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Split Thread Skepticism and Vegetarianism

Ah, thanks for that. I'm sure this is basic enough info, but I hadn't been aware, mainly because I never gave it a thought. This: that hens lay eggs anyway, no matter what --- unlike cows and milk, for instance.
Well, if you want to think of it in a way that may make you not want to eat eggs ... it's basically like the human femaile menstrual cycle, just more often! Release an ovum, doesn't get used, get's expelled.

Chickens lay eggs so often because that's what we've bred them to do. "Wild" equivalents, like wild red junglefowl - the ancestors to our domestic chickens - typically lay a clutch of 8 or so eggs over 1-2 weeks in spring.
 
Well, if you want to think of it in a way that may make you not want to eat eggs ... it's basically like the human femaile menstrual cycle, just more often! Release an ovum, doesn't get used, get's expelled.

As you can see, I've been thinking my way through this. Getting informed, and forming my opinions as I go along, as opposed to operating by and defending some past position. And this is the position on this that this discussion, in this thread, has led me to:

I'm perfectly fine with eating eggs if I had access to eggs from a small chicken-breeder, like you and @novaphile, who deal strictly in rescue chickens, and treat them fully humanely, and also give them a fully secure "retirement" in the years remaining to them after they stop laying. However, I'm not really in a position to (or, to be more precisely honest, not really willing to put in the effort to) bring up chickens myself. And buying eggs from the market, even if those eggs came from a commercial farm that deals in rescues and treats its hens humanely throughout their life, is still not something I'm comfortable with, given the after-market factor you yourself brought into the discussion, given that at commercial scales it becomes fully relevant, as it is not at smaller scales like yours.


...And yes, I'm aware of the double standards here, as I type this out. Not eating sentient creatures slaughtered to please my palate and maybe keep me healthy, that is one thing. But this quibbling about after-markets, in order to be consistent, should surely lead me to also stay away from diary as well: and yet I'm not doing that now, and don't plan to immediately start doing that. ...I acknowledge those double standards: but I don't see a comfortable resolution to those double standards in loosening those standards for eggs. I'll either live with those double standards, with clear knowledge of what I'm doing; or, hopefully, going forward resolve that inconsistency by giving up dairy as well.


...And again, it's cool what you're doing. As you can see from my somewhat involved post so far, I can see no reason for me not to eat eggs sourced the way you source them (assuming your egg consumption is limited to just what you yourself get from your own hens). It's very cool that you're going to all this trouble to give rescue chickens a home and a good life.


Chickens lay eggs so often because that's what we've bred them to do. "Wild" equivalents, like wild red junglefowl - the ancestors to our domestic chickens - typically lay a clutch of 8 or so eggs over 1-2 weeks in spring.

ok, right. Yep, got to know some interesting things about hens and chickens and eggs in this thread! Including, for instance, the "pottery eggs" that @SteveAitch brought up, and afterwards you as well. And of course, most importantly the fact that hens always lay eggs, as you say more like human (female) menstrual cycle eggs rather than human fetuses --- and unlike cows, that have to be actively manipulated in order to get them to produce milk. That's a pretty basic thing that I hadn't been aware of!
 
My personal view is that as long as you do the best you can, within your own framework and limitations, then fair play to you.

I suppose I could go completely vegan like Mrs Don but at the moment it would be too inconvenient for me. My desire for a cake on a bike ride or a piece of cheese is more important to me than the welfare of the animals who provide them. That said, I no longer consume other dairy products (instead I have plant milk and yoghurt) and I don't buy eggs.

I'm certain that I'm doing more for the planet and for animal welfare than I did when I had meat for 10 or more meals a week.

Maybe in time I'll give up cheese and I'll restrict myself to vegan cakes.
 
I only finally gave up dairy about 18 months ago. I was having a discussion with a friend - nothing at all to do with veganism - and she said something along the lines of "well, what are you doing now that you wish you weren't doing?"

My mind immediately responded "eating dairy".

So I stopped. Same day.

It's been interesting watching a "transformation" with cheese, which I love. Vegan cheeses were universally bad, but there's actually a few that are ... well ... OK.

But what's transformed over the past 18 months is my expectation of cheese in a meal. A vegan pizza or beans and cheese on toast or whatever ... now I expect it to taste (and feel) the way vegan cheeses do. 2 years ago it was "uggh" now it's just the way it is and I'm fine with it.

I'm certain that I'm doing more for the planet and for animal welfare than I did when I had meat for 10 or more meals a week.

I've noticed in the vegan community there's a stronger movement towards encouraging and supporting this now. Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.

So ... Well done! Keep it up!👍
 

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