Regarding Franko...

[Ipecac]

Ipecac,

Even assuming that “red” is not really “red”, but oscillating photons traveling at the speed of light, how the heck does that affect me?

Sure – if you say so! I guess you think photons are meaningless also?

Okay. Then tell me how it affects me. Please enlighten me.

 

[Checkmite]

Speaking of facts, what is your evidence for “free will” again? Why do you believe that less conscious things control more conscious things?

I keep looking, but I honestly can't find any instance in subgenius's thread where he even mentions free will or consciousness. Franko, you're setting up strawmen for this guy, and he hasn't even said anything yet.

 

[Ipecac]

Maybe I should expand on my point a bit.

I have to choose where I'm going to eat tonight. I can have Italian, Mexican, Japanese, or pizza. I have a lot of choice! Seems like I have free will to go where I will.

So I pick Mexican. No, Japanese!

But wait, I don't have free will. Okay, so I still have the problem of where I'm going to eat tonight. I have no free will, how do I proceed? Since the universe didn't tell me what to do, I guess I may as well choose among the previous options. Doesn't seem like it matters whether or not I have free will.

Now there are other "eternal questions" that also have no relevance to my daily life. But one would think that free will wouldn't fit under the "Nice to know but not relevant" category. So please explain how this matters.

 

[Kodiak]

If I never have to read another post from You (Titanpoint), Tricky, Whodini, Upchurch, Plutrach, Fade, Doubt, (I'm sure I'm missing some) ... then it will be too soon.

Yeah...me, you troll!

 

[Franko]

Jk….

Franko, you're setting up strawmen for this guy, and he hasn't even said anything yet.

maybe I just see his Fate?

 

[Franko]

Ipecac,

Maybe I should expand on my point a bit.

In most cases there is no such thing as “too much information”, in my mind.

I have to choose where I'm going to eat tonight. I can have Italian, Mexican, Japanese, or pizza. I have a lot of choice! Seems like I have free will to go where I will.

So I pick Mexican. No, Japanese!

But wait, I don't have free will. Okay, so I still have the problem of where I'm going to eat tonight. I have no free will, how do I proceed? Since the universe didn't tell me what to do, I guess I may as well choose among the previous options. Doesn't seem like it matters whether or not I have free will.

Whether you think you got to “choose” is irrelevant to the FACT in reality of whether you got to choose. It is kind of like a kid at Christmas time. The FACT that he believes Santa brought him the toys, doesn’t change the Fact that Santa doesn’t exist, nor does it change the fact that the kid has the toys. When you say that the existence or nonexistence of “free will” is irrelevant it is like claiming that the existence or nonexistence of Santa is irrelevant.

Now there are other "eternal questions" that also have no relevance to my daily life. But one would think that free will wouldn't fit under the "Nice to know but not relevant" category. So please explain how this matters.

Well … if you are an A-Theist with a strong and heartfelt a priori conclusion that there is NO GOD, then I can certainly see why you wouldn’t want it to matter …

 

[Ipecac]

Ipecac,

In most cases there is no such thing as “too much information”, in my mind.

Whether you think you got to “choose” is irrelevant to the FACT in reality of whether you got to choose. It is kind of like a kid at Christmas time. The FACT that he believes Santa brought him the toys, doesn’t change the Fact that Santa doesn’t exist, nor does it change the fact that the kid has the toys. When you say that the existence or nonexistence of “free will” is irrelevant it is like claiming that the existence or nonexistence of Santa is irrelevant.

Well … if you are an A-Theist with a strong and heartfelt a priori conclusion that there is NO GOD, then I can certainly see why you wouldn’t want it to matter …

Huh? I mean, huh? Does this answer my question? What does this mean? I've looked at it several times and can literally not make any sense out of it with regards to my question.

 

[Franko]

Ipecac,

Huh? I mean, huh? Does this answer my question? What does this mean? I've looked at it several times and can literally not make any sense out of it with regards to my question.

What is your question?

Are you claiming that chemical reactions are NOT caused by the Laws of Physics?

Are you really reading this Word at this moment because you wanted to, or because chemical reactions in your brain forced you to? Are those same chemicals going to force you to respond to this post?

 

[Ipecac]

Ipecac,

What is your question?

Are you claiming that chemical reactions are NOT caused by the Laws of Physics?

Are you really reading this Word at this moment because you wanted to, or because chemical reactions in your brain forced you to? Are those same chemicals going to force you to respond to this post?

Here is my question:

How does whether or not I have free will make any difference in where I am going to eat tonight?

 

[Franko]

... And here is my answer:

How does whether or not I have free will make any difference in where I am going to eat tonight?

Do you care whether or not you cease to exist one day Ipecac? If you cease to exist, then guess what you get to eat for lunch from that point on?

Do you care?

 

[Titanpoint]

I keep looking, but I honestly can't find any instance in subgenius's thread where he even mentions free will or consciousness. Franko, you're setting up strawmen for this guy, and he hasn't even said anything yet.

You're being sucked in.

Use the force, Luke!

"TP in Hawaii"

 

[Titanpoint]

"TP in Hawaii"



"Soubrette in her house"

YOU'RE JUST JELLUS

"TP in Hawaii"

 

[Franko]

You're being sucked in.

Use the force, Luke!

"TP in Hawaii".

So he’s in a tropical paradise … and instead of enjoying the Sun and the beach, and the pretty women, he’s in here … telling You to use all your power to avoid this thread?

Obviously he is unable to follow his own advice? I wonder why? It is almost as if he has no control over his own actions? Surely something must control him?

 

[Ipecac]

... And here is my answer:

Do you care whether or not you cease to exist one day Ipecac? If you cease to exist, then guess what you get to eat for lunch from that point on?

Do you care?

Three questions (although you ask one twice) do not answer my question. I am looking for a practical application of your argument about free will. How does your argument affect my life tonight as I am preparing to have dinner? Is your answer some kind of Zen coan?


For the record, to answer your three questions:

Yes, I care whether or not I cease to exist. Caring about it, though, doesn't change my belief that I won't exist.

If I cease to exist, I will eat nothing for lunch from that day forward.

Again, yes I do care.

Your turn.

 

[Franko]

Ipecac,

Three questions (although you ask one twice) do not answer my question. I am looking for a practical application of your argument about free will. How does your argument affect my life tonight as I am preparing to have dinner? Is your answer some kind of Zen coan?

Maybe you cease to exist before you eat dinner tonight. Then you would have your answer … except it would be the wrong one and then it would be too late. Then you would understand why it mattered.

For the record, to answer your three questions:

Yes, I care whether or not I cease to exist. Caring about it, though, doesn't change my belief that I won't exist.

What is your evidence that you will?

Or let me put that another way … what is your evidence that the TRUTH is ever ultimately NOT beneficial?

If I cease to exist, I will eat nothing for lunch from that day forward.

Again, yes I do care.

So you are saying that you do not find it beneficial … This notion that you will one day cease to exist?

… and what makes you assume that the TRUTH is ever not beneficial? Do you have any evidence to support this claim?

 

[Ipecac]

Ipecac,

Maybe you cease to exist before you eat dinner tonight. Then you would have your answer … except it would be the wrong one and then it would be too late. Then you would understand why it mattered.

What is your evidence that you will?

Or let me put that another way … what is your evidence that the TRUTH is ever ultimately NOT beneficial?

So you are saying that you do not find it beneficial … This notion that you will one day cease to exist?

… and what makes you assume that the TRUTH is ever not beneficial? Do you have any evidence to support this claim?

Look, if there's no practical application, then just say so. Lots of things are interesting to know but have no practical application.

The only way in which my knowledge that I will cease to exist is beneficial is that it serves as notice that I need to live today. I need to do everything I want to within the space of my lifetime. There are no do-overs.

Do I have evidence to support claims that you make in your response to my questions? No.

 

[Plutarck]

Surly you don't mean this one:

People who evade questions usually don't know the answers
Franko evades direct questions
Franko does not know the answers.

Things that are not observed do not exist.
I do not observe Franko.
Franko does not exist.


I like mine better.

 

[Franko]

Things that are not observed do not exist.
I do not observe Franko.
Franko does not exist.

Did I mention that Plutard is just one of my sock puppets?

I do not observe Franko.

That’s a little hard to believe since you are posting in a thread titled Regarding Franko …, and your last post alone mentioned my name (Franko) 4 Times.

Things that are not observed do not exist

Well – thank the Goddess!!! At least you have finally conceded that Solipsism is TRUE.

 

[Plutarck]

Well – thank the Goddess!!! At least you have finally conceded that Solipsism is TRUE.

Sure Franko, you just go ahead and believe that. No point in arguing, seing as how you'll just ignore it or equivocate anyway, as per usual.

Of course if solipsism is true and I'm the only one that exists, that of course means your Goddess doesn't exist - because I say so. And if you're the only one that exists your Goddess exists only as a figment of your imagination, making her equally fake.

What your obsession is with solipsism I'll never...well, care.

Regardless, your make believe still fits neatly into the bin of useless and irrelevant.

You may now go back to playing games with the members of this forum who still find amusement in your tired little plastic monkey dance, though their numbers have dwindled. I prefer more useful and intellectually stimulating activities, like watching grass grow.

 

[Franko]

Plutarch,

[Plutarch claims Solipsism is True …]Sure Franko, you just go ahead and believe that. No point in arguing, seing as how you'll just ignore it or equivocate anyway, as per usual.

I am Your figment after all …

Of course if solipsism is true and I'm the only one that exists, that of course means your Goddess doesn't exist - because I say so.

Problem solved! See, was that so difficult … God?

… And if you're the only one that exists your Goddess exists only as a figment of your imagination, making her equally fake.

Exactly Right!!! Excellent God! You are beginning to Remember again!!! I am a figment of your imagination, and the Goddess is simply a figment of Mine!

What your obsession is with solipsism I'll never...well, care.

My obsession God? Ohhh no, it certainly isn’t My obsession. I don’t even exist.

Regardless, your make believe still fits neatly into the bin of useless and irrelevant, right along with you.

I am only a figment of your imagination God. I am only happy to be of what service you imagined me to be.

You may now go back to playing games with the members of this forum who still find amusement in your tired little plastic monkey dance

We all dance at your command God. Only YOU are real.

… though their numbers have dwindled. I prefer more useful and intellectually stimulating activities, like watching grass grow.

…ultimately that is all you really have to do. No wonder you long for the day when you will cease to exist …