you see a small group of masked troublemakers shouted at by peaceful protesters, because they used violence (before the video) and the police answered in kind against the general crowd. Watch them getting guarded home. There are german subtitles if that helps (click "CC").


A lot of police brutality in general but the outraged don't seem to be impressed, on the contrary, it triggers a lot of people to join.
 
Childlike Empress said:
Out of Greece and Spain are coming videos of the usual agents provocateurs at the demonstrations. Here in Barcelona, you see a small group of masked troublemakers shouted at by peaceful protesters, because they used violence (before the video) and the police answered in kind against the general crowd. Watch them getting guarded home. There are german subtitles if that helps (click "CC").


A lot of police brutality in general but the outraged don't seem to be impressed, on the contrary, it triggers a lot of people to join.
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I've seen this video because everybody talks about it, and it's not evidence of what people claim. It's the secret police, and it's not news to anyone that there might be secret police there. The video doesn't prove anything else.

I think this is a genuine spontaneous movement, but this particular incident is not the type of action I expect. It's strategically stupid and naive.
 
Dani said:
I think this is a genuine spontaneous movement, but this particular incident is not the type of action I expect. It's strategically stupid and naive.
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It's called desperation and nothing out of line. Same thing in Athens and a long history of similar "stupid" actions over the last decade+ all over the place. As long as the corporate media doesn't report, "stupidity" doesn't matter. The original video was set to "private" this afternoon after 250K views, this one is a mirror created by a reader of a german online article about it.
 
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The Great Revolution Is Just Around the Corner....We have been hearing that from the Marxist for How Long?
And the joke is the only regimes in recent history in Europe to be overthrown by Revolution were Marxist Regimes........

Will our Little Empress be saying that Canada is near revolution becuase of the Vancouver riots?
 
dudalb said:
The Great Revolution Is Just Around the Corner....We have been hearing that from the Marxist for How Long?
And the joke is the only regimes in recent history in Europe to be overthrown by Revolution were Marxist Regimes........

Will our Little Empress be saying that Canada is near revolution becuase of the Vancouver riots?
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Our little dudalb here has perfected the art of capitalization to something Captain America might call capitalism, but we're still waiting to witness him only once typing up something of substance.
 
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The outraged want citizens to regain their voices - as in a participative democracy embodied by neighborhood associations, and in favor of the right to vote for immigrants.
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Given the endemic corruption of the native-born Spanish politicians, I can see why the Spaniards would want to vote for immigrants. * Maybe we could send them some of our American politicians.

*On edit - insert 'wink' smilie there
 
carlitos said:
Given the endemic corruption of the native-born Spanish politicians, I can see why the Spaniards would want to vote for immigrants. * Maybe we could send them some of our American politicians.

*On edit - insert 'wink' smilie there
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Since we have an immigration issue in the USA... we could send them some our immigrants that currently speak Spanish and no English. ;)
 
Spain needs to be more like Germany and France, and less like Greece and Portugal.
 
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