Ed Rob Menard's FOTL Claims

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Note to anyone using FOTL naming conventions in your posts. You can use [noparse] [/noparse] tags to prevent BB code from interpreting combinations of colons and letters as smileys.
 
arayder said:
:David-Wynn: Miller.
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Well, I for one think that anyone who spells their name with a smiley should be granted powers greater than other mere mortals.

Signed,


:D:p:mad::jaw-dropp:boxedin:



SpitfireIX said:
Note to anyone using FOTL naming conventions in your posts. You can use [noparse] [/noparse] tags to prevent BB code from interpreting combinations of colons and letters as smileys.
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Don't you try to govern me! :mad::mad::boxedin::mad:*








*It's a nick name, okay?
 
arayder said:
I noticed the same thing.

The physical manifestation of an insincere, untruthful life is painfully obvious.

You can’t spent a decade telling people they can break the law, lie, cheat and steal without poisoning your body and soul.
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Perhaps Bob should've had a portrait of himself painted and placed in his attic.

Except that he wouldn't have paid the artist...

And he hasn't got his own attic......


Ok, forget what I just said.
 
Perhaps you're just upset Rob is well known infamous, and that you and your troll pals are nobodies in comparison have exposed him for what he is.

FTFY
 
flabio said:
Perhaps you're just upset Rob is well known, and that you and your troll pals are nobodies in comparison.
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Being well known as a con man is very bad thing for the con man, good for the people who might be taken in by his BS
 
flabio said:
Perhaps you're just upset Rob is well known, and that you and your troll pals are nobodies in comparison.
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Even if that were true, it would not automatically follow that Rob's teachings have any merit. They would still be BS. What any of us feels about ourselves has no bearing on the validity of Menard's claims.
 
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Perhaps you're just upset Rob is well known
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I think you will find its Rob who is now upset he is well known. ;)
Unfortunatly for him his MSM debut has now put him in the limelight which will make his snake oil far harder to sell.

"Hey, I have heard about a way you can get rid of debt and be free of statute law by not consenting to it."

"Is that anything to do with that guy with the silly hat and sweater who was on CBC news?"

"Errr...yes thats him."

"hahahahahahahaha...hahaha"
 
flabio said:
Perhaps you're just upset Rob is well known, and that you and your troll pals are nobodies in comparison.
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At least you've completely dropped the pretence now.

How about enlightening us unfortunate troll nobodies about the magic fairyland of milk and honey that is FOTLerism.
 
Chaetognath said:
On a tangent - I have never discovered who invented the ubiquitous [Firstname]-[Middlename]:[Lastname] naming motif that is so commonly used by FOTLish litigants. I have suspected it was David-Wynn: Miller, but I have never seen that confirmed.

Does anyone happen to know? I would very much like to ensure the correct person receives credit for that innovation.

Chaetognath.
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This sort of thing somewhat surprises me. It's not even gross and wilful misinterpretation of actual law at this point; it has no basis in anything. It's mindboggling that a grown man would make something out of pure cloth, actually expect it to work, and then be indignant when the powers that be ignore these imaginary rules.

It's like when I was a child and built a time machine by taping a Nintendo controller to a cardboard board because I had decided that that's how it worked, and then was genuinely surprised when it didn't.

The difference is I grew out of that.
 
Boot2TheHead said:
This sort of thing somewhat surprises me. It's not even gross and wilful misinterpretation of actual law at this point; it has no basis in anything. It's mindboggling that a grown man would make something out of pure cloth, actually expect it to work, and then be indignant when the powers that be ignore these imaginary rules.

.
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The Emperor's New Clothes ?
 
Chaetognath said:
My understanding is that persons such as yourself often consider Black’s Law Dictionary as an authoritative source for the legal meaning of certain terms.
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They regard Black's as not only authoritative, but as binding on all courts, with authority of its own. They don't understand (or pretend not to understand) that legal dictionaries describe how courts and legislation have treated particular terms, rather than prescribing how they must do so, and that any authority the definitions have arises from their having been stated by the courts or by legislation (they also don't understand that it is a basic principle of common law that legislation supersedes judicial decisions). Worse, they invariably cite out of date editions.
 
Chaetognath said:
I have never encountered a Titles of Nobility Amendment argument in the flesh, and I cannot off the top of my head recall any hint of that meme in the FOTLish materials our court has received to date.

Instead what happened is that I did a general survey of American counter-state/court authority memes when I began my investigation into the FOTLish movement. The Tax Protestor FAQ was one of my primary sources and remains a standby – I recommend that to any person interested in the scope of American schemes and arguments.

I have read Ms. Silversmith’s article, which I agree is simply excellent. While I may never have to explain the Titles of Nobility Amendment in an operational sense, at a minimum it makes another fine illustration of just how peculiar FOTLish arguments can be. Phrased differently, a punch line.
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I think I mentioned up-thread that I'm a former accountant. Though I never encountered a true tax protester, I've read the Tax Protester FAQ, partly out of professional curiosity, and partly because of the tangential connection to conspiracism. I find it humorous, in a Sick, Sad World sort of way, that two of these people's major arguments are that the Titles of Nobility Amendment, which was never ratified, actually was, and that the Sixteenth AmendmentWP, which was duly ratified, actually was not.

Chaetognath said:
One of our articling students who is familiar with the Alberta Legislature complex . . .
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[OT]I was about to avail myself of the opportunity to ask a question that occurred to me, after all the times I've listened to HMS Pinafore, what the term "articled clerk" means, but then it occurred to me that I could just look it up on Wikipedia.[/OT]

Chaetognath said:
I like the idea of “cargo cult law” very much. That is certainly an excellent way to express the triumph of ceremony and drama over substance. I usually explain the in-court conduct of FOTLish litigants as a kind of ‘magic spell’ ritual, with various ceremonial components and incantations. That meshes very well with the cargo cult concept of attempting to simulate things that possess substance and function, and expecting the same or an analogous result.
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A wonderful description of the operation of both cargo cults and SC/FOTL schemes. Except that most cargo cultists have an excuse for their behavior.
 
One interesting point that flabio brought up seems to be a plausible reason for how people can come to believe in FOTL - not understanding the concept of discretion among the police and courts. Contrary to what many freemen claim, most people involved in law enforcement aren't tyrants. Not every case is dealt with the same way, and not every defendant has the book thrown at them. I'm sure that somewhere along the line, a few freemen have managed to avoid being punished for minor offenses by falling within these discretionary cracks. The cop who's supposed to testify against the freeman might not show up at court, they might realize that they don't have a very good case, they might decide that they have better things to do with their manpower then argue the contesting of a traffic ticket, etc. The government knows that they can't get everyone, so it's not a big deal for them to let someone go. To people who don't understand this practice, they could mix up the whole correlation-causation thing and assume that FOTL is what saved them.
 
To people who don't understand this practice, they could mix up the whole correlation-causation thing and assume that FOTL is what saved them.
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..and if Menard actually had the nerve to put any of his theories into practice any likely success he may have would probably be down to this very point.

Why would the courts want to be chasing a down-and-out with no visible means of income or assets?
Menards success would be the equivalent of a tramp smashing a shop window for a bed for the night and released next day without charge.
 
flabio said:
Perhaps you're just upset Rob is well known, and that you and your troll pals are nobodies in comparison.
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Oh hai flabio. :)

So, not a big Wilde fan then?


If internets fame is my goal, perhaps I'm going about it the wrong way, what with posting under a pseudonym 'n' stuff.
 
jargon buster said:
..and if Menard actually had the nerve to put any of his theories into practice any likely success he may have would probably be down to this very point.

Why would the courts want to be chasing a down-and-out with no visible means of income or assets?
Menards success would be the equivalent of a tramp smashing a shop window for a bed for the night and released next day without charge.
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Oh, Menard went further than that. Not happy with the once popular FMOTL story that “the cop let me go after I talked freeman theory to him“ Bobbo had to develop an even bigger tall tale.

In this tale a cop catching Menard drinking in public looked him up in the police data base and found him noted as a freeman untouchable who can’t be prosecuted without the province’s highest approval.

After being asked to produce the document Menard realized that unable to do so he had worked himself into a corner like the O.J. Simpson prosecution when it lost control of the evidence in the “. . .if the glove wouldn’t fit. . .” episode.

So now the story is that an unnamed buddy who, about to be busted for public drinking, told the cops he was a freeman on the land and the cops promptly apologized and drove off with their tails between their legs.

Our subject realized that stories with unnamed freemen and no references to documents and data searches are harder to check out.
 
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