So, basically the argument that your BS should be exempt from skepticism?
No, Hans, that is not what I said. Nothing I have said should be "exempt from skepticism." The argument I'm actually trying to discuss in this thread (i.e. what is happening in the world right now, and how unusual it is or isn't) is not exempt from skepticism. I want people to watch the documentary, and discuss it. That's hardly "exempt from skepticism", is it? Your use of the term "BS" suggests maybe you are refering to something else (i.e. the fact that prophecies/predictions are involved?). If so, I'm not saying that it should be "exempt from skepticism." I meant
exactly what I said. Arguments like this are non-resolvable and irrelevant. They are non-resolvable because the skeptics can't prove the phenomena in question aren't real and the believers can't prove they are real. And they are irrelevant because neither can side can demonstrate that a generalised belief in the possibility of prophecies are either helpful or harmful. You can be as skeptical as you like, because I'm not interested in convincing skeptics to become believers, or vice versa, because I think it is not very important and a distraction from the main issue.
Please do not try to "interpret" what I've said above, of paraphrase it in innacurate ways that other people will believe without bothering to find out for themselves what I actually said.
Sorry, no, there is nothing in skepticism that says one should only apply it to God, but should just believe any random guy's postulates if it's about everything else. Show the evidence or you don't get taken seriously.
Don't get taken seriously about
what, Hans?
What are you complaining about a lack of evidence for? Is it something I'm actually trying to convince you of, or something the JREFers would like to think I'm trying to convince them of, even though I'm not?
Religious skepticism is just the application of that basic skepticism to the domain of religion, but that's really it. It's not the only domain it applies to. Everything else, including feng-shui, quantum chi crystal pendants, dowsing for landmines, conspiracy theories, or yes unsupportable predictions about the economy. Doubly so when those predictions don't actually happen.
Believing that "business as usual" is going to continue forever while the society/economy you live in collapses around your ears is not "skepticism". It is
idiocy.
Also, sorry, but demanding a free pass with an argument as lame and silly as...
....misrepresenting something as demanding a free pass when they aren't.
I have demanded no "free pass." All I have done is point out that nobody can ever win certain disputes between some sorts of believers and skeptics. That's not "demanding a free pass." It is merely pointing out that some debates are inherently unresolvable, and this is one of them. There are some questions that humans are never going to have a definite answer to and one of them is "Is there any metaphysical basis to spirituality?" It is an interesting question if you like debating such things, but if you think there is an answer everybody will be obliged to accept then you are wrong. You are in no more position to demand everybody disbelieves such things than the religious people are in a position demand everybody believes them.
All I am saying is "let's stick to the sorts of things we may actually have some chance of moving forwards on", and that means the economics, politics and science of what is currently happening in the world.
"it is also silly and pathetic to become obsessed with demolishing the belief system of other people who are choosing to live their lives as though their lives are real" is just that: lame and silly.
Nobody is starting an inquisition to make you align to any particular thinking mode. As long as it's just your own belief system, I don't think any of us will hunt you down to make it convert to anything else. But if you come here and start a discussion about it...
I did not come here and start a discussion about that. My first post in this thread made it crystal clear that that was NOT what I wanted to talk about. I have since then done everything possible to avoid talking about it, but this has proven impossible because most of the people here want to do exactly what you say they don't do: "hunt me down and convert me." That's what's really going on here, and it is given away by your use of the term "free pass." You are hinting at "we know you really believe there's something mystical going on here, and we have no intention of letting you get away with it", regardless of the fact that I keep telling people that this is not what matters, and that they should be concentrating on what is actually going on in the real world in 2012.
And no, just trying to pack it as "raising awareness" is not going to cut it. It's only raising awareness if you can also reasonably support it as a real thing that you're raising awareness to. I don't see you doing any of that.
I am more than happy to discuss the contents of the film, Hans. It is not me who doesn't want to do this.
You're trying to claim a one way street from which to preach directly the conclusions, and nobody should challenge your baseless assertions. WTH are you? The Pope? The Dalai Lama?
Basically: if you can't take the heat, nobody asked you to come into the kitchen in the first place.
This is not "the kitchen." It's a
kindergarten.
Man it looked so nice on the wall.
