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"Real" vampires.

fuelair said:
Or.....Browning combat modified shotgun, 12 gauge , shells loaded with silver balls microetched with religious symbols and magnesium pellets blessed by legitimate priest of appropriate religion. Ingram or Uzi, 40 rd mag, cartridge cases loaded with oak and ash bullets, tipped with small inserted vial of holy water sealed with silver, modified spring for slower cycling with reduced powder content to be sure bullet stays in body. Just in case.:D :D
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Never mind the disco-guns, MP5K all the way. Your wooden bullet idea was done rather well in the Ultraviolet series on UK telly; you might've seen it; HK SOCOM .45s with graphite rounds and video cameras with flip-up translucent screens mounted on the tactical rail. Ho, momma. Of course, the whole wooden stake idea is pretty much a Buffy-era invention. Originally (c18th century) it didn't matter what the material, as long as it could pin the corpse into its grave securely.

You also wouldn't want to reduce the cyclic rate or cartridge case load if you were using wooden bullets; their reduced mass would already give you penetration problems (fnar fnar).

See, you can be a vampire fanatic without actually thinking you are one.
 
Big Les said:
Never mind the disco-guns, MP5K all the way. Your wooden bullet idea was done rather well in the Ultraviolet series on UK telly; you might've seen it; HK SOCOM .45s with graphite rounds and video cameras with flip-up translucent screens mounted on the tactical rail. Ho, momma. Of course, the whole wooden stake idea is pretty much a Buffy-era invention. Originally (c18th century) it didn't matter what the material, as long as it could pin the corpse into its grave securely.

You also wouldn't want to reduce the cyclic rate or cartridge case load if you were using wooden bullets; their reduced mass would already give you penetration problems (fnar fnar).

See, you can be a vampire fanatic without actually thinking you are one.
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Actually, no I have not seen the Brit series, I came up with the idea on my own about two years after Vampire t. m. came out and I got to watch people (vamps,vics and other) maneuvering around blocking objcts because all the kill tools were close in weapons. So dumb..... but I admit a thing for HKs - especially the .45compacts (early, when you could get R or L hand versions - or both.)
 
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Big Les said:
Of course, the whole wooden stake idea is pretty much a Buffy-era invention. Originally (c18th century) it didn't matter what the material, as long as it could pin the corpse into its grave securely.
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Well, I wouldn't exactly call this a Buffy-era invention either. The 1931 Dracula movie with Bela Lugosi involved a wooden stake, and that has been the norm ever since. Although Van Helsing doesn't state that it is a wooden stake, it seems to have solidified the myth of a wooden stake in that scene. At least, I grew up "knowing" that it had to be a wooden stake, and that was long before Buffy came along.
 
Heh.

I had an entire sorority house convinced I was a vampire/demon. It was pretty fun, and a good way to get laid, ironically enough. Seems that fear and attraction are linked.

Some cheap theatrics, good metabolism(very thin), my natural aversion to sunlight(bright things suck), and hair down to the middle of my back was all it took.

I actually heard stories that people saw me appear and disappear in the halls at night. I have no idea why. I didn't even prompt this, this grew on its own.

I wonder if I created any believers.:eye-poppi

Somewhat scary thought. I had fun, though. It was playacting, roleplaying. Seems that if they thought I was supernatural, they had no control over what they were feeling. >I< was doing it TO them. Some wierd form of 'rape fantasy'.

I never knew it was taken seriously until a few years later, when I began dating one of them(now married). She told me the stories. Was pretty funny.

Though now I wonder....
 
Zygar said:
Well, I wouldn't exactly call this a Buffy-era invention either. The 1931 Dracula movie with Bela Lugosi involved a wooden stake, and that has been the norm ever since. Although Van Helsing doesn't state that it is a wooden stake, it seems to have solidified the myth of a wooden stake in that scene. At least, I grew up "knowing" that it had to be a wooden stake, and that was long before Buffy came along.
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Fair enough, by implication it's been the wooden stake for a long time. But I'm pretty sure Buffy has set that in stone by stating that it has to be wooden and no other material. Ultraviolet and others have as well of course, I suppose because culturally it was already "set" in our minds.

But the "original" stakings, assuming I've got my folklore correct, would have been using iron stakes, used to transfix the corpse in the grave so it could not rise as a vampire (as opposed to actually killing it). In Stoker it's fairly clear that the stake does not kill the vampire; you have to take its head, and indeed the folklore preceding largely agrees (for eastern european vamps anyway). In fact, usually the suspected corpses were also burnt, which I suppose is where the Rician/White Wolfian (!) idea of fire being so deadly, comes from.

Come to think of it, aren't metal stakes specified in Stoker?
 
Big Les said:
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Come to think of it, aren't metal stakes specified in Stoker?
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No. Dracula is killed with Quincy Morris' bowie knife. Lucy, with a wooden stake.

Metal stakes are mentioned in folklore, but wooden stakes were more commonly used in Eastern Europe. Ash was the preferred wood as well as, juniper buckthorn, whitethorn and hawthorn. Then the head was severed from the body, turned backward and the body re-interred. Or just simply burnt.

The vampire in folklore was never pale. It had a ruddy complexion, could move about day or night. It was not forever young as it continued to rot and was blamed for plagues.

Muslim gypsies living in what was once Yugoslavia believed melons and pumpkins could turn into vampires if kept to long. The term for those was mullo. The "turned' vegetables would roll after people growling.

Of course, the vampire lifestylists forget these things...
 
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Zygar said:
Well, I wouldn't exactly call this a Buffy-era invention either. The 1931 Dracula movie with Bela Lugosi involved a wooden stake, and that has been the norm ever since. Although Van Helsing doesn't state that it is a wooden stake, it seems to have solidified the myth of a wooden stake in that scene. At least, I grew up "knowing" that it had to be a wooden stake, and that was long before Buffy came along.
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LONG before Buffy, the wooden stake was considered the norm. Consider in Palladium Fantasy RPG, published in 1980, required the stake to be of wood for its mystical grounding significance. Buffy the Vampire Slayer didn't come out until 1992, and even then, the stakes, though wood, were never specifically mentioned that they HAD to be wood.

The wooden stake has been the most common available type of stake for centuries, so logically the wooden stake would have been the default weapon of choice.
 
I bow to the superior vampire knowledge on display here! I remember now that I was thinking mainly of "Dracula's Guest" re the iron stakes and Stoker - the tomb in that has one through the lid/roof of it. Wood of course makes more sense as a portable "weapon", and you're quite right that it's described in "Dracula" itself:

a round wooden stake, some two and a half or three inches thick
and about three feet long. One end of it was hardened by charring in
the fire, and was sharpened to a fine point.
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It does get on my nerves that the Buffy/Angel (and the silver ones in the Blade movies for that matter) stakes are so short and that they can be pushing into the chest so readily, even by those not endowed with any super-strength. Quite different from bashing away with a lump-hammer on one of the above!

I've been meaning to get back into reading up on the folklore for a while now; is it worth getting hold of Montague Summers' book? I'd also like to track down a copy of the Bill Ellis article in "Folklore" journal about the Highgate shenanigans as well, but can't find a run of that publication nearby and don't have access to JSTOR. Any tips?
 
Big Les said:
Fair enough, by implication it's been the wooden stake for a long time. But I'm pretty sure Buffy has set that in stone by stating that it has to be wooden and no other material. Ultraviolet and others have as well of course, I suppose because culturally it was already "set" in our minds.
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I can point to many refferences before buffy that specified wood, the ones coming to mind are gaming references, but wood was established before buffy came out, either the movie or the series.
 
The Vampire said:
No. Dracula is killed with Quincy Morris' bowie knife. Lucy, with a wooden stake.

Metal stakes are mentioned in folklore, but wooden stakes were more commonly used in Eastern Europe. Ash was the preferred wood as well as, juniper buckthorn, whitethorn and hawthorn. Then the head was severed from the body, turned backward and the body re-interred. Or just simply burnt.

The vampire in folklore was never pale. It had a ruddy complexion, could move about day or night. It was not forever young as it continued to rot and was blamed for plagues.

Muslim gypsies living in what was once Yugoslavia believed melons and pumpkins could turn into vampires if kept to long. The term for those was mullo. The "turned' vegetables would roll after people growling.

Of course, the vampire lifestylists forget these things...
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How do they feel about counting mustard seeds?
 
Big Les said:
I bow to the superior vampire knowledge on display here! I remember now that I was thinking mainly of "Dracula's Guest" re the iron stakes and Stoker - the tomb in that has one through the lid/roof of it. Wood of course makes more sense as a portable "weapon", and you're quite right that it's described in "Dracula" itself:



It does get on my nerves that the Buffy/Angel (and the silver ones in the Blade movies for that matter) stakes are so short and that they can be pushing into the chest so readily, even by those not endowed with any super-strength. Quite different from bashing away with a lump-hammer on one of the above!
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This is adressed in From Dusk Til Dawn. there they point out that vampires are soft and it is easier to shove sharp objects into their hearts.
 
ponderingturtle said:
I can point to many refferences before buffy that specified wood, the ones coming to mind are gaming references, but wood was established before buffy came out, either the movie or the series.
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Yes, "point" taken, thank you. I've explained where my misconception about iron stakes came from (Stoker's short story "Dracula's Guest"). The more I think about it the less sense it makes that iron would have been used even for transfixing purposes, when wood is more readily available and more easily worked.

As for the "soft vampires" retrospective rationalisation for easy stakings, that (as well as the entire movie) was someone tongue-in-cheek. It could apply to the traditional "walking corpse" style vampires I suppose.

Getting back on track, I think its interesting how the site-maker goes to great lengths to "dispel the myths" surrounding fictitious vampires, and pushes the idea that "they" are suffering from some sort of disorder: And then goes on to list traits of exactly those vampires (enhanced strength, speed, vision, sharper teeth etc). Also that despite decrying the "popular misconceptions" spread by books and movies, they clearly love those products just as much as any more sane vampire fan might. It's pretty contradictory.
 
Ooh, this is good. The examples they use in this 1914 article (assuming it's faithfully transcribed) seem to point to sleep-paralysis/lucid dreaming as a factor in belief in vampires. I'm sure this factor's been discussed before, but I don't remember having read about it.
 
Big Les said:
Ooh, this is good. The examples they use in this 1914 article (assuming it's faithfully transcribed) seem to point to sleep-paralysis/lucid dreaming as a factor in belief in vampires. I'm sure this factor's been discussed before, but I don't remember having read about it.
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I think it was also in Vampires, Burial, and Death: Folklore and Reality by Paul Barber, but I could be wrong. I'd have to go look up my copy. (Yes I have a whole library full of such tomes.) :D
 
I think the phenomena is largely associated with pheromone signaling, which may have an actual connection to sexual vitality; of course, like everything in human experience, it's romanticised. You may have heard women say: "I just want to jump on him and eat him up", although that particular person wasn't attractive to another. Men have this same odd "consumption" impulse as well when, for lack of a better term, the signals "match".
 
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