Riots, looting, vandalism, etc.

Pinkerton has confirmed he had no employment with them. He also had a history of Bernie supporting, occupy wall street, etc. so it’s really not unreasonable to think he may qualify as antifa or antifa lite.
 
Pinkerton has confirmed he had no employment with them. He also had a history of Bernie supporting, occupy wall street, etc. so it’s really not unreasonable to think he may qualify as antifa or antifa lite.

Did you read that from some douchenozzle on reddit? How about cite for this? Pretty please with sugar on it.
 
Did you read that from some douchenozzle on reddit? How about cite for this? Pretty please with sugar on it.

https://twitter.com/stillgray/status/1315500642052440065

Dunno his source but he's always got good sources / info fast and very rarely has to retract later.

Based on other stuff I'm seeing, I think maybe Pinkerton had some sort of middle man subcontractor company this guy was with. Unclear as of now.
 
Dunno his source but he's always got good sources / info fast and very rarely has to retract later.

"This Tweet is from an account you muted."

:: clicks view ::

LOL.

...Ian Miles Cheong is not a reliable source. He certainly has fast info because he has bad sources who consistently get things wrong and he retracts stuff all the time.
 
https://twitter.com/stillgray/status/1315500642052440065

Dunno his source but he's always got good sources / info fast and very rarely has to retract later.

Based on other stuff I'm seeing, I think maybe Pinkerton had some sort of middle man subcontractor company this guy was with. Unclear as of now.

Lol Ian Cheong. That's worse than no citation at all.

The dude is a notorious right wing propagandist who regularly posts incorrect info in the rush to break "news" about these kinds of events. It's impressive how consistently wrong he is about these stories.

I don't recall all his failures off the top of my head, but one that immediately comes to mind recently:

Ian Cheong wrongly "doxxed" a Compton man as the police ambush shooter, posting his name and address to his legion of right wing morons. Someone else has since been arrested for this shooting. There seems to be little evidence that this man was involved other than being of similar build (short) as the shooter, and of course being black while living in Compton.

https://lasentinel.net/sheriffs-media-misidentify-innocent-compton-man-as-cop-shooter.html

Cheong is part of the online right wing media Gish gallop machine, constantly posting false and inflammatory "news" to wind up the CHUDs and moving onto another story as the truth comes out to completely discredit the false narrative.

Fun fact, Cheong has never set foot in the United States. He has no firsthand knowledge in any of the stories he covers, because he is literally thousands of miles away in Malaysia. He scrapes videos from real journalists and adds his own right wing spin, which is more often than not totally fictitious.
 
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Interesting development that is actually sourced by real journalists:

CHUD remover wasn't licensed as a security guard in Colorado. Very likely that working this security detail wasn't in compliance with the relevant law.

9News holds the position that they hired this guy through Pinkerton, and I don't see any reason to doubt it. While the right wingers are ginning up a conspiracy theory, the more likely reason is that a private mercenary company such as the Pinkertons was just being sloppy with their HR and didn't follow regs.

I'm very curious about the exact nature of this contract. I wouldn't be surprised if there are layers of contractor here, with 9News contracting with Pinkerton, which turned around and subcontracted with a smaller outfit or even with the shooter directly.

I'm guessing an unlicensed armed security guard was not carrying good liability insurance, so he may find himself in some great difficulty funding his legal defense.

https://www.9news.com/article/news/crime/security-guard-held-denver-shooting-wasnt-licensed-officials-say/73-648ca0f2-cc71-4fa7-b145-cbd710b87f5f
 
I see that the "All we are saying, is give violence a chance" crowd are overjoyed and super impressed and pleased with themselves that the douchebags they love and support are not as bad as NAZIs and right-wing militias plotting to kidnap US govenors. I'm super impressed with you guys. You are far far better. I agree. You've managed to be better than white supremeists and that is something to take pride in. The left is clearly winning in who are the biggest ******** in raw numbers:
[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=390&pictureid=12642[/qimg]

That's a frightening poll result. In the space of 3 years, we've hit a point where 1 in 3 partisans think violence is justified in order to get their way politically.
 
Here is some news for all you fans of broken glass, arson, and rioting. The Oregon Historical Society's glass was broken and arsoned with flares. They also stole the Afro-American Heritage Bicentennial Commemorative Quilt made by 15 local Black women.
The quilt was recovered by police a few blocks away with damage including bleeding of the colors.

Photos of the quilt on twitter
Also:
One of the quilters is still alive
 
https://twitter.com/stillgray/status/1315500642052440065

Dunno his source but he's always got good sources / info fast and very rarely has to retract later.

Based on other stuff I'm seeing, I think maybe Pinkerton had some sort of middle man subcontractor company this guy was with. Unclear as of now.

I'll quote him for accuracy:
Ian Miles Cheong
@stillgray
Pinkerton just disavowed the Denver shooter, saying they never employed him. This contradicts 9News' own statement that they hired him through Pinkerton.

Accused Denver shooter was a sub-contractor, not employee: Pinkerton

The Pinkerton detective agency said Monday that accused Denver “Patriot Rally” shooter Matthew Dolloff worked for a contractor and was not directly employed by the famed firm.

“We take loss of life in any situation very seriously and our hearts go out to those impacted by this situation,” the company posted on its Facebook page. “As it relates to the incident in Denver on October 10, the agent in question is not a Pinkerton employee but rather a contractor agent from a long-standing industry vendor.”
The station, 9News-TV, said Sunday that it contracted Dolloff through Pinkerton and that it had enlisted security “for a number of months” to protect employees while covering BLM protests and related rallies.

So, that doesn't appear to contradict a statement "that they hired him through Pinkerton" at all. In other words, he's an idiot or a liar. You do understand that they don't employ him "directly" doesn't mean that he wasn't hired "through" their firm, right?
 
I would really like to know how walking around not merely carrying a firearm - but carrying one with your finger on the trigger and pushing around opposition in a highly contentious political "protest" does not at least constitute criminal menacing in this country.

Because they are supporting the white supremacist establishment of the USA it is legal.
 
I'll quote him for accuracy:


Accused Denver shooter was a sub-contractor, not employee: Pinkerton



So, that doesn't appear to contradict a statement "that they hired him through Pinkerton" at all. In other words, he's an idiot or a liar. You do understand that they don't employ him "directly" doesn't mean that he wasn't hired "through" their firm, right?

My understanding of this possibility / scenario was literally right there in the post from me you quoted.
 
My understanding of this possibility / scenario was literally right there in the post from me you quoted.

The guy you quoted however is wrong. And in an earlier post you said:
Pinkerton has confirmed he had no employment with them. He also had a history of Bernie supporting, occupy wall street, etc. so it’s really not unreasonable to think he may qualify as antifa or antifa lite.

You never really offered any evidence for the second half of that statement, and the first half doesn't actually contradict what the TV station actually claimed. He was effectively employed by Pinkerton, even if indirectly. A company can outsource the work, but not their contractual obligations.

I read in another story that the TV station says they asked Pinkerton for unarmed security. Not only was he armed, but apparently he didn't have the required license.

Dolloff had worked for more than a year as a private security guard at a number of events in Colorado, Richards said. The night before the shooting, Dolloff worked as an armed security guard at a debate between Colorado’s U.S. Senate candidates, Richards said. That debate was held at Denver7’s television studio and co-hosted by The Denver Post and Colorado Public Radio.

Denver7 on Monday confirmed Dolloff was one of the guards at the debate but disputed that he was armed. “We do not use armed guards,” Holly Gauntt, Denver7’s news director, said in an email. “We have always told Pinkerton that we want unarmed guards.”

Dolloff picked up the security jobs as a contractor through Pinkerton, Richards said. The attorney on Monday said he did not know exactly what security training Dolloff had or what entity provided the training. He also said he didn’t know whether Dolloff had a license to work as a security guard in Denver. Such licenses are required to work in private security in the city.

“Even if he didn’t carry the special Denver security license, it didn’t stop Pinkerton from sending Matt into that job and it doesn’t change the fact that Matt was acting in self-defense,” Richards said.

I wonder what the actual contracts say. If they specifically asked that the security be unarmed, and yet the man provided by Pinkerton's contractor was not only armed, but unlicensed, I think they could argue breach of contract. But of course, that would depend on the actual wording of the contract.

More info:
https://kdvr.com/news/local/pinkerton-says-shooting-suspect-was-not-their-employee-city-weighs-in/

In a statement to KDVR Monday, Pinkerton said Dolloff was not an employee of the company but a contractor from a “long standing industry vendor.”

“The agent in question was not a Pinkerton employee but rather a contractor agent from a long-standing licensed industry vendor. The vendor is responsible for keeping all licensing and registrations current for agents and it is our understanding that the contractor agent in question has a conceal and carry license.”
Statement from Pinkerton​

Denver’s Excise and Licenses Director of Communications Eric Escudero made it simple and clear that licensing for security guards in the city.

“If you are a security guard company, whether you want to call it a contract or call it a temporary, if they are doing security guard work, you are required to have a license and the company is responsible that is the security guard employer for making sure they are licensed,” he said.

“It is clear as a crystal-clear blue day in Colorado, there are no loopholes in the City and County of Denver when it comes to licensing security guard companies,” Escudero said.

The confusion lies with the licensing of a vendor or the security company that hires the contractor through the vendor. The City Attorney’s Office said:

“Under the Denver Revised Municipal Code, it is unlawful for any person to operate as a private security employer without obtaining a license. A private security employer includes any person who provides the services of a security guard on a contractual basis to another person or entity. If a security guard “vendor” is providing the services of a security guard through a contractual agreement, then the vendor must be licensed as a private security employer.”
Response from City Attorney’s Office​

Dolloff had been issued a conceal carry permit by the Elbert County Sheriff in June 2018. That permit is good for five years, but has been suspended pending the outcome of this criminal investigation.

Can Pinkerton simply claim that none of this was their responsibility as they outsourced the work to another company?
 
Wouldn't that depend on the wording of the contract they have with the other company?

Well, probably not just that. It would also depend on the wording of the contract with the customer as well as the applicable laws.

IANAL, but my understanding is that generally speaking, a company can outsource its work but it cannot outsource its responsibilities or liabilities. If it could, just imagine the mischief.
 
I read in another story that the TV station says they asked Pinkerton for unarmed security. Not only was he armed, but apparently he didn't have the required license.

You might have misread the article.

The debate he worked at was hosted by Denver 7, the ABC affilliate (KMGH). They asked for unarmed security.

Dolloff had worked for more than a year as a private security guard at a number of events in Colorado, Richards said. The night before the shooting, Dolloff worked as an armed security guard at a debate between Colorado’s U.S. Senate candidates, Richards said. That debate was held at Denver7’s television studio and co-hosted by The Denver Post and Colorado Public Radio.

Denver7 on Monday confirmed Dolloff was one of the guards at the debate but disputed that he was armed. “We do not use armed guards,” Holly Gauntt, Denver7’s news director, said in an email. “We have always told Pinkerton that we want unarmed guards.”


But the day of the shooting, he was assigned to a reporter from 9News/KUSA, the NBC affiliate. We don't know if KUSA wanted an armed or unarmed guard. Different station, different security contract.

Still no word on who the second gun belonged to (two guns recovered at the scene. One from the shooter, one from???).
 
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Weapons have absolutely no place at a political demonstration. Espeically guns, pepper spray, paint ball guns, and knives. The shooter is being held on first degree murder charges which seems very unreasonable to me. Depending on the details, this will either be a case of a heat of the moment shooting without premeditation or it will be self defense

Yea but he killed someone beloved to the cops, that is almost like killing a cop when you kill cop allies like that. As a cop ally he should have had the same legal immunity they give cops.
 

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