So, how 'bout that voter fraud, eh?

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Illuminator
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Jul 24, 2001
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So, the minions of Acorn have succeeded in defrauding the American people and foisting Barack Obama upon us. Where is the outrage from FOX News? Where are the denunciations from the McCain campaign? Where are the demands for congressional investigations? WHERE IS THE OUTRAGE?

Why, it's almost as if the whole "voter fraud" conspiracy was just a bunch of made up nonsense the GOP ginned up to hassle poor and black voters. And that couldn't be true!

Seriously, we got a bunch of garbage about voter fraud, and how ACORN was going to steal the election, etc, but as soon as the actual election is held, all of those accusations are just sort of, forgotten...
 
Well.. some have seized on this, but not very enthusiastically from what I've seen (haven't checked around the sewers of Freeperland or anything). For the most part, no, you don't hear much about that any more.
 
Wasn't the election bought and paid for by the GOP? What happened to Diebold? What happened to the vast right wing conspiracy? Personally I think it was all BS but you gotta admit, the BS coming from the right wing is ever so much more interesting.
 
Voter fraud... ACORN... stolen/bought election...

Yeah, not so much. Meh.

Curiously, the right-wing nutjobs pushing this stuff never put forth the possibility that is most obvious and correct - that they'll lose because most people in the country think their ideas suck.

Guess the truth hurts too much.
 
Wasn't the election bought and paid for by the GOP? What happened to Diebold? What happened to the vast right wing conspiracy? Personally I think it was all BS but you gotta admit, the BS coming from the right wing is ever so much more interesting.

Agreed. All the ranting on my side of the fence about "I hope the GOP doesn't steal this one, too!" got on my nerves. What idiocy.

While left-wing conspiracies come across as kind of whiny, the right-wing conspiracies are waaaaay off the deep end. Right-wing CT is much more entertaining, because they usually work in the anti-Christ somewhere - and things are always so much better with Satan in the mix :)
 
The election was just not close enough for any of the hypothetical voter fraud tactics to work, so it does not make sense to complain.
 
The election was just not close enough for any of the hypothetical voter fraud tactics to work, so it does not make sense to complain.

Exactly. If it had come down to one or two states, then the GOP would have dug in their heels and thrown everything they had into these bogus 'voter fraud' claims. We would have been seeing recounts and court cases until next May.

But since the smackdown they got on Tuesday was so broad-based and obvious, they know they have no shot at making such claims stick. Any kind of challenge now would just make them look stupid.

Which shows you that it was nothing more than a cynical political ploy all along. No substance to the claims at all, because if there were real substance they'd be fighting.

Why am I not surprised? :rolleyes:
 
All of the left-wing radio shows have been pushing the idea that there was a fix in but that there was only some much that flipping the random vote could do. They emphasized that massive voter turn-out could make it impossible to steal the election.

Whether true or not, it sure energized the Democratic base to go out and show the GOP what-for.

There are reports circulating about the left-wing press that some of the ES&S machines have been giving faulty read-outs, most notably in the Franken/Coleman contest. It might be interesting to see what the almost inevitable re-count turns up, especially if they go the route that Washington did in the Gregoire/Rossi mess in 2004, and demand a manual count.

(I do not recommend investing any money in electronic voting machine manufacturers any time soon.)
 
Fraud is only going to make a difference in states where the count is very close, say <5000-10000 votes or something. Obama's states won were all pretty convincing I thought.

Barak legitimately won this thing. And handily. Taking away fraud from either side, even all of it, would have not made a difference in this result. And I feel it's best when it goes this way, where one person or the other wins his states resoundingly, so that fraud is a non-factor. Decided by the people themselves, with whatever cheating either side may or may not have done being a minimal influence, if any at all. Decided by the people, legitimately.

I think you are premature to suggest it was all a big ploy. There were investigations going on in many states, and I'm certain will hear more details about things over the coming months, and I hope that any legitimate problems found, on either side, are punished, and reform of some kind can take place without disenfranchising anyone.
 
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I think you are premature to suggest it was all a big ploy. There were investigations going on in many states, and I'm certain will hear more details about things over the coming months, and I hope that any legitimate problems found, on either side, are punished, and reform of some kind can take place without disenfranchising anyone.

But the investigations were part of the ploy. Lots of press was thrown around on the ACORN investigations, even though there is no evidence of ACORN being involved in vote fraud. It made ACORN look bad, and gave the GOP an excuse to push for voter IDs and poll challenges, which was what they were after in the first place.

I am sure wingnuts will be pushing the “ACORN investigations” meme, long after the investigators finish up and quietly announce there was nothing there in the first place. Scream the accusation, whisper the retraction…
 
Whether true or not, it sure energized the Democratic base to go out and show the GOP what-for.

Which means that the Dems, for all their hatred of Karl Rove, have paid him the sincerest form of flattery...they imitated him.
 
And I remain unchanged in my opinion that some officials in both parties will get away with whatever they think they can.
Leaving ACORN Out of it, you have plenty of examples of Democratic shenniagans in past electionsto balance GOP shennigans.
 
Which shows you that it was nothing more than a cynical political ploy all along. No substance to the claims at all, because if there were real substance they'd be fighting.

I forget which senate race it was but loooong-faced Dana Bash was describing a "placeholder lawsuit" put in place by the GOP somewhere just before the election that they could use, and I assume inject more complaints into their case, once the counting started...

I had never heard of a "placeholder lawsuit" before, and it struck my Canadian ears as something of an alien concept.

Shouldn't there really be no such thing as a "placeholder" lawsuit?? Either you got the stuff in your lawsuit ready to go or you dont!

Maybe someone versed in the arcane details of American litigation can help me out..;)
 
There does seem to be something up in Alaska, where with a popular governor on the main ticket and a controversial senate race, actual voters dropped 14% from 2004.
 
I'm guessing that the Right isn't carrying on about ACORN for a couple reasons...

1) they'd have a really hard time passing off REGISTRATION fraud as VOTER fraud

2) not even the loons at FreeRepublic are dumb enough to claim that ACORN could account for a 7-point Obama victory in the popular vote.
 
But the investigations were part of the ploy. Lots of press was thrown around on the ACORN investigations, even though there is no evidence of ACORN being involved in vote fraud. It made ACORN look bad, and gave the GOP an excuse to push for voter IDs and poll challenges, which was what they were after in the first place.

I am sure wingnuts will be pushing the “ACORN investigations” meme, long after the investigators finish up and quietly announce there was nothing there in the first place. Scream the accusation, whisper the retraction…


The investigations were part of the ploy? What, are you suggesting that the different police agnecies, FBI, or whoever else was involved, was actually in on this thing? So did Bush somehow really coherce these agencies to investigate to push the issue? Seriously? Do you realize that sounds like a ridiculous conspiracy theory?

I live in Milwaukee, and was first hand witness to the "smokes for votes" and the case where the sons of an Alderman and Congresswoman (IIRC) slashed tires at a Republican "get out the vote" station to keep them from being able to get around and pickup people to take them to vote. It was reported locally by our papers and TV stations. Vote fraud is real and does happen. I do not deny the possibility that people on the Right engage in it as well, and I find that equally deplorable.

But I think that this idea that it's all just created as a smokescreen to disenfranchise certain voters is a ridiculously naive position. I seriously do not mean any disrepect here.. but you are swallowing the Democratic line hook, line and sinker. I can't understand why anyone at all would not want to take seriously the issue of voter fraud. It affects every single one of us. Every fraudulent vote cancels out a legitimate one. It should be investigate, and if there are ways to reform the system without disenfranchising people, it should be done.

I also laugh at the idea that having to show an idea is such a terrible injustice. The very people the left consistently claims may be disenfranchised must have some form of ID to conduct virtually any other business they do in life. To do any kind banking.. cash checks, take out payday loans.. to puchase cigarettes or alchohol. There are tons of things that you need them for and I don't believe that there are substantial numbers of people who do not have one. And I'm all for a way to make sure they have one, 100%, if such regulations were ever enforced.

I'm sick of this strawman that the right only complains about vote fraud as some evil plan to keep minorities from voting. It's reprehensible to even suggest such a thing. Such "right wing = evil" black and white thinking is completely intolerant and every bit as flawed thinking as what the people on the right are acused of engaging in. It's time for people on both sides to pull their head out of the sands, and stop thinking in "us vs them" mentality, and demonizing the opposition constantly.

But as I said earlier, none of this really matters in an election of this sort, where the people have spoken.. and so strongly. It only affects outcomes in razor thin elections.. like 2000, and to a smaller extent 2004.
 
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