Schrodinger's Rapist: When is uncritical thought ok?

[Professor Yaffle]

Where on earth did anyone even so much as suggest that one man in six is a rapist? I thought it was a typo at first, but you repeated it several times in that post.

 

[bookitty]

You obviously don't understand the difference between rape and inappropriate behaviour.

And you don't understand that rape can start with inappropriate behavior.

If you don't understand what I'm telling you then so be it. I don't believe you have any intention of listening, you just want to push your agenda, and that's fine. But don't expect anyone to believe 1 in 6 men on the bus are potential rapists to the strangers they meet.

She says 1 in 60, not 1 in 6. 1 in 60 isn't bad odds for any kind of anti-social behavior. For women this includes sexual harassment and the possibility of sexual assault.

My agenda is the same is the OP's - to foster empathy. The article is not about being raped. It is about being aware of the possibility on daily basis and how that awareness can color your interactions with strangers. The article asks that men consider this awareness when approaching women. That they respect a woman's right to set her own risk tolerance. It asks that they back off if a woman does not seem interested.

 

[Furcifer]

Where on earth did anyone even so much as suggest that one man in six is a rapist? I thought it was a typo at first, but you repeated it several times in that post.

"While you may assume that none of the men you know are rapists, I can assure you that at least one is. Consider: if every rapist commits an average of ten rapes (a horrifying number, isn’t it?) then the concentration of rapists in the population is still a little over one in sixty. "

She is working from the basis that 1 in 6 men are rapists, then saying maybe a rapist commits 10 rapes.

If every rapist only commits 1 rape, thereby becoming a rapist 1 in 6 men are by her poor use of stats a rapist.

 

[TraneWreck]

No, were considering the actual statistics compiled over decades to come to the conclusion that rapists don't approach women on the bus.

What don't you understand?

Did you actually read the article? At no point did she ever even imply that. You're running off in bizarre directions that have nothing to do with anything.

ETA: I might add that you're the one trolling this tread. You came in late and have only derailed the real discussion. Perhaps you should read both threads and get a clue as to what is being discussed?

Nice try.

 

[TraneWreck]

"While you may assume that none of the men you know are rapists, I can assure you that at least one is. Consider: if every rapist commits an average of ten rapes (a horrifying number, isn’t it?) then the concentration of rapists in the population is still a little over one in sixty. "

She is working from the basis that 1 in 6 men are rapists, then saying maybe a rapist commits 10 rapes.

If every rapist only commits 1 rape, thereby becoming a rapist 1 in 6 men are by her poor use of stats a rapist.

Haha, nope. 1 in 6 women GET raped (and to be technical, it's actually sexually assaulted). The average rapist/offender commits 10 offenses, thus somewhere around 1 in 60 men are rapists. She makes this very clear. Of course, that's still a horrifying number.

Although given your history, only being off by a factor of 10 is pretty good.

 

[Professor Yaffle]

"While you may assume that none of the men you know are rapists, I can assure you that at least one is. Consider: if every rapist commits an average of ten rapes (a horrifying number, isn’t it?) then the concentration of rapists in the population is still a little over one in sixty. "

She is working from the basis that 1 in 6 men are rapists, then saying maybe a rapist commits 10 rapes.

If every rapist only commits 1 rape, thereby becoming a rapist 1 in 6 men are by her poor use of stats a rapist.

That makes absolutely NO sense at all. She starts from the proposition that one in every 6 women will be raped at some point in their life. She then says if that if each rapist commits 10 rapes (I assume she means rapes against 10 different women), on average, that makes approximately one man in every 60 a rapist.

 

[Furcifer]

And you don't understand that rape can start with inappropriate behavior.

The stupidest thing I've ever heard, there's no doubt rape has to start with inappropriate touching.

She says 1 in 60, not 1 in 6. 1 in 60 isn't bad odds for any kind of anti-social behavior. For women this includes sexual harassment and the possibility of sexual assault.

Her assumption is 1 in 6, you don't understand statistics. Otherwise you are saying if a man commits 9 rapes he isn't a rapist.

My agenda is the same is the OP's - to foster empathy. The article is not about being raped.

Really?

Really?

Then she's the dumbest author ever, to name her article not about rape "Schrodinger's Rapist"

 

[TraneWreck]

Her assumption is 1 in 6, you don't understand statistics. Otherwise you are saying if a man commits 9 rapes he isn't a rapist.

Stundie.

 

[vwgub]

I haven't read the entire thread (like most rape threads it's moving fast) but what I got from the OP and link is that she isn't just afraid that men might be rapists but that all men are rapists until proven otherwise. The problem I have with that is you have to prove that you are not a rapist. And how the hell do you do that?

 

[bookitty]

The stupidest thing I've ever heard, there's no doubt rape has to start with inappropriate touching.




Her assumption is 1 in 6, you don't understand statistics. Otherwise you are saying if a man commits 9 rapes he isn't a rapist.



Really?

Really?

Then she's the dumbest author ever, to name her article not about rape "Schrodinger's Rapist"

The article is about being aware that there is a possibility of rape. Perhaps you should try reading it in its entirety. Several comments you've made indicate a less than thorough understanding.

 

[Furcifer]

That makes absolutely NO sense at all. She starts from the proposition that one in every 6 women will be raped at some point in their life. She then says if that if each rapist commits 10 rapes (I assume she means rapes against 10 different women), on average, that makes approximately one man in every 60 a rapist.

What did she multiply by 10?


There's nothing to support her statement that a rapist commits 10 rapes. As far as I know a rapist only has to commit 1 rape to be considered a rapist. Short of the actual stat, her base line assumption is that 1 in 6 men are.

 

[Professor Yaffle]

Its a back of the envelope calculation to get from the rate of women who have been assaulted to the rate of men who are rapists. If all rapists only ever committed one rape, your 1 in 6 would be right. I don't know whether her figure of 10, on average is correct but I'm sure its in the right ballpark. I certainly don't think it is 1 and I don't think it is as high as 100. Without any reliable published statistics, I think she's somewhere in the right ballpark.

 

[Furcifer]

Stundie.

Wow, rape is now a conspiracy theory. Brilliant.

 

[bookitty]

I haven't read the entire thread (like most rape threads it's moving fast) but what I got from the OP and link is that she isn't just afraid that men might be rapists but that all men are rapists until proven otherwise. The problem I have with that is you have to prove that you are not a rapist. And how the hell do you do that?

The article actually addresses that. Tips include respecting a woman's space, backing off when she indicates that she would rather not interact with you and being aware of what message your physical appearance might give.

Also, it isn't that all men are rapist until proven otherwise. It's more about the evaluation of potential harm when approached by a stranger. Everyone does this. For women, this evaluation also includes threat of sexual assault.

 

[vwgub]

The article actually addresses that. Tips include respecting a woman's space, backing off when she indicates that she would rather not interact with you and being aware of what message your physical appearance might give.

Also, it isn't that all men are rapist until proven otherwise. It's more about the evaluation of potential harm when approached by a stranger. Everyone does this. For women, this evaluation also includes threat of sexual assault.

Good to know. Thanks.

 

[vwgub]

This makes me wonder why are women so concerned about assault but men aren't? Statistically men are more likely to be physically assaulted than women are. In my personal experience I've been assaulted five times in my life and I'm not outside the norm for my social circle. But I don't worry about it.

 

[TraneWreck]

Wow, rape is now a conspiracy theory. Brilliant.

Good lord, how much silliness can you pack in one thread.

Your nomination is for the irony of sanctimoniously lecturing others on understanding statistics while displaying an awesome failure of that type of reasoning.

If there are 100 hotdogs and the people in Group A eat an average of 10 per person, how many people are there in the group?

 

[TraneWreck]

There's nothing to support her statement that a rapist commits 10 rapes. As far as I know a rapist only has to commit 1 rape to be considered a rapist. Short of the actual stat, her base line assumption is that 1 in 6 men are.

Haha.

The AVERAGE rapist commits 10 offenses. Some commit 1, some commit 19, but the AVERAGE is 10/rapist.

It's not a statement about how "rapist" is defined.

 

[Furcifer]

Its a back of the envelope calculation to get from the rate of women who have been assaulted to the rate of men who are rapists. If all rapists only ever committed one rape, your 1 in 6 would be right. I don't know whether her figure of 10, on average is correct but I'm sure its in the right ballpark. I certainly don't think it is 1 and I don't think it is as high as 100.

No the basis for her assumption is that 1 in 6 are, she makes up a figure of 10 for which she has no evidence.

It's quite clear she "knows it's 1 in 6" then guesses "even if they commit 10 rapes".

Short of knowing the actual figure of how many rapes a rapist commits her assumption is based in the 1 in 6.

 

[vwgub]

Haha.

The AVERAGE rapist commits 10 offenses. Some commit 1, some commit 19, but the AVERAGE is 10/rapist.

It's not a statement about how "rapist" is defined.

To be slightly pedantic wouldn't it be the MEAN rapist not the AVERAGE rapist.

ETA: Never mind either would work. I just think MEAN rapist works better than AVERAGE rapist semantically.