Simple Challenge For Bigfoot Supporters

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So...is there a difference in the meanings of these two statements...which use those 2 phrases...

"So far, I am not aware of any evidence which indicates with any degree of likeliness, however small, that Bigfoot creatures exist....anywhere in the world."

and your translation of it.....

he said "no evidence has ever convinced me, so far."

I can't help but notice that the word "worthless" isn't in any of those sentences... so I'm wondering what your point is. There is, of course, a difference between the two. One is shorter and worded in a way that I thought you could understand.

So...."reliable" is determined by whether or not a piece of evidence can be "easily" attributable to something OTHER than Bigfoot.....

Well, it's useless talking to you then, if you can't understand even that.
 
For anyone who might be interested I would like to draw attention to a discussion at the Search for Bigfoot forum in which believers of bigfoot and subsequent Gigantopithecus origin ideas attempt to reconcile their beliefs when presented with the case of Australia's version of bigfoot, the yowie. It is a keen example of the inherent flaws that surface when proponents try to base their beliefs on sound reasoning. Particularily of interest is when footers decide to discount the case for yowie in its evident incompatibility with their ideas. It really does illustrate glaring inconsistencies in some of the central arguments for bigfoot, IMO. Elsewhere on the same board Homo Erectus vs Gigantopithecus debates also produce similar flaws.

Bf on island continents/bf's origin.

How you got that out of those debates is beyond me. Ray's in ill health and we're trying to be charitable, but his ideas are really without merit. T. Lancaster proposed an idea, and while most of us aren't into Yowie's, it was interesting to check out the land bridges.

Evidence of Giganto and the earliest yet possible Orangutan ancestor have been found in Vietnam, so it's not impossible some Orang relative could have managed to get to Australia. I don't go with devolved humans, but Australia seems to have been inhabited by humans some 140,000 years ago. (I'm not sure how confirmed that is.)

Homo erectus and its immediate ancestor used and made tools for millions of years. It's not likely such a skill would be lost. Chimpanzees and Orangutans haven't lost their toolmaking skills, apparently.

For me, the interesting thing about these debates is the sidetrips.

Wikipedia's info on Bili/Bondo apes was just soundly trounced by Apeman on BFF. Apeman (or should I say "Dr. Apeman") is a bono fide ape expert rather recently returned from Africa and is a good example of someone who is by no means a "woo" taking an interest in the BF phenomenon.

If you join SFB and post 100 times you can read what another bono fide expert has to say in the protected forum. That might be more productive than just snooping on the board. Of course, any fights with SY would be dealt with "swiftly", but I'm sure you can post 100 times without getting into it.

I know Bill can't read this, but in an earlier post he asked why the BCM individuals didn't walk on the road. In fact they did. The distances are given in a book I don't have on hand right now. The individuals probably weren't walking together.

Another poster mentioned foraging in groups. Giganto was likely an Orang relative, and while Orangs do sometimes get together in groups they mostly range singly. An omnivore with meat in the diet ranging alone or in small family groups (as sasquatches seem to do) wouldn't leave much evidence of their presence.
 
For anyone who might be interested I would like to draw attention to a discussion at the Search for Bigfoot forum in which believers of bigfoot and subsequent Gigantopithecus origin ideas attempt to reconcile their beliefs when presented with the case of Australia's version of bigfoot, the yowie. It is a keen example of the inherent flaws that surface when proponents try to base their beliefs on sound reasoning. Particularily of interest is when footers decide to discount the case for yowie in its evident incompatibility with their ideas. It really does illustrate glaring inconsistencies in some of the central arguments for bigfoot, IMO. Elsewhere on the same board Homo Erectus vs Gigantopithecus debates also produce similar flaws.

Bf on island continents/bf's origin.

It looks like that general section of SFB has now been removed from public view. I did read that thread when it was available.

I'm not sure if you are thinking what I am about this Yowie thing. It reminds me of the Huntster vs. Baby D. debate on New York Bigfoot... which never happened. Bigfooters have something of a dilemma if they try to argue that BFs (or any other cryptid wild biped primate) don't really exist where credible eyewitness reports are coming from. When Aussies describe Yowie encounters they must be entertained the same as Bigfoot encounters. If the Yowie isn't there, then what the hell are these people seeing?
 
An omnivore with meat in the diet ranging alone or in small family groups (as sasquatches seem to do) wouldn't leave much evidence of their presence.

Sounds like you are describing something like a bear. Pick your own weight and caloric needs for your hypothetical Bigfoot. Now imagine a bear of that equivalence. So why does that bear leave much evidence of its presence, but the equal Bigfoot does not?
 
Greg, I've been watching that BFF thread you started on snow tracks. I'm not really surprised by the various responses. Some of the answers seem to be a long way of saying, "searching for BF snow tracks is a waste of time and effort". I think that's some kind of argumentative tactic that allows the general excuse of non-confirmability to remain valid. Much of Bigfootery is about establishing your own list of excuses. It's all a big game that Bigfooters play with each other and with skeptics. But some of the responses in that thread seem quite resonable.

I'm having trouble getting a handle on how Bigfooters explain the wintertime Bigfoot. If it doesn't hibernate, it has to eat. It could hunt and forage in winter, but that would leave it vulnerable to sightings and tracking. If it caches food for the winter - how does it do that? Everything that it stores is going to be frozen. Do they just gnaw on a deer leg popsicle when they get hungry? Would they have to deal with rotting foods?
 
Sounds like you are describing something like a bear. Pick your own weight and caloric needs for your hypothetical Bigfoot. Now imagine a bear of that equivalence. So why does that bear leave much evidence of its presence, but the equal Bigfoot does not?

I don't have to imagine the bear; I lived in bear country. I saw a black bear eating blackberries once, but there was no sign it had been there next time I went by. A bear (presumably) tore up a friend's campsite, but that was probably the most evidence one ever left on my land. There were occasional tracks at the top of the old logging road, but the boar seemed able to associate with a female who ranged near Blue Lake with her cubs from time to time without any of us human residents being aware of it. (He must have, or there wouldn't have been cubs.)

Bears don't leave much in the way of sign in that area (which is just a tiny piece of the PNW) and there would be far fewer sasquatches.

Even deer don't leave a lot of sign, common as they are, unless they're really over-populated. There was a resident cougar, but I never saw it or found a kill. I did find prints in snow.
 
You missed us skeptics, didn't you,Lu. :)
How you got that out of those debates is beyond me.
IMO, for anyone who isn't working on the presumption that bigfoots, yetis, yowie, etc are real the flaws are readily apparent. Elsewhere, your comments the on Dr. Farrenbach there are quite interesting. I say that because they seem in contrast to your support of him here.

ETA: Oh, and would you look at that. It would seem that my link to the thread is no good anymore. I wonder what happened?
Ray's in ill health and we're trying to be charitable, but his ideas are really without merit.
That's very kind. Who, specifically, do you mean by we and how are you being charitable? Also, how are his ideas without merit?
T. Lancaster proposed an idea, and while most of us aren't into Yowie's, it was interesting to check out the land bridges.
Again, who's us and why aren't you into yowies? T. Lancaster made a very good point which we are unfortunately, at least for the time being, unable to read. In short it was that gigantopithecus can be hypothesized by proponents to have made it into NA via the Berring Land Bridge but no such land bridge was there for it to traverse to Australia and yet there the yowie is in all its cryptic glory (with at least a giant lizard for company).

Some links for yowie (Gigantopithecus australis):

wiki entry.

Australian Yowie Research.

The Australian Yowie Research Center.

The Yowie File.

Yowies| Fact or Fiction By Professor Gary Opit.
If you join SFB and post 100 times you can read what another bono fide expert has to say in the protected forum. That might be more productive than just snooping on the board. Of course, any fights with SY would be dealt with "swiftly", but I'm sure you can post 100 times without getting into it.
Snooping and fighting. My, I haven't heard that tone for... oh wait, not that long.;) Yes, LAL, I'm quit sure I'd last 100 posts just fine. Somehow, I can't help but feel that the less skeptics there the happier most would be. Anyway, if I was a bono fide ape expert with reliable evidence to show for sasquatch, I don't think I'd make accessible to only people that post on one forum 100 times. But that's not what you said.
 
You know, aside from the torn up campsite, the tracks and seeing it outside my window, I don't think there is any proof for the existance of bears. Well, that or the captive bears, the numerous dead bears, the DNA samples, the bear feces, the bears captured on non-fuzzy film.

But aside from that, it's just like bigfoot.
 
What would you mean by "lost" ?

No longer used.

Orangutans split off from the line 12mya, but they make and use tools as chimps do. The skill must be very old in the Great Ape line, possibly present in a common ancestor.

To get to a human population that didn't make tools you'd have to go back so far they'd no longer be human.
 
You learn something every day. I had no idea Bigfoot was migratory.

Actually, Bob Titmus tracked a group that was moving seasonally to take advantage of foodstuffs. If that's migration, they propably do migrate even in the PNW. In the winter and early spring of 1969 at least two individuals moved to lowerr elevations in Skamania County due to an exceptionally heavy snowpack. They left trackways and other sign and there were sightings, of course). That's in the PNW too.

Meaning #4:the periodic passage of groups of animals (especially birds or fishes) from one region to another for feeding or breeding

http://www.answers.com/topic/migration

Biscardi's a different matter.
 
It's utterly amazing. Everything you can possibly know about a species is apparently known about bigfoot. All without one bit of evidence that the beastie actually even exists!

Apparently, more is known about bigfoot than about beasties we actually know existed. Like Neanderthals or Smilodons....

It's uncanny how bigfoot researchers have filled in blanks that cannot be filled in for other beasties...
 
Two pages or so passed and the situation remains the same. The questions posed by the skeptics remain unanswered while the evasions, obfuscations, semantic games, ad homs and unbacked claims continue...

And yowies popped out... There's an amazing similarity between bigfeet and yowies that few people seem to have noticed. Both have their problems with a Wallace line!:p

Synchronicity?:jaw-dropp
 
You missed us skeptics, didn't you,Lu. :)

No.

IMO, for anyone who isn't working on the presumption that bigfoots, yetis, yowie, etc are real the flaws are readily apparent. Elsewhere, your comments the on Dr. Farrenbach there are quite interesting. I say that because they seem in contrast to your support of him here.

I support him, but I think he was way off base on the Carter/Coy thing. But then it seems Donskoy and Bayanov were taken in as well.

Ray Crowe was apparently unaware of later events concerning that hair sample.

ETA: Oh, and would you look at that. It would seem that my link to the thread is no good anymore. I wonder what happened?

I have no idea. It works for me. I just read your post a little while ago and I certainly didn't "report" it. Of course an SFB administrator might be reading the board.

That's very kind. Who, specifically, do you mean by we and how are you being charitable? Also, how are his ideas without merit?Again, who's us and why aren't you into yowies? T. Lancaster made a very good point which we are unfortunately, at least for the time being, unable to read. In short it was that gigantopithecus can be hypothesized by proponents to have made it into NA via the Berring Land Bridge but no such land bridge was there for it to traverse to Australia and yet there the yowie is in all its cryptic glory (with at least a giant lizard for company).

I meant some of the posters, but the board's owner seems to be reining him in. He's supportive of Mary Green and that's enough to make him persona non grata on that board. The Homo erectus idea just has nothing to support it. I about choked on my coffee when he tried to use hair samples coming back human as proof it's erectus. I don't think he'll last long.

Snooping and fighting. My, I haven't heard that tone for... oh wait, not that long.;) Yes, LAL, I'm quit sure I'd last 100 posts just fine. Somehow, I can't help but feel that the less skeptics there the happier most would be.

They're welcome if they don't cause trouble. It's a different sort of board.

Several boards have put a stop to mining of the information. That's not directed just against sceptics, BTW.

Anyway, if I was a bono fide ape expert with reliable evidence to show for sasquatch, I don't think I'd make accessible to only people that post on one forum 100 times. But that's not what you said.

It's not an ape expert and the board's owner is determined not to drag him into any fights. I didn't make the rules.

I haven't used that tone since I left, but I'm back here now. Same old brawl, I see. :)
 
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