Research questions for Science-Fantasy book

[slingblade]

Ah, in that case don't worry too much about the tech. Suspension of disbelief is a wonderful thing.

I luvs yer smarts, like wimmin luv choklit.

I once taught a class on world-building, and one thing I taught was that even if you never use it, you need to know as much about your world as you can. It lends much greater realism. So, there are some things I need to get nailed down, to prevent faux pas the reader is sure to notice.

I mean, if I don't know it, it won't sound very real to them, who will know even less than I do. But, it sounds as if I have a bit more leeway than I thought.

This is cool! I may actually write a book or five!

 

[Beanbag]

Sling:
As long as the rest of the universe (the everyday things) are logically consistent, a few loose ends tend to get overlooked. Just say that it's being done, and leave it at that. If this was a movie script, I'd say, don't worry, the director said it's so. Just be consistent with the backstories.

I have a novel in the works with a similar plot mechanism, where consciousness can be duplicated in another body. The catch is, it's a destructive read, where the copying process destroys the original. This eliminates the possibility of multiple copies of the same person. I haven't gone too deep into the process itself, just mapped out the major steps, added a few complications that had to be resolved, and went through the actual process twice (once in the case of a cherished pet dog). After that, I don't worry about it -- it's a plot device from then on.

Burroughs handled getting from Earth to Mars in the Barsoom novels by having his protagonist stand in an open field and wishing himself there. Worked for him, and the reader really doesn't care once they get into the story.

Beanbag

 

[Piscivore]

I luvs yer smarts, like wimmin luv choklit.

I once taught a class on world-building, and one thing I taught was that even if you never use it, you need to know as much about your world as you can. It lends much greater realism.

Sure, but I've seen a lot of people get so involved with world building that they never write anything. Also, if your world building is too detailed, when it comes time to make a choice (and this time will come) between the needs of the story and the need to sacrifice some element of your world you've built, it make it a lot harder to let go of that time and effort and serve the story.

You need to keep the idea that you want to get across to the reader firmly in mind, all the rest is malleable.

So, there are some things I need to get nailed down, to prevent faux pas the reader is sure to notice.

Heh, I've put a few in as fan service for the pedants.

I mean, if I don't know it, it won't sound very real to them, who will know even less than I do. But, it sounds as if I have a bit more leeway than I thought.

Oh, tons. Writing Sci Fi is like talking about science around this place- there's always going to be someone who knows more than you. And no matter how much research you do there's always going to be some "tech" you're using that going to turn out to be impossible. The readers won't care if the story is good.

This is cool! I may actually write a book or five!

I look forward to it. Some of the stories you've let me read were engaging.

 

[athon]

Putting aside the exact technical issues, I recommend you read Altered Carbon by Richard K. Morgan, if you haven't already.

You know, as I was reading this, I thought exactly the same thing. I love Richard Morgan.

People are always going to say 'hey, they story sounds like X'. Just smile and nod. Good stories always will - just use it to your advantage. The great thing about having your story remind people of existing tales is you can piggy-back on their expectations to establish character and narrative and twisting the story where you want to veer off their path.

Good luck, sling. I love writing fiction, yet have done more with my non-fic writing. That means I slide back into plot and character building as a refuge away from 'real' science writing. It's comforting knowing if something doesn't work, I can just make it up.

Athon

 

[Professor Yaffle]

Nothing really to add, but if you want anyone to read bits and pieces along the way, I'll volunteer.

 

[Rasmus]

I wonder if that would cause distress? Would people remember what they remembered remembering? And miss it? Gee...I dunno...I'm gonna have to decide that for myself, I suspect. It could be a plot complication.

So, leave it out or turn it into a rare side-effect that you can use when you need it, and ignore otherwise unless you want to portray a society with people like that.

Well, I ...ooh, a butterfly!

As long as it's not an origami one there's no need to worry!

It's not, is it?

I need to consider that. Is there a difference, or is it the perception of a difference? See, I have an unusually sensate memory. I don't just get images or thoughts--the best I can put it is that my memories have "flavors." I often get nearly the full range of senses I experienced as I lived. My memories are a lot more like flashbacks. It makes forgetting some things very difficult. I have a hard time putting the past behind me, as it often feels as if the past is almost as real to me now as the present.

Well, I don' think they are quite the same. I do not remember learning how to read and write, but I can still do it.

Then again, I once didn't know how to get up from the floor anymore ... pm me if you want to discuss this.

But I also imagine that the tech being used takes the brain's knowledge, entire. The learning and the experiencing. You need not relearn your alphabet, or that fire is hot, or that people lie, except a bit of retraining for unused muscles. For all intents and purposes, you continue to be as fully "you" as you are after waking up from a nap.

I was thinking along the lines of what happens if the brain has to make room for more memories and starts discarding some of the old ones.

I also want to use an independent storage system, in that a power-outage wouldn't wipe people out. Once stored, the memory is fully, safely contained. Sort of like how you can't wipe a flash drive once you remove it from the computer. If it's on there, it stays on there, even if the power fails. It's protected from magnetic wipe, radiation wipe, etc. The biggest danger is in losing the ability to retrieve it and re-insert it.

Sounds like something I'd want in such a product ...

Like the spinal "stacks" in Altered Carbon. I need a different method, though. I don't think I want something you'd wear on your head, for instance. Nothing external. Maybe microchips inserted...where? The hippocampus?

Gee, I didn't know I knew the hippocampus played such a role in memory...I just tossed out the first "brain" word I thought of, then went to look it up, and it was the right one. Funny, that. Of course, what I read just raised more questions, and confused me a bit. More reading should fix that, though. I hope.

Just remember it's your universe.

I know exactly what you mean. I have memories of certain places, but not why I was there, or how I came to be there. Of certain people, but no clue who they are, or how I knew them. That can be worked into the story, I'm sure, and will explain much that would otherwise be difficult to explain.

And if you don't want to work it in it will help to remember that people do have that problem now.

Thanks! That was a very great help!!

Yeah. Just you remember that when you come to write the acknowledgements.

 

[slingblade]

Okay, this is now getting to the literary side of things. I think I now know more about what I can do (lots!) and what I can't do (not as much as I thought).

Now, I think I need to take this to the Lit sub, to work on the actual writing part.

But if anyone has some "oh my gosh, I just thought...has she considered this?" ideas about the tech, please do put them here. I'll check back until the thread dies of ennui.

Now....what do you know about recombinant DNA?

And thank you! Too many cooks may spoil the broth, but like a zombie, I need brainnnssss. The more, the better.

 

[The Man]

Except, the story won't be about this. This is just a device used to explain certain things I want to do in the novel, like have a lead character who, 300 years from now, still knows our contemporary music and authors, so I can quote them, or have him use that info. He's a relic...who still sings "Wild Thang" while he mows the grass, because that was the music of his childhood...300 years ago. I want people right now to relate to a man 300 years from now, and this is the way I decided to do that. Better?

The novel is about something very, very different. This is just...background.

I appreciate your concerns, though, and you'd be right, if that was what I'm aiming for. I wish I could tell you....but then, someone else might write it!

Sounds great and I love the nostalgia aspect. Sorry if I sounded like I was trying to tell you how to write your story and I’m glad that you won’t be cloning a dead horse just to beat it some more. You might want to look up aspects and current developments of quantum computing as well as alternate substrates for faster and more powerful computers. Micro machines and Stem cell research might also be current topics useful in referencing the development of the cloning background. Perhaps even combination of them as a gelatinous substrate that acts as the quantum computer itself that clone could be developed within using micro machines to construct DNA and proteins for cellular construction and maybe even some becomes part of the cloned brain for better retention of centuries of memory, also as the source of perhaps other problems. Sorry there I go again, as others have noted don’t get too caught up in the technical aspects just try to extrapolate currently developing fields so they become both the reasons things work in your world and perhaps the source of problems as well so you really do not have to be that concerned about real or currently understood limitations and capabilities.

 

[fuelair]

Okay, this is now getting to the literary side of things. I think I now know more about what I can do (lots!) and what I can't do (not as much as I thought).

Now, I think I need to take this to the Lit sub, to work on the actual writing part.

But if anyone has some "oh my gosh, I just thought...has she considered this?" ideas about the tech, please do put them here. I'll check back until the thread dies of ennui.

Now....what do you know about recombinant DNA?

And thank you! Too many cooks may spoil the broth, but like a zombie, I need brainnnssss. The more, the better.

Add this point to the sciency part of this - the more you put in, the easier it is for smartbutts to pick on stuff where information changes before the book gets from printer to public. And, is there any reason to bring out major details (the old "explain the disruptor gun to these visiting politicians please" problem). (Not asking, rhetorical ).

 

[The Man]

Okay, this is now getting to the literary side of things. I think I now know more about what I can do (lots!) and what I can't do (not as much as I thought).

Now, I think I need to take this to the Lit sub, to work on the actual writing part.

But if anyone has some "oh my gosh, I just thought...has she considered this?" ideas about the tech, please do put them here. I'll check back until the thread dies of ennui.

Now....what do you know about recombinant DNA?

And thank you! Too many cooks may spoil the broth, but like a zombie, I need brainnnssss. The more, the better.

Genetic material was thought to only go one way from DNA to RNA and then used to make proteins. Until Reverse Transcriptase was found, quite literally reverse transcribing enzyme, which constructs a DNA copy of RNA that is inserted into the genetic material of a cell. That is how retro-viruses work. It is nature’s recumbent DNA process, where ours is far more complicated and labor intensive.

 

[slingblade]

@Fuel, well, one of the problems I had with backstory was person. (Sorry for dragging the lit into the science sub; forgive me, sciency types!)

If I write this section in first person, as is my instinct, I have to explain who he's writing for, since everyone he lives with knows the story as well as he. It would be like me telling the story of TAM 5 to my hubby, who was there with me. I think I've figured that part out, though. And I think it will work well, and will be well within the nature of the protag to do so. He doesn't have to disguise his exposition; he hopes to tell his story to some who really need to hear it, and likely never will if he doesn't tell it. Catharsis.

If I write it in third, I see the exposition getting bogged down in just they way you suggested: "As you all know, here's me telling you everything you all know."

I told my basic plot outline to someone I trust well. That person thinks I may have something good to run with, so I'm going forward. Rather than retard myself by forcing it into third person, I'm writing it now (yes, now! Whee!) in first, and if it goes badly, I can change it. It's only written in pixels, not stone.

 

[The Man]

@Fuel, well, one of the problems I had with backstory was person. (Sorry for dragging the lit into the science sub; forgive me, sciency types!)

If I write this section in first person, as is my instinct, I have to explain who he's writing for, since everyone he lives with knows the story as well as he. It would be like me telling the story of TAM 5 to my hubby, who was there with me. I think I've figured that part out, though. And I think it will work well, and will be well within the nature of the protag to do so. He doesn't have to disguise his exposition; he hopes to tell his story to some who really need to hear it, and likely never will if he doesn't tell it. Catharsis.

If I write it in third, I see the exposition getting bogged down in just they way you suggested: "As you all know, here's me telling you everything you all know."

I told my basic plot outline to someone I trust well. That person thinks I may have something good to run with, so I'm going forward. Rather than retard myself by forcing it into third person, I'm writing it now (yes, now! Whee!) in first, and if it goes badly, I can change it. It's only written in pixels, not stone.

Well don’t be afraid to experiment even by changing perspectives within the story. You're basically talking about memories the can be stored so from one aspect it could be third person then go to first person as the memory is explored. Not sure if I am explain it right. Also I do not know if changing perspectives has ever been that engrained into a story before or if it will tend to confuse the reader.

 

[wollery]

This reminds me of the roleplaying game Paranoia, based loosely on the film Logan's Run.

Very funny game to play.

 

[quixotecoyote]

This reminds me of the roleplaying game Paranoia, based loosely on the film Logan's Run.

Very funny game to play.

That's the second time I've seen Paranoia referenced today after years of not hearing about it at all. Bizarre

 

[steve s]

I suggest you also watch "The 6th day" with Arnie.

Or rent the movie Brainstorm.

Steve S.

 

[fuelair]

@Fuel, well, one of the problems I had with backstory was person. (Sorry for dragging the lit into the science sub; forgive me, sciency types!)

If I write this section in first person, as is my instinct, I have to explain who he's writing for, since everyone he lives with knows the story as well as he. It would be like me telling the story of TAM 5 to my hubby, who was there with me. I think I've figured that part out, though. And I think it will work well, and will be well within the nature of the protag to do so. He doesn't have to disguise his exposition; he hopes to tell his story to some who really need to hear it, and likely never will if he doesn't tell it. Catharsis.

If I write it in third, I see the exposition getting bogged down in just they way you suggested: "As you all know, here's me telling you everything you all know."

I told my basic plot outline to someone I trust well. That person thinks I may have something good to run with, so I'm going forward. Rather than retard myself by forcing it into third person, I'm writing it now (yes, now! Whee!) in first, and if it goes badly, I can change it. It's only written in pixels, not stone.

And being backed up frequently I assume!!!

 

[Piggy]

Slingblade, as a writer, here's my advice.

Don't sweat the tech.

An effective novel puts interesting characters in situations that stress them in ways that create tension among them.

Those tensions put them to the test, and reveal their strengths and weaknesses.

The best option is to simply assert the tech. Simply assume, in the fictional world, that these things are real.

Vonnegut did not explain how ice-9 was possible.

Clarke did not explain how HAL worked.

Wells did not explain how the time machine operated.

Build a convincing reality with characters that people can care about, in situations that mirror our own fears, anxieties, loves, doubts, hopes, and disappointments, and you'll have a good story.

But don't worry about the tech at all. If you build it into your world, your audience will not care about the details, or whether it's even possible in our world.

 

[Dr. Trintignant]

Could such a storage system be made manageable, meaning: could we get this into a device smaller than a few football fields?

Assuming it doesn't turn out that the brain relies on some fancy quantum effects or something, the storage system is quite possible today. The human brain has around 100 billion (10^11) neurons, and it's almost certainly a massive overestimate to say that each neuron needs 1 megabyte to record its state. A microSD card is 165 mm^3, and stores up to 16 gigabytes. (10^11 * 10^6 bytes) / (16*10^9 bytes) * (165 mm^3) / (10^9 mm^3/m^3) = 1.03 m^3. So, even allowing for mounting and control logic, a total brain record shouldn't require more than a few cubic meters (assuming it could be read in the first place). And it's likely that we'll get a few more orders of magnitude out of Moore's Law before silicon runs out of steam.

- Dr. Trintignant