Merged Should I have a VPN?

[SpuriusMaximus]

Read that again. It doesn't store information when you exit the session... but it has access to information from the previous session (and in my experience, from where you were since you have used the device)? That don't track.

Not from the previous private sessions, it doesn't. That history and cookies and cache are deleted when you exit the private session. It has access to the history and cache from your previous NON-private sessions. (But not the cookies.)

Of course, law enforcement can try to undelete the files, or even easier serve the ISP with a demand for the logs of everything and everyone you've interacted with online, but I was talking about ads. If you're more paranoid than Google remembering your searches when it serves you ads, try Tor.

 

[Thermal]

It's not about what info it has about your history, it's about the browser shares of that history, both in the session, and in storing a record for future sessions.

I want my browser to remember who I am, and the history of our adventures together, even in incognito mode.

What I don't want from incognito mode is for the site I'm visiting to not remember who I am, and for the browser to not store cookies or logs or anything other records of the incognito session, that could be read in the future.

That tracks just fine. All that there do be trackin' jes' fine, ol' hoss fella boychik me lad.

What makes you so sure that the anonymity promise is being honored? I see legal 'outs' for them in their T&Cs, and no guardrails to stop abuses. They seem to be effective against the most crude privacy breaches, but I am not convinced there is any privacy protection than a small access fee to the Goog would circumvent.

Eta: in short, we know they *do* save information, your ISP (and whoever they share it with) *does* see your movements, and the T&Cs *can* allow virtually unlimited access to this data that was definitely saved. What is your confidence based on?

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

What makes you so sure that the anonymity promise is being honored?

I don't think I've seen any actual anonymity promise from any browser or VPN. As you've said, the ISP knows who you are anyway. It just ignores your previous cookies, which you can test yourself quite easily by trying to log into this site in private mode, and that all the history/cookies/cache from the private session are deleted when you exit. Which, again, you can test quite easily yourself.

 

[Thermal]

Not from the previous private sessions, it doesn't. That history and cookies and cache are deleted when you exit the private session.

Negative. I've fired up the occasional private browsing window and addresses autocompleted from months-old private browsing sessions. Seeing that was what made me start questioning their claims of data deletion.

It has access to the history and cache from your previous NON-private sessions. (But not the cookies.)

I've found the opposite. The private window had no idea what I'd been up to in regular browsing, but remembered everything I've done in incognito.

Of course, law enforcement can try to undelete the files, or even easier serve the ISP with a demand for the logs of everything and everyone you've interacted with online, but I was talking about ads.

And since we know the T&Cs allow for google/ad acess if its 'legit', but we dont know what they consider 'legit', how much faith should we really have in this?

If you're more paranoid than Google remembering your searches when it serves you ads, try Tor.

I had it nearly 20 years ago (late 2000s, and I'm like 90% sure I have a 2008 vintage Bitcoin wallet on one hard drive that crashed). It made browsing clumsy, and as I already said, blocked me out of many sites till I signed in with credentials they recognized (so much for anonymity).

TOR and others have a lite version now, not for going on the Dark Web but just regular usage. I might install that, but don't want to go through every site not recognizing me and going through the sign in/age verification jazz.

But times change fast, and I'm not sure where the tech is at today.

 

[theprestige]

What makes you so sure that the anonymity promise is being honored?

The question of whether the promise is being honored is entirely separate from the question you asked, which was whether the promise even makes sense.

My position is that the promise does make sense, and that you misunderstood it.

Once you actually understand the promise, you can move on to testing it.

 

[Thermal]

The question of whether the promise is being honored is entirely separate from the question you asked, which was whether the promise even makes sense.

My position is that the promise does make sense, and that you misunderstood it.

Once you actually understand the promise, you can move on to testing it.

...

If the promise boldly claims to be self-invalidating, it doesn't make sense (which, looking back on the exchange, I didn't even really say so I don't know what you are talking about).

How can a service promise anonymity while it proudly states you will not be anonymous to the very people you were promised to be anonymous to? That does not, to borrow your phrase, make sense.

 

[Thermal]

Cleaning up my computer conglomeration, and Avast recommends a VPN. Pluses and/or minuses appreciated.

Just landed on the beginning of the thread and noticed this.

Why in the name of all that is holy are you still using Avast if you have the most remote concerns about privacy?

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Commercial break?

 

[Mongrel]

I don't think I've seen any actual anonymity promise from any browser or VPN

At least one has proven that they stuck to a "No Logging" policy and I haven't seen anything to think they've changed their position

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

Negative. I've fired up the occasional private browsing window and addresses autocompleted from months-old private browsing sessions. Seeing that was what made me start questioning their claims of data deletion.

Sounds like you're using a crappy browser. Try Mozilla, then.

 

[Thermal]

Sounds like you're using a crappy browser. Try Mozilla, then.

I'm talking about Firefox. It's the browser I have used for many years.

From their private browsing support page:

"Windows may still be viewed by sites, search engines, internet providers, or your employer (if you’re on a work/school network or computer).
A Private Window doesn't make you anonymous online.
It doesn't hide your IP address or your location."

It goes on, saying it will 'ask' sites not to harvest your data. The answer to that query can be "yeah, no".

Bottom line is pretty much what they spell out- private browsing will do about as much for anonymity as Dick Grayson wearing a Lone Ranger mask and a pair of Speedos. It will stop the user's of that device from seeing what you were up to (unless, you know... they open private browsing and look at where you've been on the address bar, lol).

Mozilla boldly says you are browsing anonymously in private mode, and your session will leave no traces- until you read their support page where they say "JK, you're not anonymous and we store plenty, as well as anywhere you visit".

 

[Thermal]

Here's something I'm not clear on: using incognito, the sites I visit can see my IP address and what I'm looking at, and they can presumably store that information, and cross reference it to my IP browsing in normal mode. Do I have that right?

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I visit where I wish. FBI doesn't want me.

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

Weird. Firefox doesn't do anything for me even remotely like what you describe. It certainly doesn't complete URLs for sites I've ONLY visited in private mode. I just tried, just to confirm. Maybe you should just wipe out your history?

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

Here's something I'm not clear on: using incognito, the sites I visit can see my IP address and what I'm looking at, and they can presumably store that information, and cross reference it to my IP browsing in normal mode. Do I have that right?

Yes.

 

[Thermal]

Weird. Firefox doesn't do anything for me even remotely like what you describe. It certainly doesn't complete URLs for sites I've ONLY visited in private mode. I just tried, just to confirm.

There are settings available. What got me was enabling the autocomplete for websites visited in private, and ones jumped up from.months before. I was like "wtf, you said you didn't store this ◊◊◊◊?"

But as I said, things change quickly, and maybe they've altered that since I hit it. They change ◊◊◊◊ by the minute now.

 

[Thermal]

Yes.

Then it's not even nominally anonymous

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

There are settings available. What got me was enabling the autocomplete for websites visited in private, and ones jumped up from.months before. I was like "wtf, you said you didn't store this ◊◊◊◊?"

But as I said, things change quickly, and maybe they've altered that since I hit it. They change ◊◊◊◊ by the minute now.

Well, if you enabled that, then that's on you. Of course it will store stuff you ASKED IT TO.

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

Then it's not even nominally anonymous

Neither is a VPN, since it propagates your cookies and everything else, even if you go through (just) a VPN. For example, I'm still logged into Crunchyroll or for that matter this site, even if I go through a VPN that says I'm in the USA.

 

[Thermal]

Well, if you enabled that, then that's on you. Of course it will store stuff you ASKED IT TO.

You're not following the linear time thing. I know, it's tricky.

*First*, it was set to delete browsing data. *Much later*, the feature was enabled, and the 'we totally don't store this' data miraculously reappeared. It was absolutely being stored, despite the assurances that it wasn't.