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Reading the Bible for Yourself

gabeygoat said:
Agreed. If read in a literal sense, it seems that God is a confused old man.
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I believe it was the book God: A biography that stated that God wanders through the Bible like he's succumbing to Alzheimer's.

At first he's very active, if forgetful. Then he wanders off for long periods and is surprised by what he finds when he returns. Then he stops really doing anything and just talks to people. Slowly, he falls silent. By the end, people talk about him. Then they stop doing even that.
 
Brian-M said:
Interesting, I had to go look that up...

That's not exactly an abortion, but a curse which happens to cause bitter suffering and a swollen abdomen (and possibly permanent infertility if I'm reading it right) in addition to miscarriage. But it only works (or is supposed to work) if she actually has been unfaithful. If she hasn't been, the curse won't affect her.

ETA: But I suppose it is one of several passages that clearly indicates that the Biblical God isn't on the side of the pro-life movement.
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Not sure why you wouldn't consider inducing a miscarriage an abortion. And yes, they did mean permanent infertility... early eugenics, I suppose.
 
Brian-M said:
That's not exactly an abortion, but a curse which happens to cause bitter suffering and a swollen abdomen (and possibly permanent infertility if I'm reading it right) in addition to miscarriage. But it only works (or is supposed to work) if she actually has been unfaithful. If she hasn't been, the curse won't affect her.

ETA: But I suppose it is one of several passages that clearly indicates that the Biblical God isn't on the side of the pro-life movement.
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I had a Rabbi that interpreted this and several other passages as meaning the exact opposite of what they say. This "curse" won't cause infertility or an abortion or anything. He reasoned that God knew that. Thus, this was intended to strengthen marital relationships. The punishment for infidelity was so ludicrous that husbands would be ashamed to try to invoke it. And those who weren't ashamed would see "proof" that their wives had been faithful.

This was his interpretation of the direction to stone delinquent children to death. No parents would actually want their child murdered by the entire town. By making the punishment so ridiculous, it kept parents from complaining and forced them to deal with the issue themselves.

I'm not saying this is the correct interpretation, nor am I saying that it's any more morally defensible or logically sound than taking those passages literally. I'm just saying that this was the position of my Rabbi.
 
Loss Leader said:
I had a Rabbi that interpreted this and several other passages as meaning the exact opposite of what they say. This "curse" won't cause infertility or an abortion or anything. He reasoned that God knew that. Thus, this was intended to strengthen marital relationships. The punishment for infidelity was so ludicrous that husbands would be ashamed to try to invoke it. And those who weren't ashamed would see "proof" that their wives had been faithful.

This was his interpretation of the direction to stone delinquent children to death. No parents would actually want their child murdered by the entire town. By making the punishment so ridiculous, it kept parents from complaining and forced them to deal with the issue themselves.

I'm not saying this is the correct interpretation, nor am I saying that it's any more morally defensible or logically sound than taking those passages literally. I'm just saying that this was the position of my Rabbi.
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IOW he said god was a liar.

He also badly miscalculated human nature.
 
Mister Earl said:
Not sure why you wouldn't consider inducing a miscarriage an abortion.
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A. The miscarriage seems to be simply a side-effect of the curse.
B. An abortion is effective regardless of whether or not the woman has been secretly unfaithful to her husband
 
tsig said:
IOW he said god was a liar.

He also badly miscalculated human nature.
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It was an interesting interpretation. I wish I had been old enough to challenge him on the more problematic moral and just-plain-technical aspects.
 
GT/CS said:
Aw, you missed it. That's a song by Joan Osborne.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZEO1Lug25s
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Oh, no worries! I got it the first time around, and the song has been stuck in my head since then. THANKS JERK! =]


Also, thanks to all the book and link suggestions y'all! I ordered some of the books from my library. I don't have my bible with me, but I'm assuming it's King James. I'm stoked to learn about the pre-translated version. Also, good to know about the no capital letters thing.
 
here's a bit more


Third Day
God gathers the water into one place, creating land. This is reasonable enough. The dry land is named Earth. The wet stuff is called the Sea. Then (according to Genesis 1 but not 2) He creates grass, herbs, and fruiting trees.
Fourth Day
More Firmament! He creates “lights” in the firmament. These are to divide day from night, though He already did that earlier. They are also for “…signs and seasons, and for days and years.” There are two great lights (the sun and the moon, though the moon really just reflects light) and a buncha stars.
 
Mister Earl said:
I disagree. Numbers 5 is pretty illuminating. There's a section detailing how a woman, presumed to be unfaithful, may be given an abortion. By a priest. In a church.
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Yes but it's a magic abortion.
 
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So, I realize it's probably boring to read just my interpretations, but I encourage everyone to post their own!

Next bit


Fifth Day
Creates flying animals. Most specifically birds. Who knows about bats and whatnot? He also creates fishy wishies. Pretty uneventful day otherwise.
Sixth Day
Land animals. The Earth brings forward cattle, creeping things, beasts, and I guess dinosaurs. Then He makes peeps! He either uses the ‘royal We’ or has some companions, as he says, “Let US make man in OUR image, according to OUR likeness. Key point, in this version of Genesis, he creates …”Male and Female, He Created them.” Keep that in mind.
 
Loss Leader said:
I believe it was the book God: A biography that stated that God wanders through the Bible like he's succumbing to Alzheimer's.

At first he's very active, if forgetful. Then he wanders off for long periods and is surprised by what he finds when he returns. Then he stops really doing anything and just talks to people. Slowly, he falls silent. By the end, people talk about him. Then they stop doing even that.
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Hmm, I've never read that book, but I've taken the piss on the forum along the same lines before. I mean, it seems pretty obvious to me that when you look at it, you kinda get:

God, circa 2000 BCE: Spoiled teenage nerd God, probably a bit autistic too, and not the good kind of that. Creates a universe just because he can. Has zero empathy or consideration for anyone else's opinions or feelings. Seriously doesn't 'get' girls, and doesn't get along with children. Is arrogant and strongly opinionated about everything. I mean, really, he has disproportionately strong opinions about even stuff like wearing mixed fibers, eating lobster or whether you can make a sculpture, and won't hesitate to give everyone rules about it. At the slightest questioning, disagreement or just things not going his way, he flies off the handle in a major way and will even want the perp killed, his town obliterated, and even their cattle killed, and their pre-teen daughters raped. Even the people he was calling his bestest buddies a couple of messages before, he wants them sold into slavery at the slightest disagreement. I'm sure we've all run into deranged fanboys like that on some board or another ;)

God, circa 1 CE: mid-life crisis God. Bones a girl MUCH younger than himself, tries to pass for a much younger guy (Jesus), reinvents himself, changes his mind about everything, ditches his old best buddies for not being down with his new image.

God, circa 2000 CE: Alzheimer's God. Just about everyone who managed to talk to him and hear an answer, got something extremely crazy from him. All he ever does any more is stamp his face in other people's food... and at least in one dog's butt. Presumably right before the nurse drags him off to clean him and give him his medication.
 
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HansMustermann said:
God, circa 2000 BCE: Spoiled teenage nerd God, probably a bit autistic too, and not the good kind of that. Creates a universe just because he can. Has zero empathy or consideration for anyone else's opinions or feelings. Seriously doesn't 'get' girls, and doesn't get along with children. Is arrogant and strongly opinionated about everything. I mean, really, he has disproportionately strong opinions about even stuff like wearing mixed fibers, eating lobster or whether you can make a sculpture, and won't hesitate to give everyone rules about it. At the slightest questioning, disagreement or just things not going his way, he flies off the handle in a major way and will even want the perp killed, his town obliterated, and even their cattle killed, and their pre-teen daughters raped. Even the people he was calling his bestest buddies a couple of messages before, he wants them sold into slavery at the slightest disagreement. I'm sure we've all run into deranged fanboys like that on some board or another ;)

God, circa 1 CE: mid-life crisis God. Bones a girl MUCH younger than himself, tries to pass for a much younger guy (Jesus), reinvents himself, changes his mind about everything, ditches his old best buddies for not being down with his new image.

God, circa 2000 CE: Alzheimer's God. Just about everyone who managed to talk to him and hear an answer, got something extremely crazy from him. All he ever does any more is stamp his face in other people's food... and at least in one dog's butt. Presumably right before the nurse drags him off to clean him and give him his medication.
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Needs a title... A Short and Readable OT and NT...
 
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